Saturday, August 23, 2008

OPEN DISCUSSION


I AM CLOSING OPEN DISCUSSION FOR THE REST OF THE DAY BECAUSE THERE ARE CERTAIN POSTERS WHO JUST WANT TO PLAY GAMES.
IT HAS BEEN THAT KIND OF A DAY FOLKS! 08/25/08

167 comments:

anya said...

I think it's appropriate to start this off with a big THANK YOU to Ninabell for starting this site and all the hard work she's put into it. Remember, folks, she is doing this all on her own (with some guest contributors, of course). It's a LOT of work and I think we should all recognize that. For a lot of us, this site fills a niche that we haven't been able to find anywhere else.

More positives: the daily pupply and the book review are great additions and much appreciated. Yes, there is life beyond J&K (I have to remind myself of that sometimes. :)

Thanks, Ninabell!

I GUESS WE HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO said...

Thanks Anya,

The book review was sent in by someone who reads the site. So if anyone else wants to contribute please do. E Blogger just added the other things you see on the side. They are free to the blog and are called gadgets. There are thousands to pick from. Sometimes you will se ads on these gadgets. That is associated with Google and they receive the advertising money, not this blog.

Daisy said...

I second that Anya!

I'll be out of town for a couple of weeks without a computer, so I hope everyone has a good mid August!

Guinevere said...

Yes, thanks, Nina Bell, for all of your hard work. I like the Daily Puppy. I have the Daily Kitten on my Google home page at work.

I like to check out the Cheeky Quote gadget, too.

amy said...

a BIG OL' thanks to nina as well ;)

she is a hard worker and should be recognized for it!

Linda said...

Thank you to Nina for starting the blog and for the hard work associated with it.

I GUESS WE HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO said...

Your welcome and, ok, enough about me.

Anonymous said...

This blog is really nothing more than a cheap ripoff of GWOP- the format of guest contributors, the name of the site and the discussion. What a waste. Attention starved whiner.

I GUESS WE HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO said...

Thank you very much anon 4:45. Just keep proving our point.

Anonymous said...

OK here's a discussion point. How is the National Enquirer suddenly a trustworthy piece of journalism? They pursue one story about John Edwards, and now all the anti-Gosselin crowd is just sure that the same tabloid will expose the Gosselins for what they truly are. I'm really scratching my head over this issue.

Also, I'd like to see what people really think about Aunt Jodi's sister's blog (Julie). If she is credible, what do you think? Could I blog about my sister's brother in law (in my case) and accurately portray a situation? Does her blog really assist the truth in coming out? If you were in this situation, how would you feel if you were Jodi? I personally think this blog might make a potentially bad situation even worse, but who knows.

anya said...

Hmmm. I don't see a cutie by the name of Tessie on any other blog I have visited today!

(Seriously, she's freakin adorable!)

:)

Anonymous said...

I will have to admit, when Julie's blog came out I was curious. I checked back every couple of days to read it. I am pretty confident that she is the sister. Now she is so involved with answering every little question and being the "expert witness", that she has lost all credibility in my eyes. I feel she has done more harm to Jodi than good. Why hasn't Jodi came out to support her. If the Gosselins have nothing to do with her and they are moving, what does she have to fear?

Anonymous said...

My vote is no for Julies blog being credible. It might really be Jodis sister, but its clear to me that its a bunch of sour grapes. If Jodi has approved her actions, then my opinion of Jodi is lower than my opinion of Kate. Today she posted something about Jon and Kate picking on Pennsylvania right in front of Jodi and Kevin! Can you imagine?? @@ Big hairy deal! If they were mocking Pennsylvanians, then obviously they were mocking themselves as well. Julie doesnt give a rats ass about the Gosselin kids and it appears Jodi doesnt either to allow her sister be involved in this mission to bring down the family.

Anonymous said...

That is a very good point. I think I have read in the past that she started her blog so the truth could get out. I don't recall her ever saying she was an advocate for the children. Just her sister. Now she is a moderator or answering questions on a blog that is advocating "for the children." But it seems like the only thing she is advocating for is to get even.

Anonymous said...

Hasn't GWoP already exposed the Gosselins for what they truly are? Are they not a site that is read world wide with 100,000's of visits. Even if the GwoP er I mean the National Enquirer came out with another article do they really think that people will care. This show might be big on TLC but most of the US does not know who they are or care what they are doing. They might read it. But they won't care and they won't even remember the name of the show.

Anonymous said...

Now she is a moderator or answering questions on a blog that is advocating "for the children.

Would you feel better if she answered questions over here?

FGF said...

This blog is really nothing more than a cheap ripoff of GWOP-

That's us. GWoP Lite. Great Taste, Less Psycho

Attention starved whiner.

Just curious. Is that the screen name you were signing off with, or are you attempting to insult someone?

anya said...

I personally think this blog might make a potentially bad situation even worse...

You think? How could it not put more strain on the relationship between the couples? Honestly, I didn't think I could have less respect for "Julie" than I already did, but her recent gossipy, nasty posts (i.e., Jodi would never leave HER kids with Kate) have set a new low for a woman who is already mingling in the gutter. I'm sick of her coy little games too - "I'll tell you this little tidbit, but believe me, the REAL truth is so much worse."

I'd like to know how she can look her kids (kid?) in the eyes and tell them to take the high road in life and not engage in petty disputes.

I wouldn't leave my cat in this woman's care.

Anonymous said...

This blog is really nothing more than a cheap ripoff of GWOP- the format of guest contributors, the name of the site and the discussion. What a waste. Attention starved whiner.

I find this extremely humorous, as GWoP was started after they could no longer post discussion at TWoP. The very name, and content, is a "cheap ripoff," if you will, of the board at TWoP.

anya said...

GWoP Lite. Great Taste, Less Psycho

Well, if we really are the carbon copy Anon thinks we are, we could have a Comment of the Weak (Week, I mean Week).

GWoP Lite would would get my vote.

I GUESS WE HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO said...

fgf,

Too funny!
"That's us. GWoP Lite. Great Taste, Less Psycho"

That can be our mission statement since we don't have one.

I GUESS WE HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO said...

anya,

Comment of the weak. You guys are on a roll tonight.

amy said...

anon 4:45-

something sounds so familiar about you.


julie is the most pestilent individual. what purpose is she serving? her "mission" certainly doesn't align with her actions against the G's!

btw...fgf and anya-ya'll are cracking me up! soooo clever the 2of you are!

Guinevere said...

This blog is really nothing more than a cheap ripoff of GWOP- the format of guest contributors, the name of the site and the discussion.

And where did GWoP get its name from, again?

I wasn't aware that they were the first blog in the world with guest contributors, though. Awesome!

What a waste.

But, alas, not such a waste that you couldn't find the time to post here, eh?

Attention starved whiner.

That is totally the name of my garage band!

I GUESS WE HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO said...

Attention starved whiner.

"That is totally the name of my garage band!"




I think anon 4:45 has totally inspired us to have a comment of the "weak."

Linda said...

It's funny that Jodi's supposed sister Julie has been brought up.

I've had my share of problems with controlling in-laws. I've shared those things with my sister who has been really suportive and wise.

Her advice? Don't be a pushover, but you will never regret being nice.

And she was right. My in-laws have done some really controlling and even under-handed things over the years. For the most part, my husband and I have succeeded in taking the high road.

What would I have done and what had been the ripple effect had my sister taken my private anguish and shared it with the entire world?

What would I have done and what had been the ripple effect had my sister shared those stresses and not given her actual name but felt free to share my name and private stresses with the cybersphere?

If "Julie" is who she says she is her blog also displays a lack of confidence in Jodi and makes an already bad situation worse.

I also think that if Jodi even slightly consented to the publication of this information then my opinion of her has dropped.

That being said, I'm not entirely convinced that Julie is who she says she is or that her motives are other than some kind of revenge for a perceived wrong or imagined injustice.

Sure, she has provided a couple of recent photos. Those could have quite easily been gathered from a facebook or flickr account. She has even provided a picture from "Easter 1992" which the blog owner says is of Jodi and Julie.

But, what is missing?

Julie's name. First, maiden and last name.

And ... that being said ... the question that has to be asked is WHY?

What motivates someone to share family information with complete strangers? The truth? The power? The attention?

FGF said...

Attention starved whiner.

That is totally the name of my garage band!


Singing their hits, "Potty All the Time," "Don't Let the Gum Go Down on My Socks," and "Blanket on the Laundry Room Floor Blues."

jen said...

Julie keeps saying that Jodi and Kevin want the "truth" to come out. If that's true, why are they having someone else feed us this truth? Julie is already saying that Jodi say's it okay. What more harm will it do if Jodi just confirms it?

Honestly, my guess is that it is Jodi's sister. I think maybe some of what Julie said was true, but I'm fairly sure it's been embellished and twisted so that it sounds so much worse than it is.

finn said...

Julie keeps saying that Jodi and Kevin want the "truth" to come out. If that's true, why are they having someone else feed us this truth? Julie is already saying that Jodi say's it okay. What more harm will it do if Jodi just confirms it?

Honestly, my guess is that it is Jodi's sister. I think maybe some of what Julie said was true, but I'm fairly sure it's been embellished and twisted so that it sounds so much worse than it is.


My guess is that Jodi, for the sake of trying to still be able to have contact with her nieces and nephews doesn't want the information coming directly from her.

The stories, IMO don't feel exaggerated to me.

This is just my opinion, Jodi took care of the tups, she loves them, there may have been slights or things said between her Kate that Jodi tries to give Kate the benefit of the doubt, after all she is her husband's sister. When it was revealed to her that it was Kate who did not want her to benefit from the show - don't you think it made Jodi re-evaluate all the slights, remarks, etc?

I think it is human nature not to want to believe that people can be mean.

jax said...

If she is truly Jodi's sis, I too wonder what motivates her.

Just glad she's not a member of my family!

If the blog is legit, this entire thing is so very hurtful for the G's kids and Jodi's. Didn't anyone think of the ramifications this would have on the children!

finn said...

But, what is missing?

Julie's name. First, maiden and last name.


I thought it was the belief here that that kind of information is going passed the privacy barrier.

If she were to provide that type of information she would be subject to the same "stalking" that has been protested against here.

This is totally off topic, but I had a friend who posted pictures on her Flickr and people would "steal" pictures of her kids and pass them off as their own. The thief got called out - you never know who is lurking. I would think, that if that were really not Jodi and her sister - the "real" people in question would have already surfaced. IMO

Guinevere said...

OK here's a discussion point. How is the National Enquirer suddenly a trustworthy piece of journalism? They pursue one story about John Edwards, and now all the anti-Gosselin crowd is just sure that the same tabloid will expose the Gosselins for what they truly are. I'm really scratching my head over this issue.

The Enquirer does do its due diligence on big, "important" stories. I tend to believe them on things when they don't equivocate. The Gosselin story wasn't big or important, and it was full of equivocation; everything was "our source* says." I put it on par with their little items about how Hugh Jackman or whoever helped some woman change a tire on Hollywood Boulevard.

I think the NE has a lot more creditability (though no less sleaze) when they actually have a reporter working on a case, as opposed to people with an axe to grind feeding them a story about fairly low-level celebrities.

* Obviously Bitter Julie or Serena or one of the other GWoP minions.

Also, I'd like to see what people really think about Aunt Jodi's sister's blog (Julie). If she is credible, what do you think? Could I blog about my sister's brother in law (in my case) and accurately portray a situation? Does her blog really assist the truth in coming out? If you were in this situation, how would you feel if you were Jodi? I personally think this blog might make a potentially bad situation even worse, but who knows.

I have a real visceral distaste for Bitter Julie, and I'll admit it's partly because she gives the GWoPpers ammunition. Putting aside her credibility for a moment, I think she's an incredibly tacky, low-class individual. I mean, someone told me that she was slamming Kate (something about the potties again, sigh), based on having been a guest at J&K's house for Easter two years ago. What kind of person uses the opportunity afforded by being A GUEST IN SOMEONE'S HOME to slag that person on the internet? Was Bitter Julie raised by wolves? Bad-mannered wolves? Just really, really trashy, classless behavior, IMO.

I will say that I would think she's lessened her creditibility (much like the GWoPpers in general have) by widening her focus from her original point (how mean Kate was to Jodi!) to how Kate Sucks in Every Way. It seems like there isn't a discussion going on at GWoP that Bitter Julie doesn't have a handy anecdote to illustrate the truth of (everyone is clutching their pearls over J&K's comments about Pennsylvania; why it just so happens that Jodi told Bitter Julie how J&K had - sniff - made fun of the Keystone State right in front of her!).

Not only do these anecdotes seem awfully...convenient, shall we say? But they seem to indicate that the sainted Jodi gossips about J&K to Bitter Julie a whole hell of a lot. I can't figure out if the sainted Jodi is not quite such a saint, after all, or Bitter Julie is just vampiric in her yearning for Gosselin dirt to bring back to the GWoPpers, and just won't leave Jodi alone. Either way, the whole story doesn't quite add up. Either Julie is a liar in addition to being bitter, or Jodi is kind of a crappy person, too.

Linda said...

I don't know.

If my sister-in-law had shared so much about my family with her sister who then posted it for the whole world to see, I don't know that I would trust that sister-in-law.

I wouldn't necessarily blame her but I might question her judgement and would be VERY VERY guarded with what I shared with her or what she saw in the future.

What's the saying? Screw me once ... shame on you. Screw me twice ... shame on me.

I have a friend who has a very strained relationship with her sister-in-law. She loves her niece and nephews though. I remind her that her, that fair or unfair, her sister controls access to the kid and if she wants a relationship with her niece and nephews, she has to go through her sister-in-law. That doesn't mean that she has to be held hostage but she also has be realistic about the influence of the mother on those kids.

She sometimes fools herself into believing that they will "choose her" because they will see through their mother, but that is highly unlikely.

The truth is that my friend and her sister-in-law are both equally control freaks probably just like Kate and Jodi's sister Julie.

jen said...

My guess is that Jodi, for the sake of trying to still be able to have contact with her nieces and nephews doesn't want the information coming directly from her.


Which I do understand. I guess if I was Kate, and I knew that my SIL's sister was blogging about me and saying those things (true or false), and saying that my SIL authorized them to be said, then it's just as bad as if it came directly from my SIL's mouth.

Okay, is anyone confused now? haha

FGF said...

I believe that Julie is who she says she is, but to me, that makes what she's doing even worse. Plus, I have a hard time thinking that Kate's own brother, a guy that Kate named one of her son's after (Joel Kevin), actually approves of having his sister-in-law trashing his sister and risking the safety of his nieces and nephews by associating and confiding with strangers on the Internet. All the talk GWoP has done about about Jon's lack of....ahem...privates, if Kevin approves of what Julie is doing, that makes him even more sackless than Jon is accused of being. Sure, hide behind your sister-in-law, Kev. Let her do your dirty work. It simply doesn't make much sense for him to do. I'd expect him to be more of a man than that. And if Jodi approves of her sister's conduct, then that makes her gutless, as well. She should be telling her sister to cool it, as to not further damage any chance she has of staying in her nieces and nephew's lives.

The whole thing seems to have started with Julie blowing off some steam on her blog and has now morphed into Julie enjoying the attention she's getting (to use a TWoP expression, a "famewhore") a bit too much. I can't respect someone like that.

Linda said...

Sure Finn I see your point.

But she has more than put Jodi out there in the middle of controversy and has surrendered Jodi's privacy. It's just a little weird to me that she hasn't provided her name to shore up her allegations. Especially since she is all about "the truth."

I'm sorry but I see her as kind of throwing her sister under the bus.

I don't think that the blog has helped the situation.

I think that in all likelihood it is a comma in the book that is the life of J&K.

I've heard of several people who've gotten pictures stolen off of their flickr or photo sharing account.
It's not that hard to do.

For instance, I could say that I'm actually this is a picture of me and my sister-in-law.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/toastforbrekkie/2764446812/

Or I could say that this is a picture of my sister when we were children ...

http://flickr.com/photos/littlemoresunshine/1619359829/in/set-72157606521912072/

Having a picture doesn't prove that I am who I say I am on a blog. It most certainly doesn't answer the question of WHY?

anya said...

"The truth is that my friend and her sister-in-law are both equally control freaks probably just like Kate and Jodi's sister Julie."

You took the words right out of my mouth! What do we most dislike in others? Quite often what we most dislike about ourselves.

I'll give Jodi the benefit of the doubt that I have afforded J&K on many occasions. *Maybe* she just can't control her sister. Who knows? Again, not claiming to have any inside knowledge, but I feel for Jodi and Kevin. They seem to be pulled in two directions. And I have seen nothing to indicate that aren't decent people.

"Bitter Julie" - yep that sums her up. There's one in every family.

Anonymous said...

I just can't imagine Jodi authorizing her sister to "get the word out" in this weird way. Why not speak for yourself? And how does this help she, Kevin, Jon and Kate get along better? I know, again, that we know very little about all the people on this show, let alone Jodi (who we saw very little of). I just would hope that neither Kevin nor Jodi would approve of this.

I also think that legally, this is a very shaky ground Julie is standing on. I can't imagine that publicly declaring such things is a good idea. I know that everyone has a right to free speech, and their opinion, but surely publicly attacking someone cannot be a good idea.

finn said...

Linda, you were the one who mentioned your relationship with your sister. I do not have any siblings but I have seen first hand how strong that bond can be. My father, I can honestly say is a great son and brother (see I told you I understand not everyone has great relationships with their parents). Now if you were maligned in a such a way but were powerless to do anything regarding your in-laws - don't you think your sister would do anything in her power to help you or clear your name, per se? This is Julie's position, IMO. Maybe it's a cultural thing as well - in my culture everything is everyone's business so it's not odd to me that Julie is revealing dirty laundry.

anya said...

"Now if you were maligned in a such a way but were powerless to do anything regarding your in-laws - don't you think your sister would do anything in her power to help you"

Finn, I realize your post was directed at Linda, but if I may...

I *get* that Julie may feel her sister was maligned. "Get" - don't necessarily agree, but "get". I have a sister and if anyone hurt her, you bet I would be angry. As a mature adult, however, I hope I would take a step back and realize that creating a blog to air our family's dirty laundry on the internet would be not doing anything productive to "help" my sister. Quite simply, I would be making what is probably already a touchy situation a lot worse.

Anya

P.S. On a much lighter note, I am still trying to come up with something halfway as clever as Fgf's "Potty All the Time", and other Gosselin classics.

finn said...

I am sorry I meant to clarify, there are a lot of things "I get" or "I understand" or "I relate" or "can see where he/she is coming from" - but most definitely would not react in the same manner. I think part of the balanced conversation thing is trying to see where the other side is coming from.

Linda said...

Finn,

Oh believe me Finn. My sister and I fantasized about it. One of my in-laws was very prominent in the small community that they lived. Not a celebrity but very well-known.

Revealing their level of under-handedness would have temporarily been very satisfying and very justified considering the kind of people they claimed to be.

But the ramifications would have been far-reaching and probably irreparable. I also think that it would have revealed as much about me and my character as it would've about them.

I understand that bond between sisters and I'm grateful for the support that I received from my sister and her lack of interference. She didn't add more complications to an already complicated situation.

Now, back to the specifics on this drama.

I'm not sure that Jodi was publicly maligned.
The infamous "gum-gate" episode showed how Kate flipped out about the gum on Collin's lovey bear. It also showed Kate exasperatingly say, "Who gives 6 three year olds gum?" and then it showed Kate call Jodi to say, "Can you not give them gum anymore?"

To me, Kate revealed Kate. But that wasn't anything new. We all know she is a germaphobe and says things like, "Now clean and order. That excites me."

Huh? Who says that.

But really Julie revealed way more and in her attempt to publicly defend Jodi also threw her under the bus.

I have a friend who was a partner in a failed business. When something happened in the business, his two partners turned on him. They said some very untrue and damaging things about him to quite a few people.

He went to a lawyer to investigate the possibility of suing his now former business partners. This lawyer, if you can believe it, said

"I'm not sure a law suit is the best thing. Inadvertently, you'd be giving their criticisms publicity. Now about ten people know this and it will eventually die down. Now matter how justified you feel in defending your sister, thousands of people will then find out their criticisms and this mess. Then things take on a life of their own."

I just wish that if this is really Jodi's sister someone would have said to her ...

"If you deal with this internally in the family it will probably die down. If you take this to the blogosphere then millions of people will know about this and you are potentially opening up Jodi to criticism."

See that is what gets me. If this is Jodi's sister. Julie has opened her sister up to criticism. It would have probably died down on it's own.

Jodi still wouldn't have been paid, but at least there wouldn't be this storm of controversy around her too.

On a much lighter note, check out this link about the age at which this doctor thinks it is safe for toddlers to chew gum. It isn't age three. And it isn't because it can get kids clothing or lovies dirty. It is a choking hazard.

http://parenting.ivillage.com/tp/tpnutrition/0,,3qhn,00.html

Now, I've not done all of my parenting stuff by the book but this is an interesting point to consider.

nomoredrama said...

IMO, these are the holes in the Julie/Jodi story.

1. Everyone is saying, oh, Julie is
speaking out for Jodi because Jodi still wants to carry on a relationship with the kids. Then in the next breath they are saying that Jodi has been "cut-off" along with Beth and some of the others. If she's been cut off, then what does she have to lose?

It seems from her blog entries that Julie was on the periphery of the whole situation. By that, I mean she seemingly did not have much of a relationship with J & K. Didn't really watch the show or know much about the family, only what Jodi supposedly told her. Sooo...that leads me to my next question.

2. For someone who didn't have a close relationship with this family, she seems to have a lot of 'inside information.' But yet, when she talks, she really adds nothing to the conversation only saying "you're right because I've seen it" type of posts. Well, who can argue what someone has seen or or hasn't seen? We weren't there but, from what it sounds like, neither was she.

3. If her original intent was to expose the truth of what happened on the show and she has done that, then why not gracefully bow out when the information you have given is now public? Why continue to participate in fruitless discussion and internet gossip. It's honestly not becoming and it makes her look, as some have put it, like a bitter women scorned (well, scorned vicariously).

4. The whole "being kicked out of the kids lives because Kate didn't want to pay her" story does not add up to me. It doesn't add up because it seems to me that there is more to the story and Kate's statements are being taken out of context, IMO. It's been reported that Kate wouldn't let her helpers be paid on trips because they were getting to go on trips.Well, when do normal, everyday people get an opportunity to meet Oprah, travel for free (I'm positive accommodations were paid for by TLC), etc? If I were in that position (of the helpers) and especially if it was family, I would NEVER ask for money on top of all of that. In my opinion,those things are a fair trade off. And see, Jodi is a seemingly sweet, kind individual. According to Julie, Jodi has always said that her relationship with the kids was not about money. Neither was Beth's. So why would they be up in arms about not being paid? In my opinion, if the story is true, I don't think these individuals WERE upset over this at the time(as evidenced by the fact that they didn't say no!...and please don't give me this "nobody says no to Kate because she threatens the relationship with the kids, crap. She could have easily hired helpers on TLC's dime...IMO, she asked family first because these were fun, unique, once in a lifetime opportunities that she wanted to share with those she loves, not strangers. It seems like the Julies of the world are now using information like this to paint J & K in a negative light. Well, shoot, if my sister wants to take me on an all expense paid trip to meet Oprah or Ellen for a few some help and babysitting...sign me up!

Speaking of money, if the story is true, I'm NOT saying I agree with Kate's decision to not pay Jodi (I may have handled it differently) but I think there might be an alternative way of looking at the situation (other than that Kate is a selfish, miserable, evil and mentally unstable person) and it goes something like this:

*Disclaimer* I have no inside information on what Kate thinks...this is just a theory, if you will

These family and friends were doing what family and friends do for one another. To put a price tag on what they do for the family demeans the relationship. It takes them from being someone in the kids life for the purpose of loving the kids to being an employee of TLC and/or the Gosselin's. Maybe Kate's feelings were hurt when Jodi or others wanted to be paid, should they be compensated for having a relationship with these kids whom they love? (again...just a different way to look at the situation, not necessarily my opinion) When Kate she is pulling the plug on Jodi being featured on the show (not featured in the kids lives, btw) to "save their relationshp" (this is what Julie said anyway), maybe she honestly thought she was doing that. Maybe Kate thought she was preventing what is happening now. Money tears relationships apart....and now we have the blog to prove it.

Guinevere said...

But the thing is, Jodi hadn't been maligned, at all. It wasn't like the public mistakenly thought Jodi was a horrible person, due to something Kate said or did. I never read any pro- or anti-Gosselin poster who had a bad word to say about Jodi, until this business came up.

Now, maybe if there is some germ of truth to the "Kate didn't want Jodi to get paid" story, I can see Julie being pissed about that. But she's not "defending" her sister, she's striking out at Kate 'cause she's mad at her. Which, if it were a one time thing (and again assuming the story is somewhat true; I have no way of knowing one way or another), I could understand. But what she's gone on to do - hanging out all the time at GWoP and gossiping about Kate - is tacky, classless and indefensible, IMO. And not at all helpful to or defensive of Jodi. If anything, it's made me (and some other posters, by their own comments) question Jodi's integrity.

It doesn't really add up that Jodi's not coming forward to preserve her relationship with the Gosselin kids; Julie has stated that Jodi knows and approves of the stuff that Julie is putting out on the internet. I don't see how or why the Gosselins would be any less angry over Julie acting as Jodi's mouthpiece than they would be over Jodi just coming forward herself.

Anonymous said...

Soooo how do you suppose this is working for her? I just cant see Kate thinking that since Jodi got Julie to do the dirtywork that its all good and Jodi can see the kids. I wouldnt trust Jodi within 100 ft of my kids at this point if I were Kate, its obvious Jodi hasnt put one thought into the safety of her beloved nieces/nephews. When you lay down with dogs, you get up with fleas and not even Hartz could help Jodi and Julie at this point. There is no excuse for them teaming up with the GWOP stalkers.




My guess is that Jodi, for the sake of trying to still be able to have contact with her nieces and nephews doesn't want the information coming directly from her

Anonymous said...

Excellent point. I thought Jodi was a sweet, caring aunt until now. Now when I watch her on the show I think she is a big fake. No way you can reconcile the Jodi on the show with the Jodi who gets her sister to bash the family online. Which one is the real Jodi? My bet is on the gossipy, vengeful,backstabbing Jodi.


If this is Jodi's sister. Julie has opened her sister up to criticism. It would have probably died down on it's own.

Linda said...

But anonymous 4:56, the "inside" information has come from someone so close to Jodi that I don't J&K would or could make the distinction.

I don't know if I could make the distinction.

It all reminds me of how when children make a silly excuse when they are involved in a big mess.

Take my son just this week. He brought a glass of juice into the family room which is against our house rules. My other child knocked it over.

What do you think my son said, "He knocked it over. It isn't my fault."

I look at the Julie blog in the same way if it is her. Aunt Jodi has fed her all of this information and if we are to believe Julie presumably says it is okay to publish it on the World Wide Web for everyone to see.

How can she simultaneously say that she is not in some way responsible for it.

"I didn't publish the blog. It's my sister's fault."

Yeah right.

Sounds a lot like my 10 year old.

JessieTYCG said...

This blog is really nothing more than a cheap ripoff of GWOP-

"That's us. GWoP Lite. Great Taste, Less Psycho"

LOL!! Could I suggest we go full monty on the GWOP ripoff train and nominate FGF's quote as "Quote of the Week"? That was hilarious!

JessieTYCG said...

Maybe Jodi has in Julie the great tradition of popular people with embarrassing, outspoken siblings. Jimmy Carter had Billy, Bill Clinton had Roger. Perhaps Jodi should run for office. Truth Breeds Hatred? Me Thinks Truth Breeds A Presidency! LOL!

I'm enjoying reading the comments as I sip on a Billy Beer and listen to Roger Clinton's Rock CD.

MrsRef said...

Just want to say: I read and post on both GWOP and this board and others. I try to be respectful, do not make fun of J&K or the kids physical appearance etc or call other posters names. Please please please stop lumping everyone together as GWOP'ers. I garner my own opinions of this show, not from either board but from my own observations and life experiences. The other day I was made to sound like I said the kids would be druggies, that is not what I had said at all. I don't want to side with anyone, just have mature discussion on this show. Thanks.

~J~ said...

A bit OT...

Has anyone seen the pictures of Bigfoot that are making rounds on the internet today???

anya said...

MrsRef said...
Just want to say: I read and post on both GWOP and this board and others. I try to be respectful, do not make fun of J&K or the kids physical appearance etc or call other posters names. Please please please stop lumping everyone together as GWOP'ers.


MrsRef, I don't think anyone here lumps you in as a GWoP'er. I know I don't. I personally have seen enough of your posts to know that you and I may not always agree, but you bring a fair and non-fanantical perspective. In short, you are someone one can have a discussion with.

I do have to say, however, that there is a particular mindset at that site that many posters (certainly not all) adhere to. I and some others have a genuine disagreement with it, and rather than call out individual posters, we have sometimes used shorthand and referred to them as GWoP'ers.

Please don't take personal offense. I have respect for anyone who visits both boards and attempts to have discussions with those on both sides.

anya said...

Nomoredrama said....
If her original intent was to expose the truth of what happened on the show and she has done that, then why not gracefully bow out when the information you have given is now public? Why continue to participate in fruitless discussion and internet gossip.


And therein lies 99% of the problem I have with "Bitter Julie" (shout out to Guinevere for that one).

Nomoredrama -- your analysis was spot on and much in line with my own thinking.

Linda said...

mrsref -

I do not consider you to be a "Gwopper".

You bring a reasonableness to the other side of the discussion.

anya said...

~J~ said...
"A bit OT...

Has anyone seen the pictures of Bigfoot that are making rounds on the internet today???"


I tend to put Bigfoot stories up there *credibility-wise* with some of the more bizarre statements Kate is supposed to have made. (i.e., Nobody makes money off my kids, but me. etc. etc.)

I did see there is supposed some press conference held later in the day about the "discovery". Stay tuned!

As a kid, I do remember being fascinated by the whole Bigfoot legend....

anya said...

JessieTYCG said...
"Maybe Jodi has in Julie the great tradition of popular people with embarrassing, outspoken siblings."


Too funny! I have said it before and I'll say it again -- there's one in every family!

Seriously, that's why I'll give Jodi a pass on this one until I am proved wrong (which I may well be, who knows)....

Anonymous said...

Yes, and unfortunately I have a weak stomach. G-R-O-S-S


Has anyone seen the pictures of Bigfoot that are making rounds on the internet today???

~J~ said...

That press conference has been going on for a 1/2 hour and since I'm at work I can't listen to any of it. :(

MrsRef said...

Thanks. I try to see all sides and don't want to be "lumped" in anywhere. How does it go, somewhere between this version and that version lies the truth. I spend way too much time talking about this. My family thinks I am getting a little (more) nutty! :)

JessieTYCG said...

"Has anyone seen the pictures of Bigfoot that are making the rounds on the internet today???"

Did someone put a Kate wig on it and have Bigfoot yelling things at Jon? LOL!

bigsis88 said...

I agree with OP who believe the truth is somewhere in the middle. I think Julie might just be the more "outspoken" sister, and it's possible that Jodi gave her a generic "ok" in the beginning, but doesn't keep up with the blog now. I doubt she can remember everything she told Julie over the course of however many years, so what might've seemed like a minor detail at the time could've been retained by Julie until now. It's also possible that some of Julie's information about Kate's personality was related to Jodi through Kevin. He would know her the best out of the 3 of them, certainly. I think Julie would rather be the protective sister who "takes a bullet" so to speak, rather than tarnish Jodi's reputation, since she (Julie) is not directly related to Kate.

I GUESS WE HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO said...

bigsis88,

I read on another site a statement by you that I did not post a comment you made. I went back and checked and sure enought it was there. I can not edit in comments. I moderate by myself so sometimes your comment will not show up for hours (especially if I am sleeping)and if your are on a different time zone. Also E town mom - that was very special circumstances. I was receiving multiple e-mails from bloggers regarding that situation including one from a moderator of another site. I made an administrative decision to stop her comments. I could have deleted her comments but I chose to let them stand. I hope that clears things up somewhat. You can always e-mail me and ask me why I made a decision and I will tell you what I can. Someone else e-mailed me who had read your comment as well as Etown moms and I responded to her.

I GUESS WE HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO said...

There is a new TV Review on Jon & Kate Plus 8 in Entertainment Weekly. I have posted it on the side bar under Jon & Kate Plus 8 In the News. Thanks to Jen for sending that information in.

Linda said...

A comment on another entry made me think of this.

I'm going to start naming all the events that happen in our family by calling it a "gate."

Over this summer we've had:

"Dog jumped on the table to eat the spaghetti left on table GATE"

That night, predictably, we had:

"Doggie diarrhea-GATE"

In July we had:

"Kids fell asleep in the car on the way to the 4th of July fireworks display-GATE"

Later in the same month we had:

"Mommy left a bag of once frozen fish in the minivan-GATE"

Of course, we always have things like:

"Watched too much Sponge-Bob GATE"

and of course an on-going one is ...

"If you don't turn off your Nintendo DS now you won't be able to play it for a week GATE."

And given that my younger child is in a stinker mood today, we might just have:

"If you don't eat all of your dinner no you can't have smores for dessert GATE."

anya said...

Linda,

"Smoregate". I can't BELIEVE you!

I hope you realize your poor little one will never ever get over this! S/he was waiting all day for that smore!

I guess Kate has competition for the "Meanest Mom on the Planet."

Anya :)

Fanny said...

I had a poop-gate yesterday. I don't wanna talk about it...........

GLO said...

From the EW article:
"Jon and Kate are a funny, articulate, sometimes needling couple who play out a sitcom dynamic. He's the amiable, occasionally clueless husband; she's the exacting, exasperated wife. Oh, let's face it, she's a bit of a ball-buster...The Gosselins do their interviews — and no small amount of couples therapy...and they tease each other as often as they argue...In this day of scripted reality, to see a couple actually interact with each other in a way that seems genuine — unpleasantness included — is unbelievably refreshing."
I totally agree with the author of this article, and this is one of the reasons I am a fan of the show. Do I always approve the way Jon and Kate treat each other? No, but then again, I don't always approve of the way my husband and I always treat each other. It is this level of genuiness in their show that I can relate to. Thoughts, anyone?

Fanny said...

I couldn't agree with you more, Glo.

I guess if I was perfect I might be able to relate more to the posters at gwop. I'm not so I come here to hang with all the other "terrible parents".

I heart you all.

bigsis88 said...

Igwhnbtd,
Thanks for clearing that up. It really wasn't a problem; I assumed that it wasn't published because it referenced another poster (though not negatively, I wasn't sure if that was against the rules). I just felt bad for her because I felt she was being unfairly scapegoated.

Linda said...

Which brings me to their entry entitled "Funny Friday" in which they rewrite the Railroad episode how they would've liked to see it.

Are they serious?

Is that supposed to be satire?

anya said...

"It is this level of genuiness in their show that I can relate to."

Agreed. I think most of us "less than perfect" people (which I think is just about everyone except those on a certain other Gosselin blog) can see ourselves in their exchanges. Now, a few of them have gone a little too far (veering into "Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf" territory), but for the most part, what we have seen is some fairly innocuous back and forth sniping about the everyday issues that irk them.

Another element that I find interesting is the fact that the same issues come up again and again. For Jon, it seems to be that Kate's freakouts haven gotten old and he's tends to just checkout. For Kate, she seems to feel that Jon abandons her when she needs him most. Both POV's have merit. Their communication could use some work, but I don't see anything that makes me think they are horrible people, or that Kate is the shrew that she is routinely referred to as.

The Gosselins have opened up their lives and agreed to do so without airbrushing. It is one of the elements of the show that sets it apart from other so-called reality shows. I think they should get some credit for this, but instead they seem to just get a lot of grief.

FGF said...

I like the two quotes that appear at the top of the blog, now. Good call.


I'm watching Michael Phelps after his final race tonight. I'm watching him try to wade through a sea of photographers to hand his mother his bouquet of flowers from the medal ceremony. Is he now going to have to "pay for his celebrity?" (which is an excuse people make for harassing the Gosselins) He just accomplished something that no one in history has. Is he now screwed because of it? It will be interesting to see if the jealous haters start digging into his life and bringing his DUI from four years ago back up, or finding his estranged father and sticking a microphone in his face, or writing articles about the personal family situation. Hey, he's a celebrity now. Doesn't he have that coming? I certainly hope not.

Anonymous said...

I don't really think it is the same. He actually has a talent that has happened to bring him celebrity. The Gosselins decided to be on tv to show everyone their daily lives and talk to the camera about their lives.

And just because I say this don't assume that I am a hater and want them to be treated badly, I just don't see it as being similar.

If Michael Phelps now decides to star in a reality show and put his private life on display then I would see a similarity of the Gosselins and Michael Phelps.

Michael probably will have to deal with the negatives of celebrity, but I don't see him as seeking out celebrity as much as working hard on his talent and getting recognition for it.

Guinevere said...

Which brings me to their entry entitled "Funny Friday" in which they rewrite the Railroad episode how they would've liked to see it.

Are they serious?

Is that supposed to be satire?


I don't know, but I know I had to stop reading it lest I slip into a diabetic coma (and I'm not even diabetic!). Their ideal Gosselin-land seems to involve the entire family being on some really good drugs.

I agree with fanny; I can relate more to parents who acknowledge that they aren't perfect (though we always hope to do better, of course) than to parents who pick apart someone's every action and declaim all the ways in which they could have improved on the behavior.

I don't know about the Michael Phelps/Gosselin comparison, but I do know that I'm damn sick of hearing about him. Glad swimming is finally over (I think?).

Tyra said...

’I don't really think it is the same. He actually has a talent that has happened to bring him celebrity. The Gosselins decided to be on tv to show everyone their daily lives and talk to the camera about their lives.’

For the most part, I agree with you, but there are some similarities. To a certain degree, MP has exposed his private life for public consumption. True, that hasn’t been his primary focus, but it is part of an image being built of him that will presumably be used by him in the future for the purpose of making an income, either as a spokesperson, or as a commentator. He’ll be subject to some of the same treatment that the Gosselins have gotten, people looking for more ‘inside’ info, and feeling a sense of ‘ownership’ over him, and people trying to knock him off his pedestal. God forbid that MP makes any awkward public statements, or does anything less than gracious and humble in any restaurant or other public place. Regardless, he’ll still have his own personal ‘haters’, if he doesn’t already. He’ll probably escape the level of vitriol of the anti-fans that Kate has: he’s more likeable than she is, and he’s not a woman or a mother. (Maybe MP’s mom better take cover now!)

Anonymous said...

Just something that I have noticed lately at the GWoP site - they seem to be allowing posters with a different opinion to post more on their site. On one of their more recent posts they actually have a running dialogue with someone with a different opinion. It looks vaguely familiar with what is going on here. Maybe this blog could take a little credit for what is happening there. I know if you post this you will probably get a lot of flack from them.

Fanny said...

The newest poster on gwop, BK, who says she isn't Beth Carson when asked but then eludes to being her in one of her posts, has blamed the "phenomenon" of the show and it's popularity on the fans. You can read it here:
//gosselinswithoutpity.blogspot.com/2007/08/what-did-me-in.html#comments

While I have my doubts as to who this is, I find this post really hard to swallow. The show would have never been this successful without the controversy, which they have created. Not to mention the fact that they tune in to every show so they can pick it apart.

Does she really not see that they are contibuting as much if not more to the prosperity of the show than the fans?


The author of the next comment claims that the fans are the real danger to the Gosselins citing celebrities that have been stalked by fans. I'll concede that obsessed fans could be a danger but to that extreme, one side is just as dangerous as the other.

Guinevere said...

I haven't read of any obsessed fans crossing boundaries the way that the obsessed haters are. By "boundaries" I mean going outside of watching the show and commenting on the show online. That's not to say that they don't exist; I just haven't seen anyone write about it.

I'd be most worried about the posters who hate J&K but have inappropriate attachments to the children, such as the woman who wants "Joely" to look her up in five or ten years. I can imagine someone like that thinking that they are "saving" one of the Gosselin kids, and doing something really nutty.

I read the post by BK. More of the same, with somewhat confusing typos ("buts" for "butts"?). The kid was constipated. It's uncomfortable, and little kids whine a lot. Why does every little thing have to be one of the Gosselin children on death's door while J&K ignore them.

I GUESS WE HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO said...

There is another new article posted on the side under Jon & Kate In the News.

Fanny said...

So I was just reading that other blog that was mentioned in one of the previous threads, the one where etown and manda went to snark on us, and I found something interesting that I would like everyone's thoughts on.

One comment there pointed out that there are always people coming out and saying that they know, or have met Kate and the opinion isn't so high, yet we rarely have comments from friends or neighbors who have really nice things to say about her.

My opinion of gwop would be the same if I met Kate and she truly was a bitch. I don't think it's right to use the kids as an excuse to snark and I could never be that hateful anyway. That comment just made me wonder.

Your thoughts?

Anonymous said...

Fanny,

I absolutely believe that this has very little to do with the kids or their welfare. The majority of comments are filled with snark mostly for Kate. At the end of the comment they might sneak in something about "oh those poor children."

Anonymous said...

I actually believe Kate has issues and problems. She probably has separated herself from her family. Jon appears to not be able to stand up to her all of the time. I could go on and on. If you look to the people around you, you will see these same issues and traits over and over again. Probably in yourself and in your own relationship. The bottom line is that I do not want to watch the show any less because of this. I don't care whether Kate is a "bitch." I just want to watch the show.

Linda said...

I think that doing this "for the kids" is a smokescreen for the real agenda which is to attack Kate.

I'm thinking that that some of this controversy is a very poor reflection on women in general. Some of the most nasty discussions I've witnessed (not gotten into) have been between women regarding the issues of:

Motherhood in general
Breastfeeding v. Bottle feeding
Stay at Home Mothering v. Working outside the
home

etc., etc.

I think that anonymous, you touch on why some of the interest in this show has to do with most of using knowing or being women like Kate or knowing or being married to a man like Jon.

anya said...

I GUESS WE HAVE NOTHING BETTER TO DO said...
There is another new article posted on the side under Jon & Kate In the News.


From the gal who taught them to swim:

"The camera didn't make any difference. They acted the same when the cameras were gone. I thought they might have been more hyper being filmed ... but no, that's them!" Jessica laughed."

Interesting. You mean their little lives aren't being disrupted and ruined at every turn by the presence of the cameras?

Hmm. Interesting obversation from a direct observer with no ax to grind.

Can't wait to see the sextuplets in the water!

jenn said...

About the new poll...

I haven't seen any confirmation that they are indeed moving to NC or into a 8000 sq. ft. house. So I don't see how I can form an opinion on something I don't know as fact. Unfortunately that wasn't an option on the poll so I put it here. :)

Guinevere said...

So I was just reading that other blog that was mentioned in one of the previous threads, the one where etown and manda went to snark on us, and I found something interesting that I would like everyone's thoughts on.

You would think "etown" wouldn't be so brazen after being caught out. Huh.

One comment there pointed out that there are always people coming out and saying that they know, or have met Kate and the opinion isn't so high, yet we rarely have comments from friends or neighbors who have really nice things to say about her.

Since I think most of the people who are claiming to know Kate and have bad things to say about her are about as truthful as "etown", I don't see this as very significant.

My opinion of gwop would be the same if I met Kate and she truly was a bitch. I don't think it's right to use the kids as an excuse to snark and I could never be that hateful anyway. That comment just made me wonder.

I agree. I would also say that my opinions of the show, of the Gosselins, and of GWoP are not based on some false image of Kate as the antithesis of all the bad things said about her. I don't have a lot wrapped up in proving that she's not greedy, or not rude to people. Maybe she is. I don't know one way or another, and I don't care that much. I still enjoy the show for what it is, and I am still put off by the vitriol and creeped out by the stalking by GWoPpers.

Fanny said...

anya said...
"Hmm. Interesting obversation from a direct observer with no ax to grind."

Thanks anya. Guess that answers my question.

Linda said...

What's your bet ...

Will the folks from GwoP say that the article is damage control or will they claim that the Gosselins are finally listening to them and allowing the kids to have fun time way from the camera?

jen said...

What's your bet ...

Will the folks from GwoP say that the article is damage control or will they claim that the Gosselins are finally listening to them and allowing the kids to have fun time way from the camera?

Either way, they will most likely think that it's attributed to their blog.

Anonymous said...

To the posters who say they will watch the show no matter what and don't really think Jon & Kate are using their kids to make themselves wealthy, let me ask you this. Would you also like the show if the cameras just sorta followed the kids around, all 8 of them, and showed them interacting and reacting without the commentary and sarcasm of Jon & Kate? Wouldn't it be great not to have to endure another session of one of the parents getting prettied up or making nasty comments about one kid or another or about someone who tried to help them? I would. I would love to just get rid of the whole parents thing now that the kids can talk (and get the little ones some speech therapy, perhaps) and enjoy how they are. Why in the world do we care about people who aren't working, are actually asking parishoners in church to give them money and being sent on extravagent holidays? I don't think we really do.

jen said...

Anonymous said...
To the posters who say they will watch the show no matter what and don't really think Jon & Kate are using their kids to make themselves wealthy, let me ask you this. Would you also like the show if the cameras just sorta followed the kids around, all 8 of them, and showed them interacting and reacting without the commentary and sarcasm of Jon & Kate? Wouldn't it be great not to have to endure another session of one of the parents getting prettied up or making nasty comments about one kid or another or about someone who tried to help them? I would. I would love to just get rid of the whole parents thing now that the kids can talk (and get the little ones some speech therapy, perhaps) and enjoy how they are. Why in the world do we care about people who aren't working, are actually asking parishoners in church to give them money and being sent on extravagent holidays? I don't think we really do.


I would watch it either way. Let me ask you this: If you do not like watching Jon and Kate and their parenting style, why do you keep watching?

Fanny said...

I kinda like the drama that Kate and Jon (mostly Kate) bring to the show.

It hurts to watch sometimes but I think it would be boring without them.

Not that I don't like watching the kids, I just think the way they all interact is what makes it interesting.

Guinevere said...

Would you also like the show if the cameras just sorta followed the kids around, all 8 of them, and showed them interacting and reacting without the commentary and sarcasm of Jon & Kate? Wouldn't it be great not to have to endure another session of one of the parents getting prettied up or making nasty comments about one kid or another or about someone who tried to help them?

I like watching J&K. I don't think they are nasty about their kids, though they are sarcastic. I can relate to that. I find the whole family entertaining.

Anonymous said...

I'm watching Michael Phelps after his final race tonight. I'm watching him try to wade through a sea of photographers to hand his mother his bouquet of flowers from the medal ceremony. Is he now going to have to "pay for his celebrity?" (which is an excuse people make for harassing the Gosselins)

___

Dear,

Michael Phelps has N O T H I N G
in common with the Gosselins-no comparison whatsoever and laughable that you would bring him into this conversation. I will say "not too bright"

Anonymous said...

Yes you are right, only people from GWoP are bright. We bow down to you.

anya said...

"Michael Phelps has N O T H I N G
in common with the Gosselins-no comparison whatsoever and laughable that you would bring him into this conversation. I will say "not too bright"


Hi Anon. I think the connection went over your head. I am not the poster who shared this, but I do see the association. It goes something like this:

Sudden celebrity and the perks that go with it tends to *provoke* a certain segment of the population who are struggling with issues of inadequacy, jealousy, and sometimes, unfortunately, mental instability. These folks don't usually concern themselves when someone already rich gets richer. They concentrate on the little folks that somehow make it big through talent, sheer will or sometimes just being in the right place at the right time. Their feeling is "why not me"?

The original poster can correct me if I am wrong, but that's where I think she was going with this. Got it, Anon?

MCB said...

Michael Phelps has nothing in common with the Gosselins except for one thing. CELEBRITY. And if you think that Michael is not going to suffer some sort of backlash by the time the Olympics are done, well, then you're not paying much attention. He is EVERYWHERE and while he deserves every bit of praise for a job well done and for representing our country honorably, there are those that will try to "take him down a peg or two," and dig into his past. Why? Because THAT is tabloid journalism. They feed on bringing the famous down. Want to bet TMZ starts digging up Phelps' estranged father? Or The Smoking Gun posts his mug shot from his DUI four years ago (if it's not there already)? Sure they will, because good people are seen as BORING and it's the tabloid's job to bring them down.

Makes you wonder how the posters from GWoP can be so smug and proud about swimming in the festering slime that is the National Enquirer. They basically contributed to a rag not fit to wipe the average person's butt with. Bra-vo! (insert golf clap here)

Linda said...

Anonymous 1:59:

You wrote:

"Yes you are right, only people from GWoP are bright. We bow down to you."

Now THAT is funny!

I think that you should name yourself.

"SheMayBeAnonymous.ButShe'sAreAnonymous"

FGF said...

Ahhh, Anonymous GWoPPER without the guts put down your name. A drive-by insult post. So typical.

I realize that reading the post before criticizing it is a foreign concept, and if you had bothered, you'd see that I NEVER said the Gosselins were like Michael Phelps (but I understand how you can't resist the urge to say something rude and ugly since y'all are so good at it over there). I simply wondered if Phelps now will have to deal with the ugly side of fame, since he's now part of the "cult of celebrity" (thus using GWoP logic for being in constant attack mode toward the Gosselins).

It wasn't supposed to make sense. That's why it's called SARCASM.

Fanny said...

Anon, we really want you to have a name so we know it's you and we will all be sure to take notice of your insightful comments.




Sarcasm again. Catching on yet?

jen said...

To the person who said Michael Phelps and the Gosselins have nothing in common...

Today there are rumors going around about who he is dating and how he could "score" such hot girls. Before the Olympics, no one cared who he was dating. So yes, there is a commonality between them... And the poster about who deemed it "Celebrity" is spot on.

FGF said...

Today there are rumors going around about who he is dating and how he could "score" such hot girls.

You're kidding. How can anyone be surprised. That boy is going to be able to get ANYONE he wants, now.

So...who's he dating? ;)

jenn said...

Today there are rumors going around about who he is dating and how he could "score" such hot girls.

You're kidding. How can anyone be surprised. That boy is going to be able to get ANYONE he wants, now.

So...who's he dating? ;)


ok, i'll share the gossip:
http://perezhilton.com/2008-08-18-whos-michael-phelps-lady-love

Supposedly either Amanda Beard (fellow US swimmer) or Lily Donaldson (model).

MCB said...

Not a shocker. That guy is going to get more ass than a toilet seat, now.

MCB said...

Thanks for the info, Jenn, but EEEEW. I feel so gross. I just looked at Perez Hilton's site. Shudder. That's one website I find more repulsive than GWoP. At least they aren't drawing phallic symbols and semen on photos of Jon and Kate.....yet. Or drawing white dots around their noses to symbolize a drug problem.

Seriously, HOW did that guy get any credibility? He's disgusting. His website is vile. It all comes back to that "cult of celebrity." He posts the grossest stuff he can find about a celeb and people eat it up, because they like to see rich celebs taken down a peg.

God, I feel like I have to wash the slime off my monitor now. Yuck! Not your fault, Jenn, curiosity got the best of me. I should have known better. Can your computer get an STD from another site, because if there's any place on the net that you could, Perez Hilton's would be it.

Road2Madness said...

I am so relieved to find this board! I was ill in bed and caught Jon and Kate's newest episode last night. I thought it was a cute show. Since I was bored in bed and could not sleep, I decided to google Jon and Kate Plus 8. A lesson I quickly learned! I was led to the infamous anti-Gosselin website and spent hours reading the posts. It was mind-boggling and infuriating to how those "cronies" dissect EVERY moment of their episodes. There is a "Gate" for every trivial (so it seems to me) incident. I noticed the arm-chair psychoanalysis of each kid, Kate, and Jon. Just blew my mind. I love the way they are such chest-clutching drama llamas when it comes to exploitation of those children, YET they are contributing to the exploitation. Does it dawn on them the way they keep carrying on and spreading such hysteria that they are bringing ATTENTION to the show they supposedly "hate"? I don't understand it, maybe I am sleep-deprieved and delusional. Who knows?

I am not in a la-la land where I worship Kate. There are some things I dislike about Kate and Jon BUT they are humans like us. No one is perfect. I can see she really loves her children. The children do not seem to be "damaged" or suffering from any "psychological distress". They seem to be *gasp* normal and happy!

Ok, enough rambling on. I was just excited to discover this place. Mob mentality and lynching of Kate over there was slowly making me insane, hence my handle name. ;) Although not all of the posters are bad, few posters were really out there (it worries me, to be honest).

Road2Madness said...

I wonder what kind of spin the posters will give IF the beloved Jodi and Beth shows up for the renewal ceremony in Hawaii? To be honest, I probably will be pleasantly surprised if the ladies do show up. There is always both sides to every story and WE, yes even the cronies, don't know the whole story with Jodi, Beth, and Kate. Frankly, its none of our business.

Yes, I am aware of the "insider" Julie. *roll eyes*. Everything she mentioned in her blog and in the GWOP's question and answer section pretty much parroted what most other GWOPers said. *shrug shoulders* No earth-shattering revelatiosn there.

MCB said...

I love the way they are such chest-clutching drama llamas when it comes to exploitation of those children, YET they are contributing to the exploitation.

CHEST THUMPING DRAMA LLAMAS?

BWAH! I love it! Please continue to post!

TOO funny!!

Fanny said...

Drama llamas...lol

Thanks for your post R2M, I think it makes a real statement about gwop. You either read it and join in, or run quickly in the other direction.

There doesn't seem to be any middle ground there.

You don't have to worship Kate or hate her here...welcome aboard!

MCB said...

Oh wait, it was "chest CLUTCHING drama llamas," not "chest THUMPING drama llamas."

Oh well, either way, it's hilarious as hell (and soooo accurate).

Jen said...

Not a shocker. That guy is going to get more ass than a toilet seat, now.

LOL!!! I really needed a good laugh this morning. THANKS!

Can your computer get an STD from another site, because if there's any place on the net that you could, Perez Hilton's would be it.

Good lord I hope not! If so, then I'm in some serious trouble!

Jenn said...

R2M...
chest-clutching drama llamas



Oh my... Now that is hilarious!!!

FGF said...

Remember what I said about Michael Phelps and backlash? I just read a blog where the comments were all speculating about his sexual orientation just because he doesn't talk about who he dates. I knew it was only a matter of time before the vultures set in. I mean, there's nothing wrong with whoever he chooses to spend time with but just because he's not a hound dog, he MUST be gay, right? Whatever. He probably spends most of his time in the pool instead of on dates. Besides, sex weakens the leg muscles. Heh.

Oh, by the way, Amanda Beard dates NASCAR driver Carl Edwards, supposedly.

Dawnydel said...

Where are the friends and neighbors of Jon and Kate that love them? Where are the people that they have helped? Where are the people from the churches that they have attended standing up for them? I'd like to read what people who know them and like them have to say. Can anyone direct to blogs like that?

FGF said...

Why, so GWoPPERS can harass them, like the ministers at the churches that book the Gosselins for speaking engagements, or the authors of newspaper and magazine articles who have the audacity to write positive articles and are then verbally assaulted by the gang mentality of GWoP?

By the way, the lady who gave the kids swim lessons commented about them. It's linked here and her comments are....gasp...favorable. But, I'm sure the GWoPPERS will be more than happy to "set her straight" and tell her how she must be either stupid or mistaken.

Jenn said...

FGF said...
Remember what I said about Michael Phelps and backlash?


And now people are wanting to know where his father is and why he wasn't at the Olympics. Why is that anyone's business?

Someone did find his father and he basically said it's not about me, it's about him - which I thought was good.

Linda said...

I hate to even go there, but I read the GwoP blog entry that basically asks readers to give their wish for Kate.

I really don't see how these comments amount to advocating for the kids.

There are comments that say that the mother is a sociopath or has borderline personality disorder. There is one that says that she should shut up and go away. There is another one that says that Jon should leave them and take the kids with him.

It is this kind of posting that makes me so angry about that blog. Nomoredrama has posted here how her opposing views were not posted but this nasty stuff is?

MCB said...

Not shocked. I remember a rumor going around there that Jon had run over one of the 'tups with the mini-van (which was obviously false). More than one person commented, "Too bad he didn't run over Kate."

Yeah. Nice. "Advocating for the children" must also mean, "hoping they find out what it's like to lose a parent."

Anonymous said...

I agree that the swim teachers seemed delighted with the kids and with the whole experience. I'm sure if they've taught many children to swim they've come across a few cranky ones and a few who were really and truly afraid of the water. They handled everything very well from what I saw and appeared to have a real rapport not only with the kids but with Kate too. As far as the twins having to go into the house and miss their lesson, I thought the G's handled that with as little fuss & muss as they could. I'm not a huge fan of J&K, but I really enjoyed seeing them enjoy the sun and fun at the pool and seeing the coaches react and interact with the kids.

Jenn said...

Today they posted reason why comments don't get published. One of them was:

"stating that someone is mentally ill and prescribing treatment, etc".

I have seen some posts that do say that very thing. It would be nice if they all followed that rule.

Anonymous said...

Todays best GWOP moments for me today have been all the mentions/accusations of cyberstalking. Im pretty sure they don't get the irony but I nearly get cramps from laughing so hard.

nomoredrama said...

Their posting criteria I think only applies if you post PRO Gosselin. If you're anti, anything goes.

And diagnosing Kate with Borderline Personality Disorder. Ten points if the poster of that comment can define in her own words (without using google) what it is and apply relevant examples of how Kate fits this criteria.

Give me a BREAK!

Kat Coble said...

I wrote a religious post today for GWoP. It is there under the heading of "Before You Dig Deep..." (The title was given to the post by the administrators, but everything else I wrote.)

I realise that a lot of people who post over at GWoP seem more interested in attacking the Gosselins' appearance, mannerisms and parenting methods. There are several of us, though, who have openly stated that we are not in favour of the various slams and ARE in it purely for advocating for the children.

My purpose in following postings over there is twofold: I DO wish that some attention would be brought to bear on the children's lifestyle while filming--because I think they are overworked.

I am also interested in an honest picture of the Gosselins' financial status, as I am a Christian and wonder if it is appropriate for them to continue to solicit donations from the church under the pretense of financial need.

I do not hate the Gosselins. I do not bear them ill will AT ALL. I truly love them as a sister in Christ and hope the best for them.

I invite all of you to read the post I wrote today and be open with me regarding any criticisms you may have about the content.

It is my hope that you here will realise that the GWoP community is as large and varied as any other internet forum and the aims of the group are not always the shared aims of the individuals who participate there.

I appreciate that this forum exists to bring some balance to the discussion, and I would hope that balance would extend toward fairmindedness when evaluating the participants of the GWoP threads.

Anonymous said...

dawnydel said:
Where are the friends and neighbors of Jon and Kate that love them? Where are the people that they have helped? Where are the people from the churches that they have attended standing up for them? I'd like to read what people who know them and like them have to say. Can anyone direct to blogs like that?

August 19, 2008 7:59 PM

EXACTLY!! I just posted a comment regarding this on another thread. All the supporters seem to be fans of the show but I will tell you one thing if I was reading all the crap on these boards about my sister or brother I would be all over the place standing up for them. But where are they? Where are Kate and Jon's brothers, sisters, parents, cousins, neighbors, schoolmates, ex-roommates, ex coworkers or ANYONE!! Where is that father of the quintuplets they went out to dinner with who Jon referred to as his "mentor". Why don't they come to their defense? Where are these friends and family? If all this is bullshit about the Gosselins, you would think there would be some outrage at what is being posted about their loved ones all over the internet. Where's Carla? Or her daughter? Sure, maybe they don't want to get involved or post on the internet, I get it. But, honestly besides that post that Beth made almost a year ago, not one person who claims to be close to them have spoken up.

I would love to hear the other side of the story. When all the facts start adding up to the rumors that are floating around, something is not right. The defense has been that they are taking the high road and not commenting but I know one thing, if they were related to me, I would not be able to control myself, I would have to stick up for them.

Unless, all the stuff is true..................

Road2Madness said...

Anon 3:11 PM

Maybe these people were asked not to come forward by Jon and Kate or their publicists. Maybe it is for their own protection.

If I was targeted by the drama llamas and my name is being dragged through the mud, then I would have told my family members and friends to stay low. As hard as it may be for them not to come to my defense, I'd wish to let the legal authorities take care of the situation when the line is crossed. I would not want to involve my loved ones into this mess. Let the drama lie down or involve legal authorities when it gets out of control.

Anonymous said...

I personally do not care about the crap that you are talking about. Are they nice to their neighbors? Do we care? Do they have problems with their family members? How does this fit in with being an advocate for the children because of the filming? See this is the issue with all of this BS. State you have a problem with the children and their privacy and the hours they work. I can give you that. Quit talking about all of the other BS and it will make you a lot more credible.

Anonymous said...

Blogger nomoredrama said...

Their posting criteria I think only applies if you post PRO Gosselin. If you're anti, anything goes.

And diagnosing Kate with Borderline Personality Disorder. Ten points if the poster of that comment can define in her own words (without using google) what it is and apply relevant examples of how Kate fits this criteria.

Give me a BREAK!


I agree. I have tried many times to post on how absurd some of their comments are and my post never make it. Tonight, they have a blog up about contacting our congress people about Figure 8 films/ Jon and Kate. Do they not pay attention to anything going on in our country?

Anonymous said...

This is my issue with Anonymous 5:21's comment. This blog isn't purporting to be an advocate for the children. So why get your knickers in a twist about this? What credibility does this blog even really need? It's just trying to provide people with a place to discuss.

Anonymous said...

Just a comment on the question "Where are the friends and family of J&K and why aren't they defending them on the Internet?".

Here's my opinion - and just my opinion. If I were Jon or Kate, I would feel no need to defend myself to strangers on a blog. Honestly, I wouldn't care less what they were saying about me. And I especially wouldn't care if I knew something was untrue.
If J&k were my brother/sister/friend, it may get my ire up, but I think I wouldn't mostly laugh. Or not read the stuff at all.
So I can understand why we don't see that in the blogosphere. Additionally, who would believe a poster that claimed to be Kate's sister or Jon's brother? I wouldn't.

Anonymous said...

anonymous said:
".......Additionally, who would believe a poster that claimed to be Kate's sister or Jon's brother? I wouldn't."

Just curious, do you believe that Julie is Jodi's sister and did you believe that it was Beth who wrote into the blog to defend Kate?

I find it very difficult to believe that Kate and Jon have reached out to each and every person that knows them to say, please don't respond to all the "untruths" floating around on the internet.

Tanya said...

to Anon 5:06-
I'm Anon 1:32, Tanya, and I've posted a few comments today on this site. Now that I know how to use my name in comments, I will do so.

I don't know if Julie is Jodi's sister or not. Does anyone really? Except for maybe Jodi. If Julie IS her sister, I feel sorry for Jodi. I have 3 sisters, and I'd never air their in-law grievances publicly (and they all have many). Because the only result of that is to make things worse.

And I would find it very easy to contact everyone I know and ask them not to respond to vitriol on the Internet. All it takes is one email to all my contacts. Maybe 1 minute, tops?

nomoredrama said...

This!!! This post below is why I have a problem with GWoP. To those of you who are offended by ripping posts from there, I'm sorry but this has to be posted...

Today...this VERY day...under "A Want is Not a need" this comment was posted.
Jon K said...

Having come back from a vacation in E-Town just a few weeks ago, and having driven past the Gosselin's home, I can honestly say that at least at that time, they still had the same two vans parked in front of the house (I understand they were in Hawaii while we were out there).


I'm sorry, but this is the very thing that the outrage with GWoP is about...But don't say mean things like the posters are "nutjobs" or "weirdos" or "stalkers." This is all perfectly normal behavior, right?

Anonymous said...

Tanya said:
to Anon 5:06-
I'm Anon 1:32, Tanya, and I've posted a few comments today on this site. Now that I know how to use my name in comments, I will do so.

I don't know if Julie is Jodi's sister or not. Does anyone really? Except for maybe Jodi. If Julie IS her sister, I feel sorry for Jodi. I have 3 sisters, and I'd never air their in-law grievances publicly (and they all have many). Because the only result of that is to make things worse.

And I would find it very easy to contact everyone I know and ask them not to respond to vitriol on the Internet. All it takes is one email to all my contacts. Maybe 1 minute, tops?

August 22, 2008 6:22 PM


I think there are more people that know that Julie is Jodi's sister than Jodi herself. You wouldn't air your sister's in-law grievances publicly because your life and theirs isn't a television reality show.

That's GREAT that you could contact everyone you know in one e-mail and all in one minute! You see I have many friends and family that don't have e-mail. I have family in various parts of the country as well as internationally. I have friends and acquaintances that I have met throughout the years that I don't contact often. But, if I ran into them at the market or the mall, I would give them a hug and try and keep in contact. The people in my life could never be lumped into one e-mail, especially in less than one minute.

But, you're probably right, the Gosselins can lump everyone into one e-mail and send out an s.o.s. message:

"please don't respond to vitriol on the internet or through any other avenue, because as a reminder, nothing that you read on the internet or in print is true unless it is approved by us." And they would sign it:

"this message has been personally written by Jon and Kate Gosselin."

FGF said...

I think I love the Wikipedia dude assigned to monitor the J&K article.

GWoP has a designated poster "in charge" of monitoring the J&K Wikipedia entry. She's constantly altering it (and having her alterations reversed, of course). They've been trying to add a "controversy" section to air all their "grievances," but it doesn't stay posted for very long. The entry in its proper form is straightforward and neutral, without a positive or negative slant. Overly positive posts by fans are also deemed unnecessary and removed at times.

I was browsing the "history" section, where you can see the changes made and occasionally the Wiki wonks make comments. I saw this one and laughed my fool head off because it was directed at a particular GWoP poster who is vile, distasteful and I'm sure qualifies as a legitimate cyberstalker. I think a lot of you can guess her identity without my help.

Anyway, back to the Wiki guy. This is what he posted and I love him. I hope she got banned, too.

"Please keep your own personal nastiness about whether Kate has a man-trapping vagina and tricked poor Jon into having sex with her to yourself. It's libel.

YESSSS!!

BWAH. I want to kiss him. And that poster soooo deserves it. She's certifiably nuts and the rest of them just enable and encourage the crazy. She actually makes me fear for the Gosselin's safety at times.

LOVE IT. Rock on, Wiki guy.

Fanny said...

I saw the history too, fgf, and I cannot believe the nerve of these people. They are arguing with the wiki people on THEIR site! Why do they think they have the right to post anything anywhere they see fit? Talk about frickin entitlement issues....geez.

If the wrongdoings of j+k are so obvious, why do they feel they need to post that crap everywhere? Wiki will only print fact, and they are trying their hardest to get some of those things in there so they can reference it on that blog as fact. They did it once before the wiki people got wind of the "controversy" section and got rid of it. They are getting desperate to find sources that will back them up since Julie has no new information(even though what supposed "facts" she did have were more "he said, she said), and "BK"'s entries have proved themselves to be less than credible.


They say in the ms at gwop that they aren't trying to convince anyone of anything. It sure looks like they are to me.

Linda said...

Hi Everyone,

I read the discussion that outlines the removal of the "controversy" section from the wikipedia entry.

Here are some classic lines from the wikipedia people ...

"it's not all that controversial these days to stop working when you have a child, especially six,"

or this one ...

"This paragraph has a tone in which one is to conclude that asking for charity is a bad thing, which, again, is not set in neutrality. It comes off as people being scandalized that charity is even being asked, or received"

or this one ...

"I fail to see any controversy regarding Jon working from home as opposed to working in an office."

or my 2nd favorite ....

"It is also not a crime to become motivational speakers."

and of course, my #1 all time favorite ...

"The National Enquirer is not a reliable source."

Like you said fgf! Rock on Wiki!

But seriously, this is really disturbing that some of the GwoP and former TwoP posters are so over-invested in the lives of a television family.

For me, it does rise to the level of creepy. It really does.

Anonymous said...

I guess this is where to leave this...I like to stay neutral about the Gosselin's. I enjoy their show and watching their lovely children grow up, however I'm not a fan of how Kate speaks to her husband or that they put their children on TV as often as they do. But, they are real and I respect that.

I visit both GWoP and this website to read about the family, I don't often post but sometimes I feel the need. Well today I read on GWoP "a want not a need" post, and I felt compelled...They referenced that the Gosselin's new house isn't a need but a want, I agree here. However, the part I disagree with is that their examples shown were three large families with small(er) houses. My exact post was this "why wasn't the Harris family mentioned? They got a rather large house for free." - Never got posted....what? They only post ones that make the Gosselin's look bad?

That is what irks me about their blog- I see on there that people had a "bad feeling" about the Gosselin's so went there and now dislike them. Well, that isn't fair because that site doesn't offer both sides of ANY story. They also state things as facts that are nothing more than speculation.

Thanks for this blog, good,bad and indifferent. At least I can come here and speak freely!

Fanny said...

Oh, they loooove the harris'. You can't talk bad about them on that sight because according to gwop, they are "nice people" and would like to see them on tv more as they would "put j+k to shame". It's okay to "exploit" your kids as long as you are nice about it. Freebees are fine too, as long as you aren't Kate Gosselin.

Kinda throws a wrench in the old "we're here for the children" thing, doesn't it?

Linda said...

So I have to tell you all that is what really confuses the heck out of me.

I don't agree with Aunt Jodi's supposed sister Julie posting all of that stuff on the internet about this family but in some ways I see the connection.

Sure, it is a one step removed connection but I see it.

But what I don't see is why are some of these complete strangers so obsessed with bringing down a family from television?

And Anonymous 10:10 -- You are re-telling the same experience that so many of us had with commenting or attempting to provide a different perspective with an entry or comment on GwoP.
Which is why, like you, we were glad to find this "lonely little blog"

Anonat2ohSeven said...

I don't know about
bringing down a family
but if the Gosselins have been misrepresenting themselves and their situation, I think the public does not deserve to be deceived.

What does "bring them down" entail? Expecting them to support their own family without deception?

bigsis88 said...

Has anyone else seen the video of Aunt Jodi on Julie's blog?

nomoredrama said...

Here is an "interesting" article....


Musings from the Moon

Guinevere said...

What does "bring them down" entail? Expecting them to support their own family without deception?

In what way are the Gosselins not supporting their own family? What deception are you referring to? I've heard people throw out the Gosselins pleading need/"love offerings" speeches at churches, but I haven't seen any hard evidence (or even soft evidence) that any of this has occured recently.

As far as I'm concerned, the Gosselins are supporting their family, primarily with their television show. It seems that some people won't be happy unless or until Jon is stuck in some crappy IT job and Kate is forced to take all the nursing shifts she can get in order to support their eight kids. Of course, neither of the parents would get to spend much time with the kids, and likely they'd spend a mint on child care, but at least they would be satisfying the haters by leading a perfectly miserable live and depriving their kids of the benefits they are able to give them now as a result of the show.

grannie said...

I guess it's true. It is Aunt Jodi, rumor only, they are pulling JON and Kate due to her "behavior" Sponsors are fuming and at them and want to withdraw. They are going to replace them this fall.
Apparently Kate was mean to a little girl who asked for her autograph, she refused and told her she needed to learn privacy and manners. Kelly Ripa's child maybe??? I don't know.

FGF said...

I can't stand Kelly Ripa, so if she was rude to Ripacrite's kid, no biggie from me.

But, how does Grannie know that J&K have been canceled? I haven't seen anything in the media about that. If it is, oh well. The GWoPPERs will have to find someone else's kids to "save," but my guess is they won't be focusing their "advocacy" on the Roloffs or Harris' or David Archuleta's controlling father, because it's really not the kids they give a shit about. They simply want to stick it to Kate. Period. Once the show goes away, they'll be stuck gloating to each other for awhile, but even that will get old eventually.

Anonymous said...

Guinevere said:
"It seems that some people won't be happy unless or until Jon is stuck in some crappy IT job and Kate is forced to take all the nursing shifts she can get in order to support their eight kids."

IMO....most viewers would be happy when Kate stops her incessant need to put down her husband on camera, show a little love and compassion and basically become a nicer person or at least try while on camera. Do you honestly believe that there would be so much negativity on the internet if she just changed her attitude just a little bit? Sure, arguing is normal and everyone does it, but week after week we are watching this supposedly struggling christian woman berating her husband and making fun of her children. It's her attitude and sense of entitlement that made viewers google her and say hey what's up with this bitch. She is on television to sell an image of an average family with a lot of kids. Notice that most of the comments are written about Kate, not so much about Jon. She has said herself that she wanted viewers to see a "real" look into their lives but really are hair plugs, lavish vacations and special treatment at theme parks to name a few, how their life would be if not on television?
I know it is hard to believe but I am genuinely happy for this family, they have healthy kids, plenty of food (mostly organic), gas in their vehicles, money in the bank and do not seem to need much more. But, is it too much to ask for Kate to be nicer to her family, show a little appreciation and stop her bitchiness? She has had plenty of opportunities to do so, but seems to be getting worse. It is human nature, especially for women to be "caddy" and Kate gives her audience plenty of reasons for it.
At least for me, this is the main reason that I am turned off by Jon and Kate Goesselin.

Anonymous said...

"without deception"

On the "day out" episodes, Jon and Kate state they can only do it once it a year - because they "save" to be able to do the outings.

Anonymous said...

"Grannie" is going all over the internet today and spreading that where ever she can. I have seen it multiple times. I think she is trying to get people to think she is the infamous grannie at IMP. I think she is a troll.

FGF said...

Here is an "interesting" article....
Musings from the Moon


Yawn.

When it quacks like a GWoP and looks like a GWoP, it must be a GWoP.

That whole article is a list of GWoP talking points. She was either fed all that information from them, or plagiarized them herself.

FGF said...

"Grannie" is going all over the internet today and spreading that where ever she can. I have seen it multiple times. I think she is trying to get people to think she is the infamous grannie at IMP. I think she is a troll.

DARN. I was kinda hoping, in strange way, that she might be right so we can see the GWoP "child advocacy machine" hem and haw about why they're not helping other exploited reality TV children after the Gosselins are done. Why they're not jumping on Jeff Archuleta's case about the way he treats his money making machine, David. Or the fact that the Roloffs have been on TV for more years than the Gosselins and who's home and property have gotten nicer and nicer each season they've been on. Or Figure 8's new targets, the Harris sextuplets, and the mother who stands in her spacious Extreme makeover Home Edition McMansion, but claims they can't afford baseball mitts for all six kids t-ball game (but can go out and get a new tattoo for herself that same day).

I was really looking forward to their next mission of mercy! Too bad it will never happen, though, because "advocating for the children" is a LIE. Hating the Gosselin parents enough to see them taken down is the real mission.

Barbara in VA said...

Yes, I think lots of the problems with the show would be solved if Kate weren't so much, well, herself. We know too much about the parents, more than most of us ever wanted to know. And although the person above doubts our sincere interest and, yes, advocacy (she hates that word) for the kids, speaking for myself I have always thought they were all just normal and adorable. The more we saw of freebies and Kate the more we (or I) started thinking, hey, Kate, your behavior is not normal and nice and kind. And because they've opened themselves up to criticism (& praise) we are all able to share our opinions. Attacking one another does nothing. Try not to take other opinions so personally and seriously; they have a right to post just like you do. I still maintain that Jodi showed herself to be a very warm person on the show and that's really all any of us know about her (most of us).

Anonymous said...

"It seems that some people won't be happy unless or until Jon is stuck in some crappy IT job and Kate is forced to take all the nursing shifts she can get in order to support their eight kids."

You mean like the majority of the U.S. population takes care of their families, ordinary people with ordinary jobs, which is the target audience for this show.

"Of course, neither of the parents would get to spend much time with the kids, and likely they'd spend a mint on child care..."

The same kind of challenge that most ordinary families in the U.S. struggle with every day. This show was supposed to be about how a family in a extraordinary situation (two sets of multiples/8 kids) dealt with the ordinary challenges that every family faces on a day-to-day basis, and in the beginnng it was. But not now, nor has it been for quite a while. I've stopped watching it and if others who are also done with watching these parents exploit their kids to earn a paycheck, it will be the most effective message of all to send TLC/Figure 8 about ending this show.

nomoredrama said...

You mean like the majority of the U.S. population takes care of their families, ordinary people with ordinary jobs, which is the target audience for this show.

You state this point as if something about this is new and unique to the Gosselins. Yes, there are hundreds of a-list (and even b, c, and d list) celebrities (a chunk children like Miley Cyrus, Dakota Fanning, Abigail Breslin...and on and on) who make money every day by not working an "ordinary" job. Where is the hatred towards these people? These children's parents? Ever seen Dina Lohan's house? Yeah, I bet none of Lindsey's money was used to purchase those things.

Where are the blogs attacking athletes, musicians....Where is your disdain at shows like "American Idol" and a wealth of other shows that go on and on.

Oh I'm sure the argument will be "well, if we can't save them all, that means we shouldn't save one"

Save it. As Barbara in VA stated Yes, I think lots of the problems with the show would be solved if Kate weren't so much, well, herself
This is the TRUE reason that the blog exists. Kate is not always likeable person (no argument there). I guess if she were someoen who fit the stereotypical image of a mother (kind, nurturing, Donna Reed type) then there would be no such venom spewed.

Or maybe if she was more alike in personality to Jodi I still maintain that Jodi showed herself to be a very warm person on the show and that's really all any of us know about her (most of us).

I'm not sure what Jodi's being a caring person on the show has to do with the price of tea in China. I think you can still be a nice and warm person and make mistakes. "Warm" people can also get bitter. But her personality is more appealing than Kates...so whatever she does is A-OK!

Anonymous said...

You state this point as if something about this is new and unique to the Gosselins. Yes, there are hundreds of a-list (and even b, c, and d list) celebrities (a chunk children like Miley Cyrus, Dakota Fanning, Abigail Breslin...and on and on) who make money every day by not working an "ordinary" job. Where is the hatred towards these people? These children's parents? Ever seen Dina Lohan's house? Yeah, I bet none of Lindsey's money was used to purchase those things.

Where are the blogs attacking athletes, musicians....Where is your disdain at shows like "American Idol" and a wealth of other shows that go on and on.

Oh I'm sure the argument will be "well, if we can't save them all, that means we shouldn't save one"


Those people do not pretend to be not rich, not famous, everyday people.

Guinevere said...

I don't think "Grannie" is doing her side any favors, if the post above is an example of her writing. I can barely understand what she's talking about.

IMO....most viewers would be happy when Kate stops her incessant need to put down her husband on camera, show a little love and compassion and basically become a nicer person or at least try while on camera. Do you honestly believe that there would be so much negativity on the internet if she just changed her attitude just a little bit?

Read your own words - do you comprehend the breathtaking arrogance in expecting a stranger to change her behavior to suit your desires? That's just crazy to me. If you don't like Kate, don't watch the show. The idea that she owes it to you or any other viewer to change her behavior...really has me shaking my head.

Of course, the Kate-haters ignore that Jon is almost as snippy to Kate as Kate is to Jon. And he makes fun of the kids at least as much. But he's a man, so it's okay, I guess.

You mean like the majority of the U.S. population takes care of their families, ordinary people with ordinary jobs, which is the target audience for this show.

Exactly. I don't get the obsession some viewers have with wanting J&K to be just like them and relatable. They are already in a unique situation, so their relatability was always debatable, IMO. But the insistence that they must struggle financially in order to be likable to their audience doesn't make sense to me. I've said before - a lot of these same posters who complain about J&K's freebies also profess to love the Gosselin kids. So why do they begrudge them having a nice life?

The same kind of challenge that most ordinary families in the U.S. struggle with every day. This show was supposed to be about how a family in a extraordinary situation (two sets of multiples/8 kids) dealt with the ordinary challenges that every family faces on a day-to-day basis, and in the beginnng it was. But not now, nor has it been for quite a while. I've stopped watching it and if others who are also done with watching these parents exploit their kids to earn a paycheck, it will be the most effective message of all to send TLC/Figure 8 about ending this show.

Okay, in your mind, the show was "supposed to be about" one thing, and now it has changed. It sounds like you've made the right decision to stop watching since the direction of the show doesn't interest you. The next step would be to stop talking about it entirely or posting about it on message boards or blogs.

The outrage over the Gosselins' lack of suffering reminds me of the "Survivor" viewers who would get pissed if the contestants were given too much food, because it was more entertaining to watch them starve, I guess. It's kind of sick, if you ask me.

Anonymous said...

"You mean like the majority of the U.S. population takes care of their families, ordinary people with ordinary jobs, which is the target audience for this show."

"You state this point as if something about this is new and unique to the Gosselins."

Not really. J&K "pleading 8" makes them no different from the majority of Americans who work at ordinary jobs every day to support their families, regardless of the number of children. TLC/Figure 8 didn't market this program as "lifestyles of celebrity wannabes", although that's what it has become. It was supposed to be about ordinary people dealing with extraordinary circumstances. The difference between this family and the z-list celebrities you mentioned is that the z-listers are deliberately pursuing a career in show business as actors or singers, etc. (and whether or not they actually have any talent is a whole 'nuther discussion), and being in the public eye is expected and even encouraged. As Kate herself stated, the Gosselins wanted to do this show to allow the public to "peek inside their windows," to see what their lives are really like. Two very different scenarios.

As far as people expressing outrage about child actors or singers or musicians, there was quite an uproar when those photos of Miley Cyrus were published in Vanity Fair, which didn't subside even when it became known that her parents were at the photo shoot. There was also an outcry when Britney Spears' sister announced her pregnancy and I believe lost her TV show since she was no longer considered an appropriate role model for her fan base. Both of these girls were teenagers at the time of these incidents so they were old enough to make decisions for themselves, they were not helpless children. There was also a firestorm of protest about Dakota Fanning doing a rape scene (at 11 years old) in a film that debuted at the Sundance Film Festival. And there has been plenty of criticism for the Lohans, as there was for Macaulay Culkin's greedy parents.

If there's any comparison to be made between the Gosselin children and children with showbiz careers, it might be Macaulay Culkin. His father Kit "managed" his children's showbiz careers, as it's been suggested that Jon's "job" is apparently "managing" the commodities his children have become for the family income. When Macaulay was 14 he took his parents to court to obtain control of his earnings, after being subjected to an ugly custody battle where his mother accused his father of mismanaging his career, and Macaulay won. The Gosselin children may well find themselves wondering some day, what happened to the income that was earned from selling their childhood.

Anonymous said...

"It sounds like you've made the right decision to stop watching since the direction of the show doesn't interest you. The next step would be to stop talking about it entirely or posting about it on message boards or blogs."

I disagree that I should stop expressing my opinion about the show because I've stopped watching it. It's no different than discussing a book I didn't like and didn't finish when I attend book club, or a movie I stopped watching because I didn't like it and then discussing it in an online forum.

"It's kind of sick, if you ask me."

I've never watched Survivor, so I'll have to take your word for it. ;)

nomoredrama said...

Not really. J&K "pleading 8" makes them no different from the majority of Americans who work at ordinary jobs every day to support their families, regardless of the number of children. TLC/Figure 8 didn't market this program as "lifestyles of celebrity wannabes", although that's what it has become.

I don't think I referred to the number of kids J & K had as a justification for them not having to work so I'm not sure how your first sentence applies to my comment. Yes, the show "started out" one way and, over time, the show and the family have evolved. The show has become one of the highest rated shows on TLC. IMO, this is because people fell in love with the kids. So yeah, now they have a celebrity status because their show dared to be successful. Those bastards!

...being in the public eye is expected and even encouraged. As Kate herself stated, the Gosselins wanted to do this show to allow the public to "peek inside their windows," to see what their lives are really like. Two very different scenarios.
I'm sorry but I fail to follow your logic here. How is this different? The parents of these actors, musicians, etc., all cash in on their kid's talents, abilities and persona. Adult celebrities cash in on their own...all as a means to make money. J & K used their life situation (having 2 sets of multiples) to make money. You can't use the "Oh but they are making a choice to pursue a career, not pimping out their kids" argument. Please tell me how the Olson twins at 2 or 3 really chose the career path they wanted to be in? How many young children have any concept of what profession they want to pursue. If you say it's exploitation for J & K then you can't limit it to J & K. By your logic, the exploitation would have to apply to anyone who cannot possibly understand "informed consent." Again, I ask, where is your outrage against all the other parents with children in this situation?

As far as people expressing outrage about child actors or singers or musicians, there was quite an uproar when those photos of Miley Cyrus were published in Vanity Fair,
Yeah, the "uproar" was mainly accusations of Miley being a slut at age 15. Not hardly the same thing. I can't find any interest blogs of non-fans who want to advocate for Miley.

There was also an outcry when Britney Spears' sister announced her pregnancy and I believe lost her TV show since she was no longer considered an appropriate role model for her fan base
Yes, another female branded a slut but the media. That was the Outcry...again, no blog advocating for her.

both of these girls were teenagers at the time of these incidents so they were old enough to make decisions for themselves, they were not helpless children
Yeah,so portraying them as whores in the media is ok because their old enough to make decisions for themselves. Research has show that the pre frontal cortex (this is the section of the brain for higher order thought, and to oversimplify "maturity" come from) is not fully developed in an adolescent. Adolescents are prone to risk-taking behaviors because they have an innate sense of being invincible and fail to understand the long term consequences of their actions. This hardly makes Miley Cyrus and Jamie Lynn Spears fully capable of managing their own lives. Hence the reason teen pregnancy is a problem in the first place.

There was also a firestorm of protest about Dakota Fanning doing a rape scene (at 11 years old) in a film that debuted at the Sundance Film Festival.
I'll give you that one partially. That she did this disgusting scene (and yes, I think the firestorm is warranted) made the public up in arms. Up until then, it was ok for a child between the ages of 8 and 11 years old to be a public figure.

And there has been plenty of criticism for the Lohans,
Yes, there has been gossip and criticism of the Lohans...Not to belabor the point, but can you point me in the direction of a blog dedicated to taking them down?

As for your comparison of the Gosselins to Mac Culken...It is completely invalid and inappropriate...you have no basis to assume that these children do not have money set aside for them.
You have no idea what these people do with their money...you're guesses and thoughts don't apply...sorry.

Guinevere said...

TLC/Figure 8 didn't market this program as "lifestyles of celebrity wannabes", although that's what it has become.

So...it sounds like your issue is with TLC and Figure 8, not J&K - is that correct?

I still don't get the outrage over the fact that the Gosselins' lives have changed since the show started. People seem to take it so personally, and it completely baffles me.

I disagree that I should stop expressing my opinion about the show because I've stopped watching it. It's no different than discussing a book I didn't like and didn't finish when I attend book club, or a movie I stopped watching because I didn't like it and then discussing it in an online forum.

Well, of course you have a right to...I just don't know why you'd want to. But whatever floats your boat. It would be helpful if you included the info that you don't watch the show in all your posts, so other readers could give your comments the weight they deserve.

Anonymous said...

"You have no idea what these people do with their money...you're guesses and thoughts don't apply..."

And neither do you, so your guesses and thoughts are no more applicable than mine.

"It would be helpful if you included the info that you don't watch the show in all your posts, so other readers could give your comments the weight they deserve."

I stopped watching the show after the cupcake episode so I think I have a well-informed perspective on what the show was early on and what it has become. I don't think a disclaimer is necessary.

nomoredrama said...

"You have no idea what these people do with their money...you're guesses and thoughts don't apply..."

And neither do you, so your guesses and thoughts are no more applicable than mine.


See, now you're catching on. That was my point...and I have never "guessed" what they have done with their money...It is, quite frankly, none of my business and it's not my job to try to find out. The proper authorities are well aware of the outrage and protests against the Gosselin family. Until you hear from them, it might be a good idea to suspend your judgment about their finances.

Road2Madness said...

See, now you're catching on. That was my point...and I have never "guessed" what they have done with their money...It is, quite frankly, none of my business and it's not my job to try to find out. The proper authorities are well aware of the outrage and protests against the Gosselin family. Until you hear from them, it might be a good idea to suspend your judgment about their finances.

Thank you! My thoughts exactly. I just DONT get the outrage about their finances.

Anonymous said...

"I have never "guessed" what they have done with their money..."

The same is true for me. I didn't "guess" anything about their money. Asking if their children may one day ask what happened to the money that was earned at the expense of their childhood was just that, a question.

"The proper authorities are well aware of the outrage and protests against the Gosselin family. Until you hear from them, it might be a good idea to suspend your judgment about their finances."

Thanks for the heads up but my spouse is an attorney, so I'll be most happy to talk to any of those "proper authorities" if they should appear on my doorstep. ;)

Anonymous said...

I've been watching Jon and Kate on the interview couch and they don't seem like that cute close couple that they used to be. I can't imagine them getting divorced but what do the rest of you think?

dotsicle said...

It would be difficult for them to get a divorce, and I would HOPE that they could get some counseling so that doesn't happen. I admit to not being a fan of Kate, but I surely don't want to see their marriage break up.

I am an old TWoP snarker who is becoming disenchanted with GWoP. I really am not an activist of any sort, and I admire those who are, but I just don't have anything to add to the GWoP discussions. The trouble is, I think posters on this board make GWoP sound "interesting" to new readers and the frequent mention of that other site may actually be sending people over there to read! And driving up the number of hits!

I really do miss being able to snark on the old TWoP board. I wonder if Mars misses all the drama?

bigsis88 said...

Does anyone besides me place a lot of the "blame" (for lack of a better word) for the controversy, "spirited" debates, vitriol, etc. on TLC/Figure 8 Films? Many pro-Gosselin and anti-Gosselin arguments come down to editing. For example, one poster will say "Jon is a ____ because he didn't do ____." and then another poster will say "Well, the show is edited, so we don't know..." Since no one on a blog (as far as I know) has access to the unedited footage of the show, the debate ends there. Sure J&K chose to put their family on TV (and even that point is debatable), but the people with the ultimate control over what is shown on TV are not J&K. If anyone is "laughing all the way to the bank", it's TLC and F8.

Anonymous said...

Lately they look to me to be pretty distant. Although divorce would be terrible for the children and I hope it's just stress and they work things out.