Monday, March 30, 2009

HATE BLOGS – OR, WHAT MOST OF US LEFT BEHIND IN THE EIGHTH GRADE

The mods here have hesitated to talk about this – we’ve considered it for a while. We know people talk about us. We talk about people, too – here and occasionally in emails. I tend to disbelieve people who claim that they never talk about others. This isn’t about “how dare anyone say anything about us! How can they be so mean?!” That would be pretty hypocritical at this point, I think.

But there’s a blog that’s existed almost as long as GDNNOP whose sole purpose is to “snark” on us. No, I’m not going to give out the name or the URL – it’s not my job to give exhibitionistic mean girls access to more attention.

Do I care? Yes and no. Most of the time, they are easy enough to ignore. They have the right to their opinions, and the fact that they’ve chosen to express those opinions in such an ugly way and in public, so to speak, says far more about them than it does about anyone else, whether they realize it or not (I’m quite sure they don’t).

Yet occasionally info makes its way to me that is a tad aggravating. Speculation becomes opinion becomes fact (sound familiar?). I’ve been accused of posting over there under another name, and it’s apparently become canon, in spite of the fact that I’ve never posted there in my life and have no desire to.

What makes this blog different or worse than other Gosselin-related blogs? Well, I don’t know that I think it’s worse ; the focus is different. At GWOP and a couple of other blogs I can think of, the mods make it a point to assert that they don’t talk about GDNNOP over there; why do we talk about them over here? That question has been asked and answered a number of times, to the point that I think the various sockpuppets have (finally!) gotten tired of asking. But the fact is that they haven’t needed to talk about GDNNOP on their blogs because they’ve had their “other blog” all along in which they call out, insult and lie about their “enemies” with impunity. It’s such an obvious (and cowardly, especially because they all use different names over there) way of “keeping their hands clean”.

What makes them objectionable? Calling out people who post on other sites by name. Constant accusations of sockpuppeting (I believe that’s what the psychiatric community calls “projection”, because I’m pretty damn sure every regular there has a drawer full of socks, one or more for every one of the many sites they post on). Constant put downs and personal insults, again often directed at specific, named individuals. Anyone who doesn’t agree with them is stupid and/or crazy. Do I think some anti-Gosselinites are one or both? Yes. Do I think they all are? No. I think if there’s any one trait that characterizes the rabid anti-Gosselinite, it’s not IQ or income or education level or even the number of cats they have. I think it’s a tendency towards extreme self-righteousness and the desire, even need, to feel better than other people as well as the tendency to spend far more time dwelling on other people’s perceived faults than on self-improvement.)

What about you? Have you ever encountered “mean girls” online or bullies online, either those who directed their hate at you or at others? How did you feel about it? Did you care, or did you believe, as my mother always told me, that one should not pay much attention to the opinions of those for who one cannot have any respect?

"I have never made but one prayer to God, a very short one: 'O Lord, make my enemies ridiculous.' And God granted it." - Voltaire

202 comments:

1 – 200 of 202   Newer›   Newest»
SamanthaNC said...

Wait. You mean there's a blog full of bitchy women whose main goal is to mock this one? I had no idea! Shocking.

Do we know if they're actually women? I'm thinking they could be prepubescent girls with raging hormones whose mothers don't monitor there internet use.

Oh no! What if they copy/paste and BOLD my comments? I don't know if I could stand that, I mean, it might really hurt my feelings. *Tear* How would I go on?

Nina Bell said...

Yes the very women who cry foul over the Princess Board's thread about GWoP. Oh my!

By the way I have been accused of being a member of the Princess Boards. I am not but I do feel they have some very talented writers.

I have also been accused of being an ex mod at GWoP. That is too funny. I didn't even know what TWoP was when I started this blog. I am sure that Serena, Sharla and Maggie get a big kick out of that one.

Liza Beth said...

I guess my perspective is that people can say whatever they want about my opinions. You are more than welcome to disagree, and I am definitely game to discuss as adults the way we each think and either stalemate, or one of us realize we were wrong. That is great and the goal of this blog as well as some others. I draw the line at personal attacks and bringing completely outside the issue points into the topic.

For example, there have been numerous times that my family (whom I have discussed on off topic posts or used as a way of expressing why I would have some information i.e. how speaker's love offerings work) has been brought up by others with a negative intent. Say what you want about me and the things I say, but no one has the right to drag a person's family or outside life into these discussions. That is so wrong and, as the post states, says way more about the way these people actually are in their heart than they realize.

That is why I stay out of it. I don't visit sites besides ours and the Princess boards. People email me information which I skim over and then file away. I just think that there is way too much going on in life now to focus on the negativity. My life has enough of that each day to start with, so I see no need to add to it!! I feel like for me it is a huge piece of the Gosselin situation that is unnecessary. If people really care about the kids and how they are treated, then what possible good can come from bashing other posters personally or having blogs set up for the express reason that they do not like someone they have never met (and most likely will never meet)? Nothing good can come from that. And having a good outcome is not the point from what I can tell. I am really not sure *what* the point is, so if anyone has a clue it would be great to know.

And, for the record, as I have said before if anyone ever has something they want to say to me my personal email address is listed on this site. Nothing stops you from emailing me with all of your thoughts in a respectful manner. But what is the fun in that, eh?

Nina Bell said...

Well I agree with Guin that they have a right to their opinions. I actually think this particular blog gives more insight about the actual posters there than anyone posting here.

debbie said...

you mention them alot more than they mention you! infact i never heard them bring you up, this blog was made just to snark on gwop

Fanny said...

Didn't they start that blog because they thought we talked about gwop too much?

How can anyone blame a person for making fun of gwop? It's just too damn easy. It's a group of women who hate Kate Gosselin and yet seem to be obsessed with her. They know EVERYTHING about her and talk about her all day long. They say they want the show off the air but when it does end they'll still be over there going on and on about what they THINK Kate is doing and there will be hundreds of posts from people who claim to have seen her out somewhere and how they only smiled at her and got punched in the face(by Kate or her bodyguard). It's just so damn funny, and they are dead serious.

MommyZinger said...

I think its funny that they never use their blogger ids. I assume that they have ids they use on other blogs, so why hide. I mean, if you feel you've been wronged somehow, wouldn't you want people to know who you are? The only reason I can think of is because they are embarrassed by their behaviour. And they should be. That is, if they are grown women.

I am just fascinated by peoples online behaviour and I wonder what they are like in real life. Are they really that immature or are they only like that online? What purpose does it serve? It's pretty sad if it makes them feel better. Is it stress relief? Workout, then. Is it just entertaining? Well, then they need to get some better hobbies.

merryway said...

At first, all this blog warring reminded me of the old joke about being a member of the KISS army. “What were they gonna do? Attack Abba fans?” (insert canned laugh). But all along, I can't believe what those people do and say against others. All for their cause of attacking J&K. It's such a personal vendetta to them. I agree w/ “what most of us left behind in 8th grade”. It's hard to believe they're adults instead of one of those juvenile cliques attacking each other for wearing the wrong clothes. I also think it is sockpuppet city over there.

They also have the impression that a “fair and balanced blog” means that irrational and viscous opinions should be voiced here. Free speech is a wonderful thing and we all know we have to tolerate hate groups getting in on that right. But it doesn't have to be acceptable here. I appreciate and enjoy “grown up” and respectful discussion on GDNOP. The mods and posters here have earned my respect in the way they have handled the situations and the stuff thrown at them.

Fanny, that is too funny.

Mommyzinger, I also am fascinated and wonder the same things about their real life. Is it some sort of therapy, inet road rage, is this how they react to anyone who differs w/their opinion? To me, it seems they get a kick of hating and the things they say and do are there little thrills on which they get off.

SamanthaNC said...

P.S. One of the anonymous little mousies copied (gasp*) my comment in the Kates hair post, she didn't "get" the fact that I was being sarcastic. Apparently anything above a knock-knock joke is over her head. I hope she didn't hurt herself "ROFLing".

GLO said...

I was not aware there were hate blogs directed here. I remember way back there was a site that had pigs on it mocking this one, but I was under the impression it was basically a one-time deal. O.K...

Now I have to wonder if any of my comments have been snarked on, and if so, was the snarking any good? I love me some good snark.

Whatever--life is not a popularity contest. I have no intention of letting the negative opinions of others, whom I don't even know on a personal level, affect me. I am sure many of you who post here feel the same.

merryway said...

Samnc, Anything and everything is contorted to suit their needs.
I never did thank Nomo for defending me. Thanks Nomo, it was appreciated.

Saint said...

OK, everyone take a deep breath. I am about to do something very frightening. I have tissues handy, if you need one. You may feel a little scared, but, I promise, it won't be more than a little bee sting.

I am going to gently lift some of your comments out of your posts and, using sterile html codes, make them appear bolder than the rest of the type. I will respond to them. You will imagine you are being dissected, but really, you are not. Don't wet your pants. Don't run away. Keep reading. Relax, it will be over shortly.

Do we know if they're actually women?
At least one is a man.

By the way I have been accused of being a member of the Princess Boards.

Lucky you! The Princess Gwop board is snark done right. Keep reading to see who I have been accused of being. :(

For example, there have been numerous times that my family (whom I have discussed on off topic posts or used as a way of expressing why I would have some information i.e. how speaker's love offerings work) has been brought up by others with a negative intent. Say what you want about me and the things I say, but no one has the right to drag a person's family or outside life into these discussions.

Do you mean exploiting a child by using his photo for the purpose of exacting some online revenge? Now what good mother would do a thing like that? Or are you referring to a Christian who demanded that you account to your father for your opinion? Surely, that's just polite posting!

It's just so damn funny, and they are dead serious.
ITA!

I mean, if you feel you've been wronged somehow, wouldn't you want people to know who you are?
Well, one calls herself "stayinganon" and actually waited days to finally correct the assertion that she was "Saint." Thanks, stayinganon. Very nice of you to "drag me into this" as you said.

The mods and posters here have earned my respect in the way they have handled the situations and the stuff thrown at them.

Merryway, well said! Guinevere takes so much @#$& for HTML codies for heaven's sake! I just don't understand why anyone would admit to being bothered by having someone disagree with you in any forum for opposing views.

marci said...

I have been reading or participating in the online discussion about the Gosselins for a year now. I'm not sure if that qualifies me as a veteran or not. I can't believe it's been that long, frankly.

Honestly, the only reason it's held my interest this long is that there were two blogs, where I started (not GWOP) and GDNNOP, where I found a community of people I enjoyed discussing various topics, not JUST the Gosselins.

From what I've observed in the Gosselin blogging world, there are blogs that openly declare their slant on the show, positive or negative, and, quite logically, tend to have more posters with views that match the "theme" of the blog.

Once a community of posters is established at these blogs, it's a little harder for a newcomer to jump in the conversation without being looked at twice, because....let's face it...there ARE trolls who stop by, say everyone is wrong for having their opinions, and often don't say (babble) much more than the "party" line; for example, "expoiting children, cuts off balls, lies and inconsistencies". (To be fair, I've seen the same thing happen from the opposing camp..."you'd take the money if you were offered a show, you couldn't do it with 8 kids, Kate's a supermom, etc.)

I think GDNNOP has done as well as is probably possible in the Gosselin fray. It's hard to keep things perfectly balanced when the mods are continually contending with an onslaught of obvious troll posts and posts that express an opinion with troll-like insults liberally mixed in. I'm guessing the mods would LOVE to read more actual opinion posts, sans colorful language and descriptive narrative.

Then some "new" posters show up who might actually want to get their point across, but have a problem with being disagreed with, debated with, not treated with kid gloves. I usually try to give a new poster who appears to be sincere a chance to express their opinions. But if it quickly degenerates to someone who just wants to come over here and repeat for the upteenth time the anti-Gosselin mantra, there's not much point engaging them any further.

In my opinion, the posters who have come here who dislike the style of debating here and seem oblivious to the fact that there ARE differing viewpoints expressed here and then run off to complain at other sites, aren't really coming here because they want to engage with intelligence and wit with an opposing view.

I think they really don't get that there is a possibility that they are not 100% in the right. I think they really don't get we're (a presumptive "we") not willing to accept rumor, innuendo and subjective observations as fact; and that their interpretations of "words out of the Gosselins mouths" are just that...their interpretations, and we're not obliged to adopt them as gospel.

I think it's pretty evident those who came to debate but felt "run off" or "ganged up on" didn't have the strength of their convictions to stand up for what they believed in. It was much simpler to run to the safety of the "yes" men, where they can be reassured over and over that they must be right because, "Here are others who agree with me no matter what I say."

There are certainly regular posters here who have differing views than mine, state so, and I value their insight even if I don't always agree. I think the "regulars" here get along because they can see beyond what side someone falls on in the Gosselin debate.

Liza Beth said...

Saint, you are awesome :). Yes, that is exactly what I meant. It is also amusing to me how on other sites people have used the fact that I am getting my MBA against me. I mean, you would think they had never met anyone who decided to go back to school after a few years away.

GLO, if you are looking for 'good' snark then Princess is where to check. They really are hilarious with the things they write and I am always amused at how they take the really hateful things others choose to do and just laugh at them. I have had numerous times in all this blogging where I was about to just email Nina and say "Yep I'm done-- see you guys outside of the blog world" but chose not to. If you guys knew half the comments we do not post (or half the things we get emailed) then it would make a huge difference in seeing just how hateful some people can be. So while I can do nothing to change who they are as people, or encourage them to take a closer look at their own lives before ransacking mine, I can just do my part to make sure I have peace with my own decisions.

marci said...

Saint said...
Merryway, well said! Guinevere takes so much @#$& for HTML codies for heaven's sake! I just don't understand why anyone would admit to being bothered by having someone disagree with you in any forum for opposing views.


There you go, Saint....HTML'd you. Take that!

Very well said, and a point I'll never understand.

Really? Why do they care that much about what anyone else thinks about their opinions? Does the whole world have to acknowledge they're right or they'll never be happy?

I really think they can't get over that we don't give a rat's ass what they think about us or our views.

Liza Beth said...

Marci, I completely agree with everything you said. Hope that doesn't make me a 'yes' man :). It is blatantly obvious when people are here just to stir the pot and cause trouble. We have had a tough time here and there discerning who the legitimate posters are verses the trolls here to feel better about themselves, but I know the regular posters are aware and thankful that we try to keep things pretty tidied up here.

That being said, we have nothing against new posters. I know Eileen is newer and we have a few others that are back and forth occasionally. At this point it is definitely tougher to enter the fray, but that is a natural byproduct of having mud thrown our way for so long.

Guinevere said...

They also have the impression that a “fair and balanced blog” means that irrational and viscous opinions should be voiced here.

The only thing "fair and balanced" has EVER meant was that we allow both sides to be posted, assuming they meet posting guidelines (i.e. are not trolling). Unfortunately, a lot of anti-Gosselin posters simply can't play nice. Their arguments lack substance so they go for the personal attack. Even so, it's not like we reject posts left and right. I am more than happy to post any semi-intelligent, non-trolling anti-Gosselin post.

"Fair and balanced" never meant that the various mods and posters did not have opinions on the Gosselins, or that those opinions were evenly distributed among the anti- and the pro-. I'm obviously more pro, though I don't worship/adore/idolize Kate or any of the Gosselins as I'm accused of doing. Nina is more neutral and honestly cares more about having a place where both POVs can be heard than she does about the Gosselins. Some posters are more anti-Gosselin, and that's perfectly fine.

Now I have to wonder if any of my comments have been snarked on, and if so, was the snarking any good? I love me some good snark.

From what I've seen, it's pretty low level. They don't hold a candle to the Princess boards, where there are some truly funny women (of course, IMO, they have better material to work with). When I said 8th grade, I meant it. You know how snotty pre-teen girls would try to make others feel bad about the brand of shoes they wear? It's at that level. Lots of contempt and little substance. Also, there appears to be a lot of patting themselves on the back about how much more intelligent they are. That's a quality I've noticed in a LOT of the more rabid anti-Gosselinites: they sure are not shy about praising themselves.

Liza Beth said...

In my last comment I meant to say "At times it is blatantly obvious when people are here just to stir the pot and cause trouble." Just wanted to clarify and fix that!!

SamanthaNC said...

I heart Saint

SamanthaNC said...

Oh I almost forgot Saint. You better be careful with your fancy html codes or Nina might use some of her mystical internet voo doo and capture your ip address.

marci said...

Liz said...
That being said, we have nothing against new posters. I know Eileen is newer and we have a few others that are back and forth occasionally. At this point it is definitely tougher to enter the fray, but that is a natural byproduct of having mud thrown our way for so long.


I did forget to mention posters who have been "new", including myself at one time, who have come in and stayed long enough to show the others here they're willing to stick by their opinions and respect the other posters. My point is they DO stick with it, even if they're not always agreed with.

Guinevere said...

Once a community of posters is established at these blogs, it's a little harder for a newcomer to jump in the conversation without being looked at twice

I hate to say it, but this *is* true for me, a bit. I mean, if someone posts and they seem respectful (whatever their POV), I treat them with respect. But I am suspicious because in my experience the MO of a small group of women from "the other side" is to play little games, post under different names constantly, seem innocuous but see if they can get little digs in...in short, these posters just aren't acting in good faith. It's made me a bit gunshy of strangers, and I don't want to be that way, because I think it's great to have new people here.

because....let's face it...there ARE trolls who stop by, say everyone is wrong for having their opinions, and often don't say (babble) much more than the "party" line; for example, "expoiting children, cuts off balls, lies and inconsistencies". (To be fair, I've seen the same thing happen from the opposing camp..."you'd take the money if you were offered a show, you couldn't do it with 8 kids, Kate's a supermom, etc.)

I do see the latter, though less. And I can only speak for myself, but I've often publicly disagreed with all of those stances - I don't think everyone would take the money if offered it, I don't think it's helpful to "plead 8" as they used to say back in the day, and I don't think Kate's a supermom, at all. In fact, I hate the very idea of "supermoms" and have said so. Damn, it's not a competition. Being a good mom is not so different from being a good person, and that's what we all should be striving for, right?

Anya said...

"SamanthaNC said...I heart Saint"

Me too! So clever and on target.

The consternation caused by some posters using HTML coding (as an attempt to communicate clearer) has been a thing to behold.

As an aside, I do have to marvel at some of the posters who complained about the use of HTML and later adopted it themselves on other blogs. Unfortunately, HTML used improperly can make one harder to understand. And some posters have proven that point.

Marci and Lizabeth have made many of the points I was going to make. If there one thing I would say to our critics it is: please understand it is often difficult to (at first) to distinguish between trolls and posters who are interested in honest dialogue. (This is the one area where I actually do feel sympathy for the GWoP moderators too).

Also, just because the majority of posters here might disagree with your opinion or may occasionally question *how* you came to your conclusions, does not mean we are trying to shoo you away...

merryway said...

marci said...
Liz said...
That being said, we have nothing against new posters. I know Eileen is newer and we have a few others that are back and forth occasionally. At this point it is definitely tougher to enter the fray, but that is a natural byproduct of having mud thrown our way for so long.

I did forget to mention posters who have been "new", including myself at one time, who have come in and stayed long enough to show the others here they're willing to stick by their opinions and respect the other posters. My point is they DO stick with it, even if they're not always agreed with.


I was one of those who felt slapped by their first post. I had no idea of blog etiquette (I had the thought that these were more like message boards) and no idea that trolls existed. I felt so offended. A few minutes later, I was so embarrassed by my reaction. Around that time, there was a post w/accusations about Nina having board ads to make money and a parody of Wicked w/ Aunt Jodie. I just couldn't figure it all out. They didn't mention GDNOP on GWOP, but it finally started clicking that those posters were really really serious and not just making glib comments. I was just beginning to realize I wasn't watching a real time documentary. (perhaps five years of no cable and watching it all in a marathon wasn't the best way to make judgment) :) Before that, I was so so concerned because who knows how parents are? With shows like Kid Nation and Baby Swap you just never know. Over and over again I had to come back for all the intelligent conversation while things started falling into place. Now, it's really a fun past-time and again I thank the mods for all the work and the crap you put up with to make it happen. I enjoy the “for real” new posters. If you feel a little sting, it's def worth it to let it roll off and stay around. The mods here have been falsey accused of many things and trolls are sometimes rampant. I expect the mods will have to deal w/a few of them today.

Saint, that was really good and I'm still chuckling. I heart you too.

Nina Bell said...

SamanthaNC,

Yes I capture all of the IP addresses and I hold them all in an internet prison camp. Never to be released and allowed to go home.

CincyMom said...

Why did NC Resident get so hacked off anyway? I thought we had a few good back-and-forths.

Everyone has always been respectful of my points. I actually have tried harder to be concise because of the higher level of writing on here. People (including me) get lazy writing on computers and that has made the world a little sloppier. I thank all here who remind me to try to work a littler harder.

I came here after reading GWoP for a while and then being disenchanted after the whole PM thing. I don't remember all the nastiness back when I used to post. Once PM was gone, any posts I made asking what was going on and then other comments about the show (you know, the whole reason the site started anyway) were never accepted, never responded to.

Now, it is like a low-brow tabloid. I find it interesting how they've taken it to another level with their little piggy site. (only have looked at it twice, half a year ago and today) And they don't even use their normal names. I wonder, too, if they are a bunch of 14-year-old girls or something......

GLO said...

Liza Beth and Guinevere--
I frequently read the Princess boards' GWOP pages. I haven't actually been to GWOP in ages, but I keep up with the insanity through those fabulous people who snark so well there. I often laugh out-loud over some of their commentary.

Sigh--it is such a shame that those who want to mock us are apparently not as talented. I am always up for a good laugh.

marci said...

Nina said...

SamanthaNC,

Yes I capture all of the IP addresses and I hold them all in an internet prison camp. Never to be released and allowed to go home.


Unless we offend your delicate sensibilities and question your dictatorial control over all things intelligent, witty and respectful, and then you'll post all our personal email and IP address information for all the world to see to demean and humiliate and humble because you MUST BE OBEYED AND WORSHIPPED....

wait....

sorry....wrong blog. ;)

Eileen said...

I can't speak for any other new (or old) posters to this blog, but for myself, I think everyone knows I am not a Gosselin fan. I chose to stop watching the show a few seasons ago. And while I do not hate Jon and Kate, if you go back and read my posts I don't think I have ever, ever defended them (I'm not positive about that but I don't think I've ever defended them). Even though I don't watch the show anymore I do throw my opinion in every now and then about something I may have read about them or something another poster wrote. I have never felt discriminated against for my non-fan opinion (I'm not going to say my 'anti opinion', because in my opinion I don't think I am 'anti', although some of you might disagree with that).
I can only speak for myself and I must say that my treatment on this forum has been fair.

Oh, one other thing, I didn't really find it all that hard to jump in here, I felt welcome.

Guinevere said...

you mention them alot more than they mention you! infact i never heard them bring you up, this blog was made just to snark on gwop

Do you mean that we mention GWOP more than GWOP mentions us? Yes, that's true, because they have this other blog where they dissect our posts. They don't need to do it on GWOP.

Anyway, I've never understood why it matters if one blog talks about another and another doesn't. As long as we're being fair and not lying, what is wrong with talking about GWOP?

Your second comment is one I'd like to address, because it's a lie or misstatement that gets repeated quite a bit. Nina can speak for herself as to why she started this blog, but I certainly don't think it was created just to "snark" on GWOP. Do we criticize them? Yes, sometimes - sometimes seriously and sometimes sarcastically. Do we talk about other stuff? If you look around, I don't see how you can claim we don't (in fact, this is something we've recently been criticized for - apparently we're tacitly admitting defeat in the Gosselin wars by bringing up other subjects. Ooo-kay, then).

To say that all we do over here is sit around and talk about GWOP is ridiculous.

GWOP is just one site, anyway, and it's symptomatic of a larger issue I've seen, which is online communities devoted to hating a particular celebrity. From what I've seen, these are usually almost-all women groups dedicated to "snarking" on almost exclusively female celebrities. I have never watched Rachael Ray's shows, but I watched from afar how absolutely crazy she seemed to make some women, and a lot of the stuff you see directed at Kate Gosselin I saw directed at RR (for instance, I remember reading about a campaign among haters to deface Triscuit boxes that featured RR - anyone remember the "post-its on 'Multiple Blessings'" business from a few months ago?).

To me, the larger issues are worth discussing. Whether it's okay to film your children is worth discussing. Whether we as women are too hard on other women is worth discussing. How long it took Kate Gosselin to clean a fridge is...well, I won't say it's not worth discussing, because IIRC, I did discuss it. But it's not worth getting OUTRAGED about, that's for sure.

The hate site seems to think that they are the standard for intelligent discussion. That just blows my mind. Anyone who disagrees with them is called delusional and stupid. They make stuff up constantly. For instance, the claim that any of us mods were GWOPpers at one time - as far as I know, and I know it with fairly strong certainty, that simply is not true.

So, from what I can see, it's the same women who make crap up about the Gosselins on other sites, using different names on their hate site and making up crap about us, instead. And then calling it intelligent discussion. To quote "The Princess Bride": I do not think that word means what you think it means.

merryway said...

Cincymom, NC admitted he was Search for Truth over at Moons. He had gone over and gave some slaps to GDNOP. It ticked me off because everyone had gone overboard to make him feel welcome and to try to be respectful of his opinions. He has also trolled Baby Mama for kicks. Nice guy, huh?
Eileen, you prob came in much nicer than me. I was just looking for info so I bluntly asked a loaded question about Aunt Jodi. I didn't even say hi or introduce myself. I had troll written all over me and was going to take my toys and go home.

Theresa said...

merryway said...
Samnc, Anything and everything is contorted to suit their needs.

____________
SamanthaNC said...
Apparently anything above a knock-knock joke is over her head.


How true Merryway and Sam! How true!!

Guin, I have been accused of being you on two different blogs. Let me say, that for me, that is a compliment. I admire your words. For you, I'm sorry :)

I believe most of us are talkig about the same blog. A few misfit rejects, or at least that's how they see themselves and I agree with them on that. The way I see it, they don't have as many interesting conversations and must see what we are talking about. Then, they rip it apart to make themselves feel good.

Eileen said...

I would not come to this site if it was only about Jon & Kate Plus 8, nor would I be here if it was only talking about other Gosselin sites (pro or con), I would have nothing to add, so I'm glad you have other subjects that interest me. In fact, when I first came here, I didn't even realize this site was a Gosselin site, I think I came into a discussion about Nadya Suleman, I thought this site was more of a 'current events' or 'human interest stories' type site.

Theresa said...

I must say that my treatment on this forum has been fair.

I totally agree Eileen! The mods here are the best.

Guinevere said...

Guin, I have been accused of being you on two different blogs. Let me say, that for me, that is a compliment. I admire your words. For you, I'm sorry :)

Aw, Theresa, I didn't mind at all! Except for it not being true. And not even being repeated as speculation, but as fact. Other than that, I am perfectly happy to be mistaken for you!

Oh, one other thing, I didn't really find it all that hard to jump in here, I felt welcome.

Well, I think that's a credit to you, Eileen. Even if you don't consider yourself "anti-Gosselin", you could serve as example to those who want to offer a different viewpoint (which again, we truly want. Really!) but don't go about it in a way that alienates people and makes them feel defensive.

Kikibee said...

Well, to me, this is sort of an inter-active internet soap opera.
I think people who are so nasty about celebs or posters they have never met are working out personal issues. With Kate I guess it's
"mommy" issues or "people who get lots of stuff they don't deserve when I don't" issues.

I started posting here (after lurking many places for many years)
during the Jodi/Julie stuff.
That whole idea of taking personal business online/in-laws gossiping
really bugged me, even though it hasn't happened to me (well, maybe the in-laws thing, just a little).
So that, and all the blasting of Kate because she doesn't fit into some perfect little mom mold compelled me to speak out in my own little way.

Plus, everyone here seems so nice and sensible. I'm not checking out that other place though. I'm not sure whether it's worse to be made fun of, or ignored!

CincyMom said...

Merryway--thanks for the answer. I always wonder how everyone knows so much more than me! HTML, avatars, IP addresses, it is all soooooo hard for me to catch up I feel like a 90-year-old who woke up to the internet world.

Or Kelly Ripa--she was having a hard time keeping up with a 5 or 6 yo boy today on the show with a technology contest!

Anya said...

Guinevere said... GWOP is just one site, anyway, and it's symptomatic of a larger issue I've seen, which is online communities devoted to hating a particular celebrity. From what I've seen, these are usually almost-all women groups dedicated to "snarking" on almost exclusively female celebrities. I have never watched Rachael Ray's shows, but I watched from afar how absolutely crazy she seemed to make some women, and a lot of the stuff you see directed at Kate Gosselin I saw directed at RR (for instance, I remember reading about a campaign among haters to deface Triscuit boxes that featured RR - anyone remember the "post-its on 'Multiple Blessings'" business from a few months ago?).

Wow. Still shaking my head at the Triscuit boxes thing. That is just sad and crazy - much like the post-it campaign.

My position: I like a little snark now and then, although the way I have seen it practiced by many of the detractors of the Gosselins it really leaves the realm of snark and ventures into pure hate and nastiness. That has never been my cup of tea. It's the same reason I don't read TWoP anymore. There are too many of those type of negative individuals over there too.

And I think the reason individuals like CincyMom and Eileen fit in so well (non-fans that they are) is two-fold:

* They are grown-ups. See Eileen's description of how she handled her initial entry into this blog. Same with CincyMom. CincyMom, in particular, (I think) still watches the show sometimes and has shared her concerns. Other posters have weighed in with a different opinion than hers and she hasn't lost it. She didn't take all her toys and go home. She handled it maturely. I really admire posters who aren't afraid to state their opinion even if it sometimes goes against the majority and will argue their POV respectfully without backing down. How refreshing.

*As a whole, I don't think this group likes to wallow (word use intentional) on the negative as much as some other blogs. We may be accused of having blinders on. Nothing could be further from the truth. Most of us have heard every accusation 100 times over and have formed our own opinion. In any case, whatever our opinion on the merits of the show, I think most of us prefer to spend a minimum of time on the negative and more time on encouraging or uplifting topics - Gosselin related or not.

My opinion is life is too short to hate a reality t.v. star or a cooking show personality you don't know.

Eileen said...

Oh, Merryway, I didn't know the first thing about these blogs (or blogs in general), and I didn't know there was a protocol. I just jumped in too, and I was really amazed that there was even such passion on both sides of the subject. I think that was the first thing I asked here, and I think I might have ruffled some feathers (I'm not sure), but I think more because my attitude was along the lines of "What is everyone making a big deal about?" and I think both sides would take offense to that as I'm rendering invalid people's opinions on both sides, and I realized that just because it was something I didn't have any feelings about didn't give me the right to think everyone should follow my line of thinking. (I'm sure I have passions that others wouldn't share.)
And then I just stayed here, I liked the idea of 'playing fair' and seriously, it has helped me to view a lot of scenarios in my life with an eye for balance.
My experience has been positive and I think it's helped me in other areas of my life.

Saint said...

Eileen said...
Oh, Merryway, I didn't know the first thing about these blogs (or blogs in general), and I didn't know there was a protocol.


Same here. I attacked Guinevere (not the other way around) and "Nina Bell" came to her defense. I thought, "who is this Nina Bell, anyway?" I might have even asked her what her problem was, or something like that! My feathers were ruffled, but I didn't run away to a mud pit to wallow in self-pity. It's not like I couldn't get my opinions posted.

Regarding NC Res, he was bashing this blog at another site under another screen name. Nina asked if they were his posts, and when he avoided answering, I asked him. He admitted it, so he was not sockpuppeting, just using another screen name. I wasn't upset that he posted elsewhere, or that he preferred another screen name for a different site. I took offense to what he said. He wasn't polite. I changed my happy face avatar to a frowny face avatar. Merryway scolded him too, for the NOT polite comments about us here at GDNNOP. He's never been back (except to lurk.)

Since then, I've followed his comments at other sites and sometimes I wonder if someone has hijacked his screen name. It doesn't always "sound" like him, KWIM?

Bella Donna said...

I don't post very much at all, but it's more my nature to read anyway.

I do read here, GWOP & the Princess boards quite often. And while I do respect the premises GWOP claims to have (child exploitation), it is really hard to take it seriously when so much of the blog revolves around Kate's material things, and HOW DARE she have so much! Because really....I don't care how many refrigerators they have, how often she goes to the spa or what brand of clothing they wear.

More than anything, the blogs fascinate me. I fail to see what it is about the Gosselins, and especially Kate, that gets so many worked up (not here, but other places online.) I see it more with the "anti Kate" group than those that love her, but I've seen extremes on both, and I cannot fathom why. What is it about this woman that is so polarizing to so many?

I guess, to me, Kate falls somewhere in the middle like most people. Would I want to be her BFF? No. Do I think she's really Adolf Hitler with spiky blonde hair? Nope. Like most of us, Kate has her good & her bad. Depending on who you talk to, this either makes me a sheeple of a jealous hater, lol.

I post here more than elsewhere because I like the more middle of the road vibe at this blog. I also like the offtopic discussions.

Eileen said...

I know right now this is a 'topic' subject, and I realize this is a Gosselin site, but I much prefer the off-topic subjects and I for one am glad there are a lot of them!
I told you how my family makes fun of me for being a fan of a Gosselin fan site while I'm not even a fan of the Gosselins! I keep telling them this site is so much more but they don't believe me! They keep saying, "Why don't you just start watching the show again?!" But while I have a desire to tune in here each day, I have no desire to tune into the show any longer.

Firebird said...

This is an interesting read, even though I don't understand much of what's going on.

I found this site doing a search one day (I wanted to see what town Jon and Kate were moving to). That other site came up first in line, so I clicked on it. It was quite an eye-opener. At first, some of the comments amused me, I was starting to tire of how Kate was treating Jon. But the more I read, the more disgusted and uncomfortable I got. It went beyond "light" snarking and into deep-seated hatred territory. The thing that stands out in my mind is the contradictory nature of "we just care about the kids!" Ok, then why are you saying such hateful things about their parents? How is that helping them?

I left that site and clicked on this one. Whew! It was like a breath of fresh air. I saw people who liked, loved, didn't like, or didn't care about the Gosselins, but still managed to discuss them in an adult way. I am a fan of the show, and this site has been a great read for information. I also like the off-topics and other things discussed. I have not been back to the other place, and don't plan to. Just don't need that kind of negative energy.

Thank you for providing this site! I'm not here much, but enjoy reading when I can.

CincyMom said...

I am still angry about the TLC promo about "It's all been leading up to this." so I don't know if I will still watch next season.

I don't think they should "capitalize" on marital strife or let anyone else do it. Their own kids watch it, I'm sure many of their friends and my kids. They don't have to hide some issues but they don't have to do week-long promos about it either!

My husband rolls his eyes and leaves the room when the show comes on! I know people complain when they hide reality (the nanny, non-nanny, whatever) but I don't see why they need to show us All it does is 80 percent tick me off anymore and 20 percent think the kiddies are so darn cute! I really like the "day in the life" things like "A walk in the woods" I understand Kate saying, it's the good bad and ugly them just living it stuff. So I don't pick Jon apart for being cranky kids are being noisy in the woods, or pick Kate apart for how long she cleans however many fridges she owns (I still have a humongous need to clean mine after watching it)!

I simply don't like some of the mean comments between them and I don't like the freeby going-to-places episodes. These are the things that make watching the show both fun and painful, hence me being torn. Hopefully, I'll keep both arms on after though and keep in touch here!

I think "the other blog" being mentioned in this post is juvenile. It is so rude to portray people they way they do graphically and with words.

I still think they might be teenagers having a good time. The biggest "Kon" of all time!!!!!!

Saint said...

The cat and the phrase at the top of the picture are funny. Who picks that stuff?

Mom said...

I think the thing that cracks me up the most is the double standard out there.

Case in point: Prior to this hate blog becoming live, there was the PennMommy Gosselin insider drama. It was said on yet another blog that there was a "special place in hell" for people like Guin and I. All because we weren't posting sympathy threads for an imaginary person who didn't like the Gosselins. This particular poster came forward with one of her "many" socks - and admitted to writing the post.

Later this same person using the same name posted something about this on yet another blog. Admitting that it probably wasn't the nicest thing, etc. but the words are out there, blah blah blah. That same person also stated she saw the wallow and would never DARE post over there.

And, what do you know? She's now posting over there as yet another one of her socks.

Who is the hypocrite here?

She no longer posts as the original name that I'm aware of. I know it's her though. As much as she'd like to think I'm a bad person, I am not.

No one should wish hell on anyone. Period.

And, if this weren't enough, there is another regular blogger who is beyond snarky and down right nasty. She uses a different name on every blog she posts on. She also made a comment about how childish the hate blog is and now she posts there using Nina's namesake.

Whatever.

Nina Bell said...

Saint,

Guin picked that.

Nina Bell said...

I have to tell you that I am pretty tired of lies. NC Resident was not banned from our site. In his short time posting here, we did not reject one of his comments except the last one. He wrote a long swan song goodbye saying how mean we were and specifically targeting several posters. I have it saved. He said he would not be coming back. I chose not to publish that one because he singled out people posting here and was not that nice about it. I am not really into long goodbyes anyway.

I repeat he was not banned from our site, he chose not to come back. If he posted today, I would post it as long as it was respectful.

marci said...

Nina said...
I have to tell you that I am pretty tired of lies. NC Resident was not banned from our site. In his short time posting here, we did not reject one of his comments except the last one. He wrote a long swan song goodbye saying how mean we were and specifically targeting several posters. I have it saved. He said he would not be coming back. I chose not to publish that one because he singled out people posting here and was not that nice about it. I am not really into long goodbyes anyway.

I repeat he was not banned from our site, he chose not to come back. If he posted today, I would post it as long as it was respectful.


I find this ironic since his biggest beef with the Gosselins were their perceived lies and inconsitencies.

Nina Bell said...

WFC

I don't believe we are innocent. I believe we have made mistakes. I know I have. There are times I wish I would have said something different or done something differently. There are times on this blog where I have apologized to someone when I was wrong. There are times I have reacted to an action and wish I had not. I am human.

There are always two sides two a story and of course I have mine.

I recently did ban a poster from our site. That I will admit. It was not NC Resident. This person knows who she is. There of course is a lot more to this story than she will admit to. I have a very public blog and I could have responded to her acusations in an unkind way. I could have posted information that would have shed some light on why I chose to ban her. I had plenty of reason. I tried to show her respect and leave it alone. I ignored her lies and continued lies. I ignored her hijacking and posting my screen name on every Gosselin blog and comment section known to man. My God, does this woman ever sleep?

But in the end, it doesnt really matter. We will keep doing our thing and you will keep doing yours. And life goes on.

Nina Bell said...

Now I am on a roll. I can not really understand why I can not post on Baby Mama's site? Why can I not read Moon's site? Why can I not read "the piggies" over at the wallow (yes Peri I refer to your blog that way because you are the one with the picture and header)? I thought I lived in the United States the last time I checked.

NC Resident can you give me a clear explanation of why you are allowed to read at all of these sites including this one but I can not? I would think that by reading some of these sites, I might gain a better perspective on why people think differently than myself.

Something else I would like to clear up. I am not really an extreme fan of this show. I have not even watched the last two shows. Guin hit it on the head when she said I was more neutral and just wanted a place to discuss both points of view.

I am glad I started this blog. I really like this blogging community known as GDNNOP. I don't care how many comments we get or what happens with the show. The people here are great and really seem to care about one another. A lot of positive energy going on here.

moonst said...

I can't believe it's been almost a year that I've been reading this blog. I posted once or twice at the beginning, but then had trouble logging in or whatever have just been along for the ride, reading almost every day. Although I am not part of the conversation, I have always been impressed with the posters here. I still watch the show, I don't love or hate J & K, but the kids resemble my own and we watch together. Sorry that for this forum to exist, the moderators have to put up with so much crap. But I appreciate it, and thank you for all your work.

Eileen said...

That was exactly the draw for me here, Nina. Positive energy and seeing how everyone supported each other.
As Blessed as I might feel in my life, my life does have it's negatives here and there (as we all do), and I really don't need to invite any more negativity into my life. I'm so lost with half the things that are said here, and to tell you the truth, I'm glad I am. I used to be sort of curious about it all but now I don't really even have the inclination to look things up anymore about it.
I have no problem if others want to get into it, but I'd just as soon steer clear.
And the best thing you can do for yourself, in my opinion, is to do just what you said, choose the better part of this situation, and focus on the positive.

Liza Beth said...

Nina, I know for a fact that you have put up with FAR more hatred and malice than anyone should ever have to deal with. Add to that the fact that your goal is to just have a neutral playing field where people can express themselves if they play nice, and it really amazes me how malicious some people are.

Personally, I like the show but could live without it pretty easily. I never even watched till this past spring or summer, and even then didn't like Kate the first few times I caught the show. After that I gradually saw that there was good to go along with the bad, like with anything. Maybe that is part of the issue-- people have a hard time understanding how those of us here have the ability to balance our feelings towards the show. They cannot comprehend the fact that we allow a human being (like Kate) the chance to be herself, and that whether we like her or hate her she has the right to be who she is just like the rest of us do.

Marci, you hit the nail on the head with your assessment. I am constantly amazed at how unaware some people are to their own prejudices. I say this knowing I can be the same way, but that if it is pointed out to me at least I take that opportunity to think about my opinions and possibly change them. This blog has helped me see a lot of things differently, but good and bad, so for that I am grateful.

I also agree, Eileen, that the off topic discussions have strengthened the community here in a way that a solely Gosselin blog could not do. That is a big part of the reason why I stuck around despite the threatening situations and statements that have come my way (via email as well as on other blogs). I have met people who I consider good friends (despite our differences in mashed potato making or movies!!) and am thankful to have the chance to discuss a host of topics with everyone.

Liza Beth said...

Mia, thanks for the comment but we are going to keep this thread on topic. If you really want to discuss the link you posted here then please put it in Open Discussion. Thanks!

Guinevere said...

My position: I like a little snark now and then, although the way I have seen it practiced by many of the detractors of the Gosselins it really leaves the realm of snark and ventures into pure hate and nastiness. That has never been my cup of tea. It's the same reason I don't read TWoP anymore. There are too many of those type of negative individuals over there too.

Yeah, I have never been one of those people going "tsk tsk" at the idea of any bitchiness, meanness or snarkiness. It's the degree that it's taken to that I object to. Obviously, that line will be different for different people, but I'd like to think most people would acknowledge that there IS a line. Besides the level of nastiness, the twisting of words and intentions and outright lies are a no-go for me. There's just no excuse for that.

I really admire posters who aren't afraid to state their opinion even if it sometimes goes against the majority and will argue their POV respectfully without backing down.

I agree. And I know it's hard to do.

Oh, Merryway, I didn't know the first thing about these blogs (or blogs in general), and I didn't know there was a protocol.

I think the internet is like anyplace else; different groups have different cultures and different rules, often unspoken ones. I tend to sort of dip my toe in new message boards and try to get a sense of whether the culture is one where I'll fit in before I participate. I don't think there's necessarily a protocol, but I think a little caution and investigation can help one avoid trouble.

Same here. I attacked Guinevere (not the other way around) and "Nina Bell" came to her defense. I thought, "who is this Nina Bell, anyway?" I might have even asked her what her problem was, or something like that! My feathers were ruffled, but I didn't run away to a mud pit to wallow in self-pity. It's not like I couldn't get my opinions posted.

See, this is why I admire you so much. You have integrity and the courage of your convictions. I think we sort of snapped at each other off the bat and were wary, but we were able to get past that and I'm so glad. If you'd gone off in a huff after the first couple of exchanges, this community would be missing one of its most valuable members.

It's a reminder to me to not go off half-cocked on people. And yes, it may come as a surprise that I do TRY not to be a jerk unless I really think someone is provoking me deliberately. Anya has been good about reminding me to give people the benefit of the doubt.

Regarding NC Res, he was bashing this blog at another site under another screen name. Nina asked if they were his posts, and when he avoided answering, I asked him. He admitted it, so he was not sockpuppeting, just using another screen name. I wasn't upset that he posted elsewhere, or that he preferred another screen name for a different site. I took offense to what he said. He wasn't polite. I changed my happy face avatar to a frowny face avatar. Merryway scolded him too, for the NOT polite comments about us here at GDNNOP. He's never been back (except to lurk.)

I don't have a problem so much with people using different usernames on other sites - it depends on the situation. I don't think one should be required to be identifiable as the same person no matter what site they are on - sometimes you want a little anonymity.

I do have a huge problem with two-facedness. Saying one thing on one site and then changing your name and saying something totally different on another - yuck. We've encountered a few people now who we suspect or know have done that, and it honestly just creeps me out.

What is it about this woman that is so polarizing to so many?

I don't know if it's any one thing (at least any one thing that's easily understood). I think there is something about Kate both as a mother and as an extremely strong-willed woman that really pushes peoples' buttons. In a weird way, I can understand the extreme hate more than the extreme love.

I guess, to me, Kate falls somewhere in the middle like most people. Would I want to be her BFF? No. Do I think she's really Adolf Hitler with spiky blonde hair? Nope. Like most of us, Kate has her good & her bad. Depending on who you talk to, this either makes me a sheeple of a jealous hater, lol.

Heh. Yes, exactly. She's a human being with flaws and virtues. That people see her as so extremely one way or another is proof to me that they are transferring other stuff onto her, stuff that has nothing to do with her.

I post here more than elsewhere because I like the more middle of the road vibe at this blog. I also like the offtopic discussions.

Belladonna, we'd love to have you post more! It's nice to hear that people appreciate the offtopic stuff. I don't think anyone involved in this site wants to talk about the Gosselins 24/7.

Guinevere said...

I have to tell you that I am pretty tired of lies. NC Resident was not banned from our site. In his short time posting here, we did not reject one of his comments except the last one. He wrote a long swan song goodbye saying how mean we were and specifically targeting several posters. I have it saved. He said he would not be coming back. I chose not to publish that one because he singled out people posting here and was not that nice about it. I am not really into long goodbyes anyway.

Yeah, I think I said at the time that I am not in favor of posting "goodbye, cruel world" posts. It's just someone's way to get the last word in, since you're supposed to believe that they won't be reading after their swan song.

I guess we could add something to the posting rules about this, but really, I think it's kind of a no-brainer. By the time things have degenerated into, "...and I won't be back!" posts, chances are you may have already crossed into not-going-to-get-posted territory.

Quiltart said...

Can you delete the previous note and use it under this name instead? If not, I will understand...



I have to say that I have never felt anything but welcome on this blog. I came late to the show, but had lurked on most of the J&K blogs and in some online J&K groups since TWOP, so while I was new to readers, I didn't exactly feel new.

That being said, I have been in other groups (and also kicked out of other groups for not agreeing with them) that are nowhere near as welcoming as GDNNOP has been. There are groups that are not blogs online, but more akin to old fashioned bulletin boards, that are more hate-filled than you can imagine. Some of the comments even make GWOP seem tame. Two groups in particular are for haters only, and all I can say is I pity the poor unsuspecting on-hater that hastens to enter the doorway of these groups... (These are public groups; there are private ones that are worse.) Regular members are given total permission to bash upon any fan that may post anything positive about the show or the G's.

I don't care what you think about Kate Gosselin's parenting style or personality, likening her to Satan and wishing that she be damned to "Burn in hell 8 times over" is beyond a non-fan group. It is irrational hate. The fact that people can harbor so much hate for a television personality they do not know, nor will ever know, that many of them claim not to even watch anymore, boggles the mind and makes you wonder about the sad lives of the people who have to project such hatred on this family.

I do not agree with everything Jon and Kate say or do. In fact, a lot times I cringe at some of the things they say and do. I watch their show for entertainment. The kids are cute and I thoroughly have enjoyed seeing them grow and mature. I think that a lot of people forget that this is a television show and we are not co-parenting this family. The children are loved by their parents, well cared for, and despite the hoopla of the TV show and the active imaginations of the critics out on the internet, seem to be thriving. Whether the parents are really thriving remains to be seen, but they are adults and that is not our problem either!

Right after the last show of the season I went scurrying around to read the usual blogs and felt absolutely dejected when I realized that all I could read was negativity about the Gosselins. I don't think that a lot of the haters realize that despite their protests to the contrary, their rants are really very thinly veiled masks of jealousy. Of course, NO ONE is jealous of the Goseelins, right?

I am glad of their success. I hope they learn to handle it well and I hope we will be able to see how these children grow and thrive despite it all!

Thanks, Nina, for giving me a place to voice what I've been thinking about saying for quite a while!

AAP said...

Nina, I'm afraid that I might be responsible for the NC talk here. After reading Guin's post I was curious about the other sight and found that NC resident was posting there.

After Merryway (I think?) called him out for talking out of both sides of his mouth, I always thought it was rather cowardly that he never came back here to post. Then again, I haven't been checking in regularly so I might have missed something. He seemed to fall off this blog and I was curious why.

Oh, and I might have mentioned that he didn't have any balls.... So I'm sorry if I caused any problems. I would address this to him personally but they've now made the blog invite only.

Nina Bell said...

AAP

No you are not responsible for anything. NC Resident has been posting his feelings about our blog all over the Gosselin blogging world long before today.

Thanks for your support.

Anya said...

marci said...I find this ironic since his biggest beef with the Gosselins were their perceived lies and inconsitencies.

I thought his biggest beef was with the side of beef. (You know the one that Jodi had to pay for and we are sure Kate didn't).

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Anya said...

Moonst, very nice words.

Nice to see AAP posting too.

jace said...

I wanted to chime in with my appreciation as well. The mods do a fabulous job here and I admire their good judgment and diligence in keeping this blog a nice place for discussion.

I don't understand people who spend their time spreading lies and hatred about other people. There seems to be no sense of decency at all and I find it both appalling and puzzling. And also fascinating for some reason. One of my co-workers used to say, "You have to feel sorry for people like that, look who they have to live with." Smart lady.

erin said...

I'm actually really surprised that there is a hate site dedicated to this site. Those kinds of boards only work were there is honest to god insanity to draw from (hence why Princess MC works so well). While our conversations can get heated they are repectful, and avoid bashing the people on the show as well as other posters. This is my only Gosselin outlet, and Princess boards for just those reasons. The crazy has gone over the there. Those girls are the epitome of mean girls. They can talk to me about abuse, neglect, the parents not loving their kids, etc. ad lausium, when i haven't spent my day at an IEP conference discussing the problem of my client's public mastrubation at inappropriate times (due to being repeatedly raped and sodomized by her uncle). And that is not the worst of my job. As to their "child advocacy, they can shove that--I don't think a real advocate would ever work that way. Instead of sitting and watching, rewatching, slow motion analyzing the shows and then spending hours claiming to be advocates while they bitch about how skinny and pretty Kate is they should go out and actually do something for the kids who are REALLY abused. I wish they would get off their asses and actually do something to help people who are abused, Let them become a CASA, or a GAL, or hell, just volunteer.

Sorry for the rant. Day in and day out I see these things, a 10 year old who wants to kill himself because his mom uses crack and that upsets him. A 17 year old girl who slept in bed with her mother when she was younger and she was raped repeated by her mom's boyfriend, which mom watching.

I'll step off my soap box now. Didn't mean to hijack the thread, I just wanted to say that despite what GDNNOP says, this *is* a fair and balanced blog, there are posters from both sides. A blog to hate on that is lame.

Saint said...

Did I get an invite? Because I can read it. (Just kidding.)

Nina, I think NC Res backed you up about not banning him. I wonder why he did not correct that misperception earlier? Why let others continue to think you banned him? I know he's spinning it now, but, sheez, be honest or be quiet. So you posted everyone of his comments except a disrespectful one? Well, I hope that clears up the confusion about that: NC Res left because his feelings were hurt when he was exposed as a disrespectful poster at another site. OK.

Aap, ITA, that seems cowardly.

Nina, thanks for explaining that.

Nina Bell said...

Well there is one more thing I would like to address with NC Resident.
I never ever accused you of being Roy. And I am tired of reading that all over the internet. I re-read all of our emails (yes I keep them also however I have not shared them with another blog owner as you have). I could not find anywhere in our email exchange where I accused you of being Roy.

This is the comment that I made:

Blogger Nina Bell said...

NC Resident

Well your comments came 10 or more minutes after Fiona's and Saints, however I am sure you were probably typing away.

Really, probably just an irritation of having to respond to remarks about people discussing or wanting to discuss GWoP over and over again. I think we actually have addressed this in our FAQ section. I am pretty sure, NC Resident that you, I and Roy have had this discussion before. Haven't we? Am I recalling that correctly or not?

December 21, 2008 3:11 PM


This was not me accusing you of being Roy. This was me explaining to you that you, I and Roy had discussed the topic before.

I was well aware you were not Roy and would not accuse you of that.

Roy is just one of many socks that another poster on "the piggies" uses when she wants to stir things up here. It is amazing that Roy showed up at another blog you frequent to welcome you and talk about how horrible this blog is and then she just disappeared. Never to be seen again. Amazing isn't it.

These are the same trolls such as Lameo and WowjustWow that come over here and drop "bombs" and expect us to post them. The whole purpose of this being to sit back on the "piggy" blog and either bitch that we didn't post it or have fun with how people respond to it. And yes Lameo, you have posted here recently. Just too much of a coward to use your Lameo screen name.

NC Resident, why would I email you and tell you that you could post here? I never told you that you could not. You told me you were through. I just felt that you knew what was best for you.

Jenn said...

What the heck have I missed?????

Linda said...

Pitiful. Really just pitiful.

To utilize so much emotional energy on hating a t.v. show or hating a group of bloggers just boggles my mind.

My take on GWOP has always been that they are not advocates, but actually border on abusive. I think that they find sites like this to be threatening because it is a place that exposes them.

So what do they do? In turn, they set up a blog that criticizes this one.

That blog is little more than a way to silence their critics.

============

I remember that a poster on this blog said some of the more anti-Gosselin posters seem to believe that there is an essential "TRUTH" about the Gosselins (especially Kate) that they understand.

I think that they believe that the possession of this truth elevates their hatred to a more noble purpose.

Daisy said...

I had to chuckle at the title of this thread. Yesterday I spent the day with 45 8th graders and most of them were more mature than the hate filled blogs put up to snark on other ones. I saw tender hearted kids caring for others.

Some of you have had to put up a lot in the J&K blogging world. Your names being hijacked, pictures put up of relatives, and the list goes one. I think we're looking at below 8th grade and boardering 6th. My kids both had a lot more drama in 6th than 8th grade.

Mom said...

Daisy -

Thanks for your post.

Sometimes I forget about all the other ancillary things aside from the actual blogging.

The name hi-jacking and posting of family members photos would definitely account for juvenile (and down right mean) behavior.

I don't get it.

Daisy said...

I don't get it either Mom. This G rated show has certainly had a lot of R rated posts associated with it. Not here, elsewhere and over a long period of time.

Mom said...

You are so right Daisy! I like your avatar, btw.

Anya said...

Jenn said...
What the heck have I missed?????


Hi Jenn. Well, nothing that all interesting, but why don't you email a mod. We can fill you in a bit.

Happy Wednesday everyone!

SamanthaNC said...

Aww apparently some of their feelings have been hurt, Lameo (lame indeed)had the audacity to suggest that we're picking on them. How laughable. Apparently we were supposed to be their little doormats forever. FYI according to them only 5 of us are actually real.

Liza Beth said...

Samantha, that is something I have always found really amusing. We (here at GDNNOP) apparently have the time on our hands to sock ourselves on this blog... so there are only 5 of us total that have all kinds of screennames and email addresses and the like. We are SO busy, since we apparently do the same thing on other blogs as well!! Who knew we had that kind of time?

For the record, we can validate the info on our regular posters as being different people. This is aided by the fact that some of us are friends on facebook, read each others personal blogs, or check in via email throughout the week. Granted when a new person joins there is that initial hesitation we have talked about, but the best way to fight that is by registering with a Google ID and emailing at least one moderator so they know you are legit and not just around to make trouble.

I guess that is what makes this amusing-- maybe they are so worried about being caught in their own sock drawers that they feel it necessary to point at others...

Paula said...

Nina Bell said...

I am glad I started this blog. I really like this blogging community known as GDNNOP.


I am glad you started this blog too. I do read your blog, and I post every once in a while. I sometimes feel like I can't get the words out as well as some others and they usually say what is on my mind. I usually read the Princess boards to get my daily Gwop. I find reading the same thing over and over again about Kate rather boring. What I find baffling is why is it alright for them to have a hate site, but they can't stand the idea of a fan site or a moderate site? Anyway thanks again and I do appreciate your hard work!

Anya said...

Off-topic, but I hope I can join your society, Samantha!

Liza Beth, your avatar - now that is clever! Love it.

indianprincess said...

Wow,I'm gone for one day and I'm missing the fun. I read a lot of the popular blogs. If my anemic brain is not faultering me I can easily guess the blog you all are talking about. I like the "how dare they" attitude from different blogs out there like it's a competion between the posters who are well known in the Gosselin blogs. I do have to say the Princess Board Rocks and sometimes I wish I could be that witty with my words but sadly I'm not!!

I was stalked once on Facebook back in September by some crazy Micheal Phelps fan on the old Gosselin Fan group until I personally had to threaten this person and they finally left me alone. It was quite strange.

As far as this blog is concerned. I never once felt attacked by any poster. I enjoy the posters here and sometimes the "post and split Trolls". That's why I've been here for so long. I try being respectful to fellow posters here and if I feel like my blood is going to boil by what someone said I just don't respond, why? because it's not in my nature to argue with people plus sometimes you may write something and another person may take what you said differently and then it gets all messed up and confusing trying to explain your point.

Being here since the summer nothing surprises me anymore. Let those posters snark because apparently they have nothing better to do with their time then living and breathing negative energy and getting worked up on what some poster here has to say. So high school and maybe they are teenagers bored and this is fun for them!!

Theresa said...

indianprincess said...

plus sometimes you may write something and another person may take what you said differently and then it gets all messed up and confusing trying to explain your point.


ITA indianprincess. The perils of print. :) What one person may write innocently and meant one way, another may read into it too much or just read it totally different than what was meant. That's why we need video conferencing gals! :)

Saint said...

I admire people like aap and Theresa who have visited the mud hole to "discuss" the purpose of that blog and the comments made there about others. Both posters were very polite but were treated poorly.

I read accusations that GDNNOP was so rude to someone (or several?) over there they started their "Pigs Only" blog. I don't believe it.

"Peri" started it just before Penn Mommy was revealed to be a fraud. And she was mad when Penn was shown to be Possum. Shooting the messenger. That's what the piggy blog was for.

It wasn't started due to hurt feelings about posts not going through, or it would have been started in the summer when the great affront occurred. It was started in anger over the Penn Mommy drama. The first thread in that archive is from October 1st, a day before imaginary William died, and it's a cut and paste from this blog. It's the "offending" comments from here in which some say they believe that Penn is a fraud.

Truth breeds bitterness.

indianprincess said...

Who is Peri and where did this person escape from..was this person an ex-gwopper?

Theresa said...

Thanks Saint. I haven't been there lately, but I'm sure my words are being taken out of context, or they're making assumptions about what I said and throwing in other thoughts that just weren't mine.

Like I said upthread I am flattered they think I'm Guin. I think it's funny that they could even put a thought out there like that (that someone would use two names). I guess since they're the pros at sockpuppeting, they think everyone does it. Nope. Just people who don't have enough mature visitors for good conversations. Sad little dejected piggies. :)

They're just not worth my time anymore. So, if anyone sees how they rip me apart for writing this, well, proves my point. :)

Saint said...

I'd like to edit my post above to include Fanny as a poster who tried polite discussion in the pig pen only to be treated rudely.

Fanny said...

Thanks Saint, I tried...lol

Whoever it was that responded to me was awfully bitter about something and I agree with you that this had little to do with hurt feelings. They can't hash this all out at gwop because it might cloud all the *ahem* "advocating" that goes on over there, so they started their own little snark blog. All the "they didn't post my comments, boo hoo hoo" is just an excuse. Oh well.

Liza Beth said...

Theresa, I totally agree that this is just not worth the time. I feel like no matter what we have said it will be taken out of context. Other blogs have their own standards for what is posted and considered appropriate. They are entitled to their opinions as well as their ability to run their sites as they see fit. The issue is when those comments and posts are harmful to people personally.

I do have to say something about the issue of a picture of my nephew being posted on another site. I was told that this has been discussed elsewhere and was really thankful to see that others agreed the blogger who did so was out of line. I was not aware that my personal avatar from months ago would be brought forth and used against me somehow. Granted my nephew is adorable, but posting that just shows how juvenile that poster really is.

Maybe this proves that while we all may disagree on Jon and Kate, there is common ground and decency that can be found. Posting personal information is not appropriate, no matter how angry you are. No one wants to be disrespected or ganged up on, so while people feel they have been wronged on this blog the best thing to do would be address that with the person who was rude to you. Starting a whole separate blog just to vent or be rude does nothing positive. Along with that, using respect when you speak to others as well as sticking with one screenname, will go far in establishing respectability.

To those who think *I* may have done something to harm them personally, again I ask that you just email me. Like Nina said there is just one person who has been banned from this site, so if others can play nice then they would probably be surprised at how reasonable we all actually are.

Baby Mama said...

Theresa~ Forgive me, I was a bit confused after I just realized that there are in fact two of you. I see they are spelled slightly differently and that's how I try to keep track.

I'm the first to say I love coming to this blog because it IS so balanced and fair. It tries to sometimes have a debate but its a shame that it doesn't always go well. I am the first to admit that if GWOP can ban the fans, I'm entitled on mine to ban the trolls.

What pisses me off are the blogs that "claim" to be balanced and then attack those that come on. You know the one I'm talking about. Anyone that claims you guys aren't fair are basically from there. By the way, I LOVE the sad kitty pic. ;)

MoreCowbell said...

I have to say, that I HEART TLC for that little "kon" they pulled. You know exactly who they were targeting with the promos leading up to the season finale. "Watch us reel these stupid fools in...." It certainly wasn't a promo to get FANS to watch. Fans were going to watch anyway. No, TLC was screwing with the Haters. The ones who would watch a show that they profess to hate, hoping to be able to slither back to their blogs and celebrate that the children they claim to advocate for, will have to go through seeing their parents divorce. GUESS WHAT? DIDN'T HAPPEN! I love you, TLC.

Yes I capture all of the IP addresses and I hold them all in an internet prison camp. Never to be released and allowed to go home.

I'll bet you won't give them gum or cupcakes, either. How DARE you.

Is there someone we can call about this. DBSS? Department of Blogging Services for Sheeple?!

Tyra said...

People posting at Peri's piggie pen... make me very sad for humankind. They also make me personally peeved... because someone with insufficient imagination to come up with her own fake name has absconded with my TWoP handle and is sullying it all over the Gosselin blogging world. Coincidence? Doubt it.

Anya said...

indianprincess said...
Who is Peri and where did this person escape from..was this person an ex-gwopper?


Ex or current GWoPPer, who knows? The thing is the "handle" she picked just conveniently happened to belong a pro-Gosselin poster on the old TWoP boards. (Who has apparently disappeared into the night. Too bad, I was just re-reading some of her posts and she and Sunita Bonita & a few others are the only voices of sanity on that thread).

So that's the level of maturity you are dealing with. This "child advocate" hijacks the screen name of a poster who disagreed with her on the TWoP board and starts a blog to snark on us because we had the *audacity* to out Penn Mommy as a fraud.

Oh and one more thing - if any of these women are under 35, I am the Queen of England.

Anya said...

Tyra!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I was just hitting send on my post addressing Indian Princess when I saw your response.

It all makes sense now.

I am just in awe of you. Seriously.

indianprincess said...

Very mature of the fake Peri. I can only shake my head. It's pretty lame. I didn't realize the feelings run so deep with some people. Why do these people feel personally attacked by commenting on a open discussion blog about Jon and Kate Gosselin.

indianprincess said...

So Tyra are you the real Peri?

Tyra said...

Tyra!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Anya!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Seriously.

No. It's you who are awesome. In a serious way.

I'm surprised that anybody remembered me from TWoP, I posted so seldom. (About like now--I'm a slow writer.)

Doesn't it just sum up the GWoP phenomena? Petty, petty revenge against people they disagree with? Check. No imagination? Check. Intellectual dishonesty? Check. Not even the courage to stand behind their original fake! name, gotta steal one? Check.

Very interesting.

Tyra said...

So Tyra are you the real Peri?

Will the real Peri please stand up? heh. I posted on the TWoP Gosselin board as Peri, pre-GWoP. The 'peri' on the pig board must be someone from the TWoP board. Should I be flattered? Didn't think so.

Where's the identity police when you need them?

indianprincess said...

Sorry Tyra, This new Peri has problems far more deeper than discussing Jon and Kate Gosselin along with the cheezy followers!!

Anya said...

Tyra said...I'm surprised that anybody remembered me from TWoP, I posted so seldom. (About like now--I'm a slow writer.)

Well, you obviously made an impression. One of the things I have noticed is the piggies and their ilk seem to take stronger exception to the superior writers among us. You are one of them obviously. It's not so much what you say as the fact that you say it quite eloquently. Me thinks it makes them feel a bit inferior.

That said, if they had stronger material to work with (such as FACTS), it would honestly make their jobs much easier.

Don't be a stranger. We need more like you.

AAP said...

Saint - I have to say the real reason I posted on the other site was because I was curious about what happen to NC Resident, and wanted to hear what he had to say directly from him. So I have to thank him for finally answering my question, because he didn't have to and it satifed my curiosity.

As for standing behind Nina - I can only speak from personal experience but Nina has always been more than fair with me, and I think overall has let in some comments she didn't have to and didn't agree with. I have no problem telling other people that.

Plus, if I didn't post there, I would have missed the sheer comic genius of Maverick, who absolutely made my day with his nonsensical ramblings and inability to follow a blog conversation. There's a charity just waiting to be named after you my friend! Maybe we could get Jon and Kate to host a special plus 8 episode to cover it?!

AAP said...

Also, if the other site thought Theresa was Guin, and I was Theresa, does that actually make me Guin? Never in a million years would I have thought I could get mistaken for Guin. Scary thought for the night :-).

Tyra said...

That said, if they had stronger material to work with (such as FACTS), it would honestly make their jobs much easier.

So true. It's actually what fascinates me the most in the Gosselin blogverse: that combo of illogic and dead certain conviction.

Tyra said...

erin, I'm sorry I forgot to say two things:

1. Bravo to you for fighting the good fight, really helping kids who need it.

2. Excellent rant

Guinevere said...

Well, I headed over to the sty and rather predictably, they are patting themselves on the back for supposedly getting us worked up. For women with no discernable positive attributes, they have a bafflingly high opinion of themselves.

For the record, we have been aware of the sty since its inglorious inception. It is barely on my radar 99.9% of the time; the other .1% it’s rather like a small and mildly annoying gnat. We’ve simply made the decision to swat at the buzzing for once. I hardly think there will be a “blog war” because no one here cares enough. So bask in the attention while you have it, piggies.

Since this won’t be a regular event, and since I’m going to be accused of “nitpicking” anyway, I thought I might take the opportunity to give the piggies a taste of their own swill. Warning: HTML coding ahead!

This was a fun blog I made for me. A few like minded people showed up and we enjoyed ourselves. Then the blog began ambling away from that. When NMD came by, it remained civil, but soon afterward began trotting away from the original purpose and today has started cantering.

Oh, sweetie, you have such an odd interpretation of “civil”. Must be a Southern thing. I guess they didn’t have dictionaries in the sty, so you’re just guessing at the meaning of the word?

AAP I've said and others have in various posts and comments how much we deplore and loathe the debating of another site. I'm southern and was always taught it was impolite and rude to engage in that kind of discussion outside debate society. Obviously others have not been taught that.

Okay, but you do realize that outside the sty, people go on discussion boards to…discuss things? Which sometimes involves disagreement, which is perilously close to debate!

If you weren’t cleaving to your ridiculous “it’s bad manners to disagree” argument, you would admit why you don’t want to debate: you are afraid to. Because you are incapable of rational debate. Your hatred of Kate Gosselin is based on nothing but emotion, not on anything factual or quantifiable or debatable. It’s all in you and has squat-all to do with her.

Feel free to state what you feel or think about something, but please stop questioning or harrassing others about their opinions or previous actions. The posting style is giving me a headache. Arguing, certain crude words, debating, pouncing on other commenters, things like that need to be avoided. No, you haven't done all of those, but the primary rule is try to be at least a little funny.

When were you planning on starting that “being funny” thing?

AAP, please do not try to make my post something it wasn't. Guin was an example and I certainly know she isn't all of Giddy. She and some others like her are enough to make me never want to go back though. I do not go on blogs to debate. I like to have social discussion. If you enjoy debate have at it with Guin and her like. I prefer people who wouldn't get thrown out of MIL's bridge club.

Like your sty-mate, you don’t want to debate because you can’t keep up. I’m sure your MIL’s bridge club is a model of Stepford-like conformity. No thought or dissent allowed! I wonder if they are as crude and trashy as your group usually is?

I welcome civil discussion, however.

And here I was not giving you credit for being funny! Apologies; you are quite the card.

What you “welcome” is a community dedicated to personal attacks on people outside the community. That is NOT civility, and the fact that you think it is says a lot about you.

Also, last reminder - this is NOT a chapter of the high school debate club. You may discuss as you would at a dinner party, but trying to win debating points is one of the few things I can't tolerate.

You can discuss as long as you agree with everything the the sty agrees on, and as long as you attack people who don’t. If not, you get the same nasty, ugly treatment as everyone outside the sty.

Guinevere said...

Will the real Peri please stand up? heh. I posted on the TWoP Gosselin board as Peri, pre-GWoP. The 'peri' on the pig board must be someone from the TWoP board. Should I be flattered? Didn't think so.

Since I think the identity lost about 75 IQ points in the transition, I'd say no.

Theresa said...

Guinivere--Loved your post! Right on sister, right on!!

Gnats indeed.

Have a great day everyone!

SamanthaNC said...

I heart AAP :) or as the pigs call her our "Scout".

The following is Peri's quote that I hijacked from Guin.

I'm southern and was always taught it was impolite and rude to engage in that kind of discussion outside debate society. Obviously others have not been taught that.

I didn't realize polite behavior was exclusive to southerners. I'm also southern, though I am quite unfamiliar with any "debate society". I must have been preoccupied with my mint julep, parasol and that damn hoop skirt the day they versed us southern belles on that one.

Though I didn't miss the lesson about not setting up a blog comparing other posters to pigs and twisting all their words to suit my own bitchy agenda. Obviously Peri was absent from charm school that day.

Saint said...

Guinevere,
You received a standing ovation from the Northerners in the room! Well said.

Tyra,
I will forever think of you as "Tyra, the Pretty Peri (not the ugly one.)"

NC Res,
You guessed correctly about the minister remark. I thought your apology to Lizabeth was needed and very nice. Maybe the pot I stirred was not completely empty? As for my emailing you, this is how emailing works: my turn, your turn, my turn, your turn. My problems are stated very nicely in my last email to you, still unanswered. So it's your turn. I wouldn't want anyone getting any false impressions about that, after we just finished clearing up your last one.

Fanny said...

I must have been preoccupied with my mint julep, parasol and that damn hoop skirt the day they versed us southern belles on that one.


Those hoop skirts are a bitch, aren't they?

I laughed out loud when I read her quote. Reminds me of the "christians" in this circuit who like to quote bible verses in the middle of a rant about Kate's ugly hair, clothes, kids, etc. All that other stuff about passing judgement, loving thy neighbor, and doing unto others doesn't apply to them.

If you are a polite person, you just are. To everyone. Snarking may be funny, but it most certainly isn't the polite thing to do.

Now, I'm going to go and try really, really hard to get over myself. HA!

Theresa said...

Those that think it's ok to lie about people and call it freedom of speech are not taking into consideration how they would feel if the shoe was on their foot. Besides being hurtful, it is just plain wrong to lie and spread gossip, not to mention doing so in a cowardly anonymous way. I'm amazed that so many people don't see it that way anymore.

Exactly Jan! Great post. I hope people learn from it.

Theresa said...

Those hoop skirts are a bitch, aren't they?

Too funny Fanny! LOL! good one!

merryway said...

What a great read, it made my morning nicer. I was laughing so hard and picturing the hoop skirts.

I admire people like aap and Theresa who have visited the mud hole to "discuss" the purpose of that blog and the comments made there about others. Both posters were very polite but were treated poorly.

Me too, and also for those ones not mentioned. Aap, I think it was after you had to leave for awhile that some were talking about doing a real debate. I hope it works out where you can be around more. I enjoyed reading your posts at the waller.

Anya said...

Saint said...
Guinevere,
You received a standing ovation from the Northerners in the room! Well said.


Yeah, I think the Northerners and the sane Southerners both. I guess I am a Westerner (I live in the great untamed territory of California). Out there, we don't like folks stirring up trouble just to stir up trouble...

Tyra, I will forever think of you as "Tyra, the Pretty Peri (not the ugly one.)"

I have the same mental image too, Saint (ugly vs. pretty). Tyra, you are the original pretty Peri.

Mom said...

I see. It's okay for the proper southerners over at the pig pit to allow the *F* bomb getting dropped numerous times. That makes sense. Total sense.

Oh, and yes, fat cat, I hide behind the shield of "mom" just like you hide behind the shield of anonymous (and other handles to boot) to let your inner "mean girl" come out. You are so witty and mature as the fat cat. So wise. Always proper. Never rude, irrational or quick to judge. And, let's not forget your editing skills.

Kinda makes me [sic] to my stomach.

Disappointed about season 5 said...

For people who claim to hate the "sty" as one poster put it, you sure spend a VERY large amount of your time talking about how they aren't bothering you. I think thy protest too much......

SamanthaNC said...

Disappointed-

You are so right. We probably should've continued to eat their BS politely with a knife and fork indefinitely. I'm so sorry to have let you down....

Disappointed about season 5 said...

Thats not what Im saying. I just think for a blog that doesn't want to be part of the negativity you should have ignored what ever people were saying about you and continued speaking and promoting what you think is right. What does it mater what another blog, which many here claim is full of haters, says about GDNNOP?

SamanthaNC said...

Based on your screen name I'm going to guess that A. you are a first time poster or B. don't want to share your identity.

This blog has remained silent for months- it has done no good. There comes a point when speaking up is necessary. We are all human here and I for one am just fresh out of cheeks. There is nothing wrong with defending yourself disappointed- none of us are willing to remain the dutiful doormat.

Since you either don't post here or don't want to be upfront with your usual screen name- you have no right to tell those of us that do how we should deal with the pigs and the comments directed at us.

Disappointed about season 5 said...

Nope, I haven't posted here, just thought you would like a fresh perspective on the hate you give to a hate blog. I don't post at the "sty"either, in fact I don't even like that blog but some of the comments regarding the "sty" look like they would fit right in on the hate blog.

Anya said...

Samantha said...We are all human here and I for one am just fresh out of cheeks.

Samantha, I have never heard this expression before. I love it.

I have been fresh out of cheeks for months (hope I am using this correctly!)

Mom said...

Hey disappointed. Thank you for your perspective. I think it's one thing to snark about another blog, but it's another to make comments directed at particular individuals. My definition of "hater" means a person who is "hateful." Period.

Welcome to this blog. As you can see, the pigs aren't regularly discussed here. Every once in a while, you need to blow off a little steam.

Saint said...

Disappointed...said...I think thy protest too much......

Thy what protest too much?

That doesn't make any sense. "Thy" is possessive. Did you mean "Thou?"

Then, Nope, I haven't posted here, ... I don't post at the "sty"either, in fact I don't even like that blog but ...

The lady doth protest too much, methinks.

Disappointed about season 5 said...

Saint: Believe what you want about where I post and what blogs I like, I know what is true. I didn't post here to get into an argument with any of the other bloggers because honestly how can anybody have a real argument when everything is essentially said anonymously?
A commenter was going on and on about how all the hateful things another blog is saying about people here doesn't bother them but for some reason they just couldn't leave it alone and had to keep saying that they are not bothered by it.

I chose this blog to blog at because it seemed like an honest site to talk about the Gosselin's. Its neither a hate blog or a "Kate is amazing, blah blah blah" blog. I don't like most of the things Jon and Kate do but I do realize that it is their life. I feel bad for the children because I don't think they really want to be filmed and live the "amazing" life they live, in fact I think to some degree Jon and Kate don't even like their life anymore. Its has snowballed into something larger than either one of them predicted (IMO).

Guinevere said...

For people who claim to hate the "sty" as one poster put it, you sure spend a VERY large amount of your time talking about how they aren't bothering you. I think thy protest too much......

No, a very large amount of time would be if we talked about them every day, like they do about us. This is (likely) a one-shot deal. The mods agreed it would be cathartic (and it has been).

I don't think I've said that they don't bother me at all - just that they don't bother me nearly as much as they give themselves credit for.

It's kind of sad that that would be someone's primary purpose for a blog, isn't it? To try to hurt other people (total strangers)?

I just think for a blog that doesn't want to be part of the negativity you should have ignored what ever people were saying about you and continued speaking and promoting what you think is right. What does it mater what another blog, which many here claim is full of haters, says about GDNNOP?


Excuse me, but WHO are you? I think it's a little presumptuous of you to wander on here, apparently a total stranger (or a regular hiding behind a different username) and tell us what we SHOULD do and how we should react to constant crude personal attacks.

I don't like excessive negativity. That doesn't mean I tap dance through the day singing about rainbows and unicorns. As I said above, I think it's cathartic to get the ugly stuff out in the open, if only briefly.

Nope, I haven't posted here, just thought you would like a fresh perspective on the hate you give to a hate blog. I don't post at the "sty"either, in fact I don't even like that blog but some of the comments regarding the "sty" look like they would fit right in on the hate blog.

I'm not sure why you thought we'd appreciate a stranger telling us what to do. Do you go up to people on the street and tell them that their pants make them look fat, too? If so, are you surprised when they don't appreciate your "fresh perspective"?

I have no problem copping to being unkind in some of my comments on this thread. I can recognize and acknowledge when I being a bitch, unlike some people (cough...piggies...cough) who act like their behavior, no matter how heinous, is somehow justified.

I don't pretend to be perfect. Sometimes you just need to get stuff off of your chest so you can move on. That's all this is.

Saint: Believe what you want about where I post and what blogs I like, I know what is true. I didn't post here to get into an argument with any of the other bloggers because honestly how can anybody have a real argument when everything is essentially said anonymously?

All day, everywhere, people have arguments on the internet essentially anonymously. Some people are sincere in their arguments and some people are just playing games and trying to manipulate others.

A commenter was going on and on about how all the hateful things another blog is saying about people here doesn't bother them but for some reason they just couldn't leave it alone and had to keep saying that they are not bothered by it.

I still don't understand why you would think it's appropriate to make your first post on that subject - it just seems very aggressive to me, which is what makes your motives and identity appear suspect.

If someone protests too much, and you don't believe them (I'm not sure if you're talking about me or not), that's you're prerogative. I just don't think it's something that needs to be shared with everyone unless you're trying to alienate people.

I chose this blog to blog at because it seemed like an honest site to talk about the Gosselin's. Its neither a hate blog or a "Kate is amazing, blah blah blah" blog. I don't like most of the things Jon and Kate do but I do realize that it is their life. I feel bad for the children because I don't think they really want to be filmed and live the "amazing" life they live, in fact I think to some degree Jon and Kate don't even like their life anymore. Its has snowballed into something larger than either one of them predicted (IMO).

You know, there are many threads you could have posted that sentiment in and gotten a good discussion. That would've been a much better way to join the conversation here, IMO.

Saint said...

I wondered if that little sentence at the end would irritate you, Disappointed. I considered not publishing the thought, then decided it would be OK since you'd done the same thing (almost, wrong quote) to the rest of us.

Here's a fresh perspective for you:

That you responded as if I'd been a little mean to you makes me smile. You reveal what your real intention was in your first post. Not that it wasn't obvious. :)

Turnabout is fair play.

Saint said...

Oh, and welcome, if you really did intend to stay and offer your thoughts here and there. I crashed into a few posters myself when I first posted here.

Nina Bell said...

Liz

I know how you feel about someone posting or using your personal information inappropriately. I recently have experienced the same thing. Posted in quite a few places. People had a really, really good time with it at my expense. Sucks doesn't it. That is a blue line that a person certainly should not cross.

Eileen said...

Disappointed, I'm fairly new here too, and I can see how if you read just this 'hate blog thread' you would conclude it's a main topic of conversation. It's really not though, because if it were I wouldn't keep coming back, I'd have nothing to add. I didn't realize until recently how deep feelings run on this whole subject to tell you the truth. And when you don't share the feelings of either side it's hard to understand sometimes. I am beginning to understand everyone here being wary of new posters though. I'm not going to speak for anyone here, but as an observer, while you may have been giving an innocent objective observation, I can see where it might sound like an attack by people who have been attacked here, so then of course the instinct is to respond in kind.
I think if you choose to stick around you won't be sorry.

Anya said...

Nina Bell said...That is a blue line that a person certainly should not cross.

Nina, I agree completely. What has been done to you is completely below the belt. I have frankly seen way too much of this behavior from the child advocate/privacy crowd. The sty is not the only place this has occurred. Some of the big Gosselin hate sites have participated as well in revealing other blogger's real names.

Anya said...

Eileen,

Nicely said.

Anya

Disappointed about season 5 said...

Eileen: I have read quite a few of the threads and the majority of the ones I have read have mentioned, numerous times, other blogs and how hateful they are. I do want to stick around here, but not if my identity and motives for posting is going to be questioned by so many.

Saint: Im wondering just what you think my "real intention" was?

Guinevere: Im not really sure what to say to you. I never attacked you and yet I feel like you attacked me. Im not trying to alienate people, I feel like you are trying to alienate me. Good heaven! I thought this blog was open to the public and that new posters were welcome, but I guess I assumed wrong! I don't know how else to assure everybody here that I am a new poster, and honestly at this point I don't think anything I say regarding it will matter.

Im just going to flat out state my opinions of the Gosselins and if that doesn't adhere to you guild lines, ???.
1. I don't like Kate as a person, I don't hate her but I don't think she is somebody I would want to spend any amount of time with.
2. I think Jon and Kate have made some very bad decisions regarding their family and life style, however I do realize that they aren't my decisions to make.
3. I don't think the children are truly happy, but for that matter I don't think Jon and Kate are either.
4. I don't know why their family isn't involved but its really none of my business so Im not going to speculate on it.
5. I don't know how often the nanny is there but I do know that if I were home every day with 8 kids, 6 of which are the same age, I would go CRAZY and be begging for a nanny.
7. I don't know how often Jon and Kate are home but I hope they spend adequate time with their family, from what we see I don't think Kate does.
8. I completely understand why Kate wants a career and wants to be something other than a stay at home mom.
9. I think I understand why they agreed to the show in the beginning, it sounded like easy money and a chance to tell their story. If in the same situation I think I would have also, however I hope that once things started to get crazy and privacy was invaded I would have stopped.
10. I think Jon and Kate are so involved in their life that they are really beyond stopping happily.
11. I think all the Gosselin children are lovely and for the most part well behaved, I think we just see way to much of them.
12. I think the kids are filmed way too much, but I don't think they are necessarily exploited.
13. I really think that for the good of the family the show needs to end, soon.

Im sorry for the long post but I want everybody to know where I stand. I think I covered all the major points, at least the ones that seem to keep coming up post after post.

marci said...

The correct Shakespeare quote:

Hamlet,

"The lady doth protest too much, methinks."

One of the most misquoted lines in history.

And, yes, methinks our visiting Queen Gertrude does...you know... protest...too much.;)

Liza Beth said...

Disappointed, while i can see where you are coming from it seems to me you did not read the posts in this thread and understand our perspectives. If you had, you would note that a few of us mentioned how gun shy we were of brand new posters who jump in with anonymous like screennames (i.e. names that have no Google or OpenID attached) and begin making accusations. That is why you had the responses you did-- you seem to be well versed in the Gosselin blogging world, yet are shocked that, after starting off on this blog with an accusatory statement pointing a finger at each of us who have had libelous statements said about us and hateful posts written. How is that an appropriate way to start off? I am sure you can see that if you had begun with a gentler approach your ideas and thoughts would have been heard with more gracious ears. Unfortunately many of us here are sick of being lied about and told what to do, so as you can see we (the general we) are not really in the mood to deal with a newcomer who chooses to spout off directions.

That being said, I noticed you spoke to the happiness you do not see in the Gosselin family. I just wonder what makes that a decision that you, as someone who may or may not watch a show, a person who can really speak to how a person feels in their heart.

If you read other threads you would notice that many of us think the show should stop, but since we also feel this family has the right to make their own decisions, we are thankful they have chosen to take steps towards protecting their childrens privacy while still doing the show.

Disappointed about season 5 said...

I am extremely thrilled that they have taken steps to protecting their children and family. And your right I didn't mention the positives I see, 1. They live in an amazing house, 2. The have taken many wonderful family vacations, 3. They should have all the money they need for later in life, there are many more but Im sure another long post from me isn't needed. :) Im not saying that to be rude or snarky, just that I understand why you are a little gun shy of new comers but I do wonder how you expect any new comers when they are forced into such scrutiny? I did read the posts but mine as well as other posts don't always come across the way the write hopes, therefore different interpretations and perspectives are formed.

marci said...

Disappointed,

I know there are a lot of comments in this thread, but I think many posters in this thread have expressed how new posters who come in with, shall we say, an attitude or criticizing other posters might get the stink eye at first.

Essentially, coming on and questioning what everyone's motives are for discussing the piggy site, especially when it's the first time we've done so (posted here), is a little offputting.

From my perspective, and I can't speak for anyone else, you came across as a mother scolding her children. I'd understand that reaction if someone was coming to you and complaining about someone else's behavior and you said, "Oh, just ignore them. They'll go away. Don't give it anymore of your energy."

However, YOU CAME HERE. You came to join the discussion.

Would you do that in any other social situation where you walked up to a group of people already in the middle of a conversation and weren't asked your opinion about whether they should be having the discussion in the first place?

I'm personally not nearly as bothered if someone, even a perfect stranger to this site, came on and said, "Personally, I just ignore anything anyone has to say about me that negative and I don't read what I don't like." Just generally saying it's better to ignore the negative.

And we're not even discussing your stand one way or another about the Gosselins. You're welcome to whatever your opinion is on that subject.

This is just kind of about how you would approach a group you claim to like (or at least think is fair) and want to join in the discussion. Sometimes, at least at first, less is more. JMHO

Liza Beth said...

Marci, we must have been posting at the same time-- you said what I wanted to far better than I did :).

marci said...

Liz,

Jinx. ;)
----------------

And it looks like the quote was Hamlet's in my above post. I meant it was from the play Hamlet. The quote is Queen Gertrude's.

Sorry for the English Lit lesson. I knew one day all that fancy book learnin' would come in handy. ;)

Disappointed about season 5 said...

I honestly thought this blog was open to new posters, I did not think that it should have been an issue for me to jump into the conversation. I had read the comments and many other posts before I wrote, but from now on I will only join a conversation when its fresh and new. My mistake......Im sorry I came across as rude.

Liza Beth said...

Disappointed, as a couple of us have mentioned, we *are* open to new posters. The issue was how you came across in those initial posts.

Also, it would be great if you could choose a screenname that is more... I don't know... positive, I guess? Most of us started off with random screennames then chose something new when we stuck around. I just hate having to type "Disappointed" when I respond to you, since I am not at all disappointed by your presence, but want to make sure you know my comment is directed as a response to yours :). Completely your choice, of course, but it would probably help those on this blog see you as someone who will stick around.

marci said...

Dissappointed,

I can see you want to be part of the discussion, and I think that's great.

I'm sorry you feel scolded, but, honestly, I think other people here did as well. If we all get on with the discussion(s) at hand, all will soon be forgotten.

Oh, and might I suggest changing your screen name?? I know you were expressing an opinion when you created it, but it's kind of a downer name to picture a potentially nice person behind. :)

Liza Beth said...

Marci,

Jinx AGAIN!!

That is so funny-- I got done with my last comments then went to see if there were any new ones and noticed your response as well.

We must be on the same wave length this evening!

Guinevere said...

I have read quite a few of the threads and the majority of the ones I have read have mentioned, numerous times, other blogs and how hateful they are. I do want to stick around here, but not if my identity and motives for posting is going to be questioned by so many.

Can I ask why you want to be here? I mean that as a sincere question. Okay, you like that we are neither totally pro- or anti-Gosselin. But other than that, you seem to have some pretty major criticisms of the way we do things.

It's really hard to believe in your sincerity when you come in here and your first posts are criticisms of the way the blog is run and its content. I have to conclude that is either 1) clueless rudeness or 2) trolling.

Im not really sure what to say to you. I never attacked you and yet I feel like you attacked me. Im not trying to alienate people, I feel like you are trying to alienate me.

How did I attack you? I don't want to play passive-aggressive games. If you don't understand that it's rude to come here and use your first posts to criticize the way we do things, and then try to justify said rudeness by claiming to offer "a fresh perspective", then I don't know what to tell you. Again, see 1) and 2) above. I really can't see any other motives for your behavior besides one of those two.

Good heaven! I thought this blog was open to the public and that new posters were welcome, but I guess I assumed wrong!

It's open to the public and we welcome new posters. It's nicer when their first post isn't a criticism of our blog and our posters.

Im just going to flat out state my opinions of the Gosselins and if that doesn't adhere to you guild lines, ???.

I don't think we have any hard and fast guidelines about opinions that can be stated about the Gosselins. We don't allow insults directed at the children.

Jacelynn said...

I would love to stick around, I really think that this blog has a fair view on the Gosselin's.

Jacelynn (formerly Disappointed about season 5)

marci said...

Dissappointed said...
I honestly thought this blog was open to new posters, I did not think that it should have been an issue for me to jump into the conversation. I had read the comments and many other posts before I wrote, but from now on I will only join a conversation when its fresh and new. My mistake......Im sorry I came across as rude.


We're writing at the same time, so I understand the lag in communication here.

No one said you couldn't join a converation in progress. The issue was your approach, that's all.

Not to say you won't bump heads with someone else in the future, but, if you post long enough, you'll generally get the flow of the blog and eveyone's personality...or just grow tougher skin.

Liza Beth said...

Jacelynn, thanks for switching things up :). As a few of us have mentioned, we really do want new posters. I know that a couple of us started off on the wrong foot with other bloggers but that is soon forgotten anyway.

It would be great if you stuck around- I do appreciate your fresh perspective, and hope you can see that we were more thrown off by how you came across than the views you shared.

Jacelynn said...

marci, and Liza Beth, thank you. I would like to get on with the discussion at hand.

Guinevere: Im just not going to respond to your comments, I just want you to know that I did read them and Im sorry you don't seem to want me here. I do want to be part of this blog because I think its one of the better Gosselin blogs.

indianprincess said...

Welcome Jacelynn, Hope you stick around!!

Jacelynn said...

Liza Beth: I do understand that they way I approached my first post here may not have been the best but honestly after reading for so long I just had to say something and I didn't take the time to really edit my comment. I apologize.

marci said...

Jacelynn,

See, I knew you wanted to come and play!

Liz,

Omigod!! We're, like, doctorate twinsies separated at birth or something?

Here'e one for the next five posts....JINX!

Jacelynn said...

Thanks indianprincess, I do plan on sticking around and I really like reading all the comments and viewpoints others have.

Liza Beth said...

Nina, and everyone else who expressed an opinion on what happened with my nephews picture, thank you for your concern. Honestly, I feel like when others choose to act this way it says far more about their character than it does about those they are attacking.

I think what we can all walk away remembering is that there are people behind these screennames who may or may not get your sense of humor, writing style, and personality. Add to that the communication medium of the internet and you have a recipe for misunderstandings and confusion. I know we try hard here to clear those situations up and make sure people realize we appreciate who they are, though we may not appreciate how they said something or came across.

If we all knew each other in person it would be far different, I think... but we don't so this is the best we can do. I've learned a LOT since starting on this blog about just trying to see things from a different perspective and allowing people the chance to explain their views. Makes life easier when we can all get a word in edgewise then clarify if needed, ya know?

Marci, we are definitely doctorate twinsies! That is so funny :).

marci said...

Jacelynn,

You may not think so right now, but one day you'll be glad to have Guin on your side. I promise.

Jacelynn said...

Thanks for the advice Marci, the only problem is Im not sure she is on my side :S

Nina Bell said...

I second what Marci said.

Nina Bell said...

Guin is truly on the side of fairness. Honest to a fault and will always let you know how she feels. Many people have said that is why they read the blog. She gets way too much crap for being honest.

indianprincess said...

You may not think so right now, but one day you'll be glad to have Guin on your side. I promise.
Second that!

marci said...

I second what Nina said.

Don't worry Jacelynn, she's a good egg.

Jacelynn said...

She must really be a nice person to have so man sticking up for her. :) Its nice to see that people here are willing to stick up for one another. I don't think Guin isn't nice or anything like that I just think we completely misunderstood each other and things went farther than we both wanted (at least on my part).

marci said...

LOL, Indianprincess and Nina!

It's JINX all around tonight!

indianprincess said...

lol..Nina, didn't see your post.

indianprincess said...

lol..do I win a price?

marci said...

Jacelynn,

I don't know what Guin's favorite dessert is, or I'd tell you to send her some as a peace offering.

And...misunderstandings have led to many a heated discussion on this blog. If you learn to stick it out and take the time to explain yourself (like you did), it usually resolves itself.

marci said...

Hmmmm...

But don't let Indianprincess near your cake! (avatar)

marci said...

Yes, IP,

Your "price" is all that...and a bag of chips. ;)

Jacelynn said...

lol I would love to send something to Guin ;) My family and friends tell me Im a great baker. :) lol How about I send some double chocolate brownies to everybody? Every woman loves chocolate right? They even have yummy chocolate icing. :)

indianprincess said...

Marci, too bad I can't eat cake so no worries with posters here but everywhere else I may have to steal it and then sell it on ebay :)

Anya said...

Welcome Jacelynn, pretty name by the way.

We do have a poster by the name of Jace too.

Lucky we aren't too big a crowd, so it's pretty easy to keep everyone straight.

Consider getting a google i.d. at some point. It's a good way to keep your name and also join in the avatar fun. If you need any help, just let us know.

Anya said...

Welcome Jacelynn, pretty name by the way.

We do have a poster by the name of Jace too.

Lucky we aren't too big a crowd, so it's pretty easy to keep everyone straight.

Consider getting a google i.d. at some point. It's a good way to keep your name and also join in the avatar fun. If you need any help, just let us know.

marci said...

Jacelynn,

Brownies???????? Did someone say, BROWNIES?????????????

You can be my best friend!

marci said...

LOL!

Anya jinxed herself!!

I'm telling you, there's something in the air tonight....

Jacelynn said...

Thanks Anya, honestly I have no clue how to set up an account so any help/advise would be GREATLY appreciated. :) I didn't realize there was already a Jace, sorry bout that. Thanks I like my name too, lol its actually my middle name. :) I figured Ashley was pretty common and easily confusable.

Jacelynn said...

Lol, thanks Marci. And yes brownies with chocolate chunks and chocolate icing! I know sounds overly chocolaty but its soooo yummy.

Jacelynn said...

Is anybody missing not having a new episode? I actually did miss it on Monday, I didn't think I would but it was kinda weird to see a rerun.

Jacelynn said...

Opps sorry I hit publish and didn't mean to. Here's the rest of my comment.


Although it is nice to see the Gosselin kids have some time off, if indeed the filming did stop. Im also wondering if anybody watched 12 at the Table or Table for 12 ( I can't remember what it is called)? Or maybe this isn't the blog for that?

marci said...

Jacelynn,

Considering we had ten months straight of new episodes almost every Monday, it IS a little wierd.

You know they're doing a "Going Green" special in April (the 18th, I think) and the new season starts the middle to end of May (the 22nd or 23rd...I thought that's what Oprah mentioned when they were on her show last)?

If I've got any of these dates wrong, someone let me know.

marci said...

Jacelynn,

Yep, Table for 12...some of us have talked about it here.

Jacelynn said...

I don't know the dates but I am looking forward to the Going Green show. Whether or not they are doing it simply for ratings or whatnot I think its a great thing to do. :)

I liked Table for 12, I think the parents are hilarious. I don't like that they are choosing to film their kids but..... its not my choice.


I would like to know what you guys think about the Gosselin kids being exploited? Im not sure they are, I mean there are MANY child actors...

Eileen said...

Jacelynn, I'm glad you decided to stay around, sometimes it's lonely being the 'new' one, now I have company!
I did see some snips of a few episodes of Table for 12, I'm not really into these shows anymore, but I did like that family and I do admire the parents. Both my daughters used to watch Jon & Kate faithfully, my older daughter has moved on but my younger daughter still loves them. Me, not so much, I don't watch anymore.
I don't know if the children on any of these reality TV shows are being exploited because I'm not really privy to what goes on, but I would demand that the same protective laws apply to them as child actors if I were their parents. I would be pro-active in trying to pass some kind of legislation. I would not want there to be even a hint of scandal as far as that was concerned. That's my opinion for all the parents and not just Jon & Kate.
Again, glad you decided to stay around!

Jacelynn said...

Eileen: Thanks :) I used to watch every Monday and now if Im not busy I will watch but towards the end of this past season I found myself switching midway through. Im not really aware of the PA state laws or anything but I do think that if the children were is serious harm, like life threatening, the Gosselins, Figure 8, TLC and many others would not be allowed to do what they are doing.

A Mom-ynous said...

Well shoot, what did I miss, now?

And did they snark on my poster name? I invented it after all. lol!

I find the--8th grade attitude extends well beyond the Gosselin fan and anti-fan blogs.

I find this in many places including mostly any topics involving politics or religious issues.

Most often, when a party is so...fed up with the opposing view, they will then resort to 8th grade bullying behavior and an us versus them mentality. They check their principles and morals at the door and go cutthroat with the "neener neener neener" attitudes and generalizations.

While I have not had the knowledge nor honor (or dishonor) to visit a "princess" board, the topic of this post really is not isolated in the community of Gosselin-ites (or those with Gossline-hatred-itus).

It is a mark of those who lack the debate skills to artfully, tactfully, respectfully and factually to defend their viewpoint regardless of the topic.

If I was hell bent on hating lettuce and started the anti-lettuce community with all sorts of facts about lettuce--and a lettuce lover came along, I could defend my hatred of lettuce without generalizing lettuce lovers.

But there are some--who just can't do that. They must say that "all lettuce lovers are alike. What sheepstables!"

Thankfully, I have a bit of education that while my thoughts may not always be properly formulated (I have weird way about getting stuff mixed up in my head)--I can have a grown up discussion...b/c I do have a higher education than Jethro and his 6th grade edgumacation.

Mom said...

Amom -

"edgumacation"

That is too funny! Thanks for posting.

I like lettuce, by the way! ;-)

Eileen said...

I think when passions are high tempers aren't far behind. I know I've lost my head and have said some really idiotic things and once they're out there, well, there is no way to take it back. It's especially bad when it's put in writing. I cringe just thinking of some of my past mistakes.

AAP said...

Thanks Merryway. It was fun while it lasted. I'll try to post here more, but it's hard when I haven't been watching the show. I like to be somewhat informed when I make my comments :-).

AAP said...

Jacelynn -

I tried telling Guin "be nice to the newbies" but this is her being nice. Just kidding. I felt the same way when I first started posting here, but if you give the people here a chance they will do the same for you.

In Guin's defense, if you had posted on a different thread, one that wasn't affliated with a hate blog directed at GDNNOP, you might have gotten a different welcome. Considering the topic, your 1st screen name, and the tone of some of your posts, it's natural that she would think you're a troll trying to start an arguement.

I'm glad you worked it out and I hope you stick around. We have some great conversations around here, and not just about Jon and Kate.

Jacelynn said...

AAP, thanks, as I said before I do plan on sticking around. I like the blog, and I really like that not everything is about Jon and Kate. :)

Saint said...

Wow, I missed a lot of commenting with Disappointed/Jacelyn, but the thread ended on an upbeat note, so welcome, Jacelyn. I hope to read more from you.

Jacelynn said...

Thanks Saint :)

Theresa said...

I, too, just got caught up on reading the day's thread.

Welcome Jacelynn!

Jacelynn said...

Thanks Theresa! I feel like Im constantly adding thank you comments so to all those who welcome me here Thank You!

jabbasmama said...

All I know is this, I've been following this whole online thing for about a year now regarding J&K, have posted on 1 other blog, and frankly just want a place like this that is neither completley pro nor anti-Gosselin. This blog seems like 1 of those type of even keel blogs. I will say that there are many things that I don't agree with in terms of j&k, but like most others started to look to Kate as an inspiration, my mantra was basically if she can do it with 8, i can do it with 2, loved the show when it started but when I stumbled upon the blogs last year that started to sway me a bit and watching the show that was once a joy for me, became pretty much no longer fun to watch for one reason or another. The catalyst for me is this, my last child was born prematurely, and knowing that the tups were of course prematurely, in some ways it made me sad to see the way that she treats them, not to say that she abuses them or anything, and I just got me to wonder why in the world these kids were now exposed to the world in this way through the show. Having my preemie just made me think that I couldn't imagine doing that to him, by IMHO, letting the world peer in to their childhood.

All I want to do here is not be afraid to post my opinions without being condemned for them, I'm not here to attack or be attacked, this blog seems a lot more nice and a lot more friendly then the "other" blog, so there you go. That's all.

Nina Bell said...

Welcome jabbasmama,

Nice to have you here. We like to talk about a lot of other things besides the Gosselins here also.

Jacelynn said...

Hi jabbasmama! I have only been here for a day or so but it is a pretty awesome blog :). The ladies are friendly and helpful. I hope you enjoy the blog as much or as more as I do. :)

Anya said...

Hi Jabbasmama:

Nice to see a new face. :-)

Sounds like you will have a perspective to add that many of us don't.

I hope to see you posting a lot on Gosselin and non-Gosselin related threads.

Hope you are having an awesome weekend.

Nina Bell said...

I want to take this opportunity to comment about Fiona's statement that I banned her because she publicly humiliated me.

Back in January someone made a statement that the Gosselin children should not have been taken out of school to do an interview. I asked the question of how do we know that these children did indeed miss school. If they did miss school, I stated that attendance at school is best decided on by the parent, teacher and administration.

Fiona countered with a statement that no one should miss school unless it is an emergency or medical reason.

I countered with "I guess the Obama girls should have been in school on January 20th 2009." Pointing out the obvious. That Fiona has different standards for Kate.

I also think that Fiona was a little testy at the time because we had recently done a post about sock puppeting. There were some links to a specific Topix board.

Well obviously my statement did not set well with Fiona and she somehow gets the impression that she "publicly humiliated" me. Sorry Fiona , you only humiliate yourself. Making that statement 100 times does not make it true. I stand by my statement. You did not publicly humiliate me.

I also continued to allow the majority of her posts through for I think about 3 more weeks. However, I am not going to babysit this blog and she just became to much to deal with.

That is my take on this situation. I am sure Fiona will let you all know hers again.

I would also like to take the opportunity to state the obvious. There is a lot more that goes on in emails and unpublished comments or "behind the scenes" so to speak that shape the way we do things or perceive something sometimes.

I am thinking back to a particular regular on the piggy board who went to the trouble to create a google ID and some type of pig avatar. She wanted to come here and play with us or mess with us. Comments were posted with the intention to rile the bloggers here and the mods. It was obvious to us what was going on. So when we didn't play or bite, she went on another blog to tell them what horrible people we were. That seems to be a standard of practice.

And they wonder why we don't post their comments.

Jacelynn said...

After reading about Fiona I completely understand why the mods here were hesitant to publish my comments. Again I am so sorry, but I just wanted to say that it is obvious you gals put a lot of work into this blog to keep things running smoothly. Thanks for all your hard work ladies! :)

Liza Beth said...

Nina said "I would also like to take the opportunity to state the obvious. There is a lot more that goes on in emails and unpublished comments or "behind the scenes" so to speak that shape the way we do things or perceive something sometimes."

This is SO true. I was amazed when I began helping out with moderating just how much junk Nina and the others have had to deal with. I've had my fair share of people choosing to attack me personally, which makes me even more cautious with how I treat others. Just because I do not agree with someones opinion does not make them a bad person anymore than someone disagreeing with me makes me a bad person. We can all agree to disagree and move forward like adults- without personal attacks or vendettas.

Like Nina said, this is about so much more than the comments posted here. I have a few emails some have sent me which were extremely offensive and just hateful. They made me realize that some people are just looking for a fight instead of a discussion where both people can learn something new. It is disappointing, but I suppose that is just how life is.

Florida Mom said...

Nina Bell,
I always thought you and the mods take the high road. You never really get into specifics about the abuse that you encounter. I stumbled across Fiona's site--she's got issues!
As far as Guin is concerned, I think she is respectful and keeps things lively.
You don't have to publish this, I just wanted you to know that I appreciate the crazy that you gals are exposed to on a daily basis.

Saint said...

I agree with Florida Mom. I was surprised too when I saw that site...and sad.

tintin said...

I am really stunned by what I'm reading in Fiona's blog. I just wanted to take a look-see based on Saint's last comment.

This person is sad, sad, sad.

I am not a fan of the show as my previous comments can attest to, but neither am I a fan of juvenile action.

The fact that there are people who agree with her just make me scared for the world. There is always people like that, somewhere.

I just read this interesting book called Queen Bee moms and Kingpin Dads (read it at the bookstore but didn't buy, we are on a budget just like a majority of people). A few of the pages lists just atrocious behavior by moms and dads. I was really sorry to pick up that book because before I was blissfully unconcerned about having to face the world of academia where the moms act like junior high all over again.

F's blog contents just brought it all back again.

Good think my daughter is only 19 mos!

Jacelynn said...

Oh My Lord!!! I never read any of Fiona's blog, mainly because I didn't really know who she was or anything, but after some of the comments I had to read it. The way you guys talk about her makes her seem like a saint compared to what she is really like. Congrats to GDNNOP, you guys really take the high road.

Anya said...

tintin said...I just read this interesting book called Queen Bee moms and Kingpin Dads (read it at the bookstore but didn't buy, we are on a budget just like a majority of people). A few of the pages lists just atrocious behavior by moms and dads. I was really sorry to pick up that book because before I was blissfully unconcerned about having to face the world of academia where the moms act like junior high all over again.

F's blog contents just brought it all back again.

Good think my daughter is only 19 mos!


That book sounds interesting. I'll have to take a look the next time I am at Border's.

A lot of juvenile behavior does happen on these Gosselin blogs. I am not picking on any one poster. I think my larger issue may not even be the silly "blog wars". Rather, I have been really dismayed at some who have taken the concept of "snark" - which can be fun if done right - and just turned into an big ol' hate fest.

Enjoy your little one. 19 months is such a fun age.

tintin said...

Anya, it was a great read. I decided not to buy it for two reason. The budget like I mentioned, and I didn't want to read something that could stress me out further. I'd rather stay ignorant, act the way I always do and attract positive people, even in my daughter's school.

But if you're interested and don't have my qualms, i'd recommend it for the insight and the anecdotes. Some of the things remind me of blog "wars". Nasty emails back and forth. Only in the book, one of the mothers thinks she can do a better job than her daughter and starts penning the emails herself!

Some people just never grow up, and retain the maturity of a teenager. In fact, I'd say I know teens with better sense of control and sense in general than the ones I've seen displayed by adults surrounding the Gosselin issue.

merryway said...

I have never cared, but since the thread is here and for the record:
I can't recall one article where I've left a comment. The only anti-G site I have posted on was GWOP around a year ago. So, if you see “me” out there, it's not me. It's obvious anyway, but I've seen where it's written to be less so.

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