If you follow the Gosselins in the media, you may be aware that Kate Gosselin appears to be pursuing a budding career in public speaking. Below are links to information about a few upcoming appearances:
http://www.ksbj.org/special_events.php
http://wccc.blogs.com/willow_news/
How do you feel about Kate’s (potential) new career? If you think that the show is harmful to the Gosselin children, do you believe that this may be a positive step, perhaps leading to the end of the show and another source of income for the Gosselin family? If you are one who feels that the Gosselins are exploiting their children, do you consider Kate appearing on her own to be a continuation of the exploitation? If so, why?
http://wccc.blogs.com/willow_news/
How do you feel about Kate’s (potential) new career? If you think that the show is harmful to the Gosselin children, do you believe that this may be a positive step, perhaps leading to the end of the show and another source of income for the Gosselin family? If you are one who feels that the Gosselins are exploiting their children, do you consider Kate appearing on her own to be a continuation of the exploitation? If so, why?
106 comments:
I think Kate's speaking career, spokesperson, etc...is fine and I think she is smart to market herself.
Is it an extension of her exploiting her kids, yea, I think so. Because without the kids she would never have achieved "her" fame.
However, with that said, I think when the show stops, she will have a means to continue her celebrity status, which I think both she and Jon do enjoy and a way to produce an income.
The last few times I have heard Kate, she seemed pretty poised and I think people believe her and that she is likeable.
Much rather see her speak about KMART then Mady's ugly behavior.
The ironic thing is that even if Kate does attempt this career change, and it means that she will be making money on her own and not solely relying on full time cameras in her home, the "advocates" will bombard anyone and everyone who hires and sponsors her with hate mail, because they are just that bitter and vindictive. No matter that their actions will ensure that the Gosselin kids will remain on TV, which was SUPPOSED to be what they are fighting against. It's a double edged sword, isn't it, GWoPPers? You hate to see "that woman" succeed, but her success would mean that the family would no longer have to live off the the show (or "on the backs of their children," as you all like to pretend to be concerned about).
Kate's possible career move will certainly tell the true tale. Will the haters want her to succeed to spare the kids from being "breadwinners," or will their true hypocrisy come through and they'll attempt to sabotage Kate's attempt to be the main earner for the family. Such a dilemma!
I hope that Kate does prosper in a career as a spokeswoman, speaker or whatever else she can make an income doing. It will relieve the pressure on the family and help bring her kids more privacy. I'm all for that.
The only way to be against Kate doing this--is to be a hypocrite IMHO.
What I mean by that is, a parent who travels for a job--especially a mom, meets criticism for abandoning the kids.
I think that is silly. Women have the right to gainful employment or self-employment and having dad help out is very legitimate.
I'm a SAHM--but lest folks suggest that that anything but a SAHM is wrong, they can't be against Kate working.
To say it exploits the children by public speaking. No it doesn't. It is possible, though possibly mor difficult, that a career as a public/motivational speaker could/would have happened without the show.
Moms and dads do it all the time. Some get a "break" that makes it easier to pursue this career, but many do not. Often the "break" comes after years of hard work.
I homeschool and my "local" convention is the FPEA convention. We have some VERY gifted speakers. Now, outside of homeschooling--folks wouldn't know them from Adam. But--they speak here due to their parenting experinece, homeschool educating experience, or just education experience.
They tell tales based on their experiences. They "profit" from this--either by getting a speakers fee, or getting a booth to showcase their writings and wares. But all do make money somehow.
Kate is no different. It is highly feasible she would have been able to do this gig. However--since they went the route of the show, she now has...credibility after many speaking engagements related to the show. I am sure the Gosselins have representation (agents) as well. It is the agents job to help further the careers of whom they represent and public speaking is a natural extension.
However like all public speakers--there will be folks that love them and folks who condemn the very words that come out of their mouth. This is a human reaction. We don't have to like everybody.
But as with anything--if you don't like what someone is selling, don't buy it. It isn't that hard. And unless someone is breaking some moral law--it's really none of anyone's business to be interfering with boycotts and such as I suspect will eventually happen if Kate moves on with this career.
But here's the deal--Kate won't call your employer to complain about you--leave Kate's employers out of this.
It is okay to talk about your kids and if you have enough to say and make money off of it, that is okay too.
Speaking about your life is not exploitation. Time to get off the soapboxes and move on folks.
Whatever floats her boat, or makes her happy, is fine. I just wish she would learn to talk without saying "um" every two seconds.
Rain88,
I agree with your sentiments.
I hope she does well, too.
Good for the Gosselins. If I could do public speaking I would myself. I think it's great that they can work from home in this way. I think Kate pursuing this avenue is awesome. People are interested in her and her story. I think she is smart to take advantage of the opportunities that are coming her way. Go Kate!
The funny thing is, I don't really think that many people bombard the sponsers, etc....
I think it is the same 8 to 10 GWOPPERS and 3Farmers.
No one else gives a hoot!
Ah Fiona! That's it!! I believe everything of your post of December 26th, 1:48pm except Is it an extension of her exploiting her kids.
See, I don't believe she's exploiting her kids. That's the root of where we differ in our opinion.
Yes, we know of Kate because of her kids and the show, but I don't think it's exploitation. I don't think it's a seeking of fame either, more so that of an income. I don't think their agenda was ever seeking fame.
Do they enjoy their "celeb status"? Probably some of the perks right now. My question: I wonder if they think of themselves as celebs? Who knows. We don't know them personally to know that answer. Regardless, I'm sure they know it'll come to an end and a more private life is ahead. Why not prepare for that now?
Smart woman for springboarding into a new career because of who she is. It's almost 2009 and she's smart enough to take advantage of opportunities in this economy. These opportunites will allow her to raise her kids without worry.
Kate says that talks about being a nurse. She chose labor and delivery because she loves babies. If she wants to work, why couldn't she do that again?
Laura, my guess is that PR and being a spokesperson pays more and allows her more time with her family.
I agree with Theresa.
She may have multiple career opportunities. Nursing comes with loooong hours on your feet.
I won't presume that Public Speaking is "easier" per se...I have acted with ease but Public Speaking would send me into an anxiety attack.
Not to provide fodder for the Anti-Kate crowd..when it comes to speaking about yourself, it is the rare exception that someone seemingly gifted in that genre doesn't fear coming across as an idiot and falling flat on their face.
It certainly IMHO isn't as labor intensive as nursing, but it is taxing none the less and not for the faint of heart.
And people are free to make their employment choices. Why should we hold her to nursing just b/c she said she enjoyed it at one time?
What is wrong with folks trying different things that test different skills and come with bigger paychecks.
My hubby loves bowling, but it would not be prudent to let him give up a career in engineering to manage a bowling alley.
How would it benefit the family for Kate to take a full time job as a nurse just b/c some people think that is a more appropriate job? Longer hours, lower pay, more time away from home, more exhausting job. Sure the new babies are a delight--but not all L&D's are harmonious and to an extent dealing with understandably moody patience could tax the nerves. I'm sure I challenged a nurse or two--especially this last time opting for drug free and getting the weighty surprise of a near 11pound baby.
The long hours at a hospital may not compare the amount Kate spends promoting herself. She wouldn't have to fly across the country to help deliver babies. Jon and Kate wouldn't be spending weekends at churches. They claim they do this so they can have two stay at home parents. So when is that going to happen? They talk in circles.
I think that with Public Speaking, Kate is her own boss,and she likes that. She can also pick her own hours.
In nursing she has to deal with a lot of different people. The shifts are either eight or twelve hours long. Labor and delivery is hard work. At times it can be exhausting. There are times when problems develop with either the baby or the mom, and an emergency c-section is needed. So, maybe Kate would be better as a newborn nursery nurse, since she likes new babies. She should consider that when the tups go to school.
Rene said...
The long hours at a hospital may not compare the amount Kate spends promoting herself.
There is a huge difference between flying to a church, say, in Georgia for an overnight stay and a speaking engagement, then being home the rest of the week, verses 40 hours a week on swing shifts where Kate may not have a chance to even see the kids when they are awake. The speaking offers them much more flexibility than a job where she would have to be available for a set amount of hours (especially since that would be how they got insurance).
My dad has worked full time (50 plus hours a week) as a pastor, but now does writing (both books, devotionals, and articles) as well as speaking engagements all over the world. I have to say that his traveling hither, thither, and yon is tough for the 2 weeks he is gone. What was even tougher, though, was being a 6 year old whose dad was gone really long hours for his new job. Don't get me wrong-- I love my parents and know they had to make sacrifices to provide for our big family on a single income. My dad made every effort to be at my orchestra concerts and track meets, but the late night board meetings and early mornings made for days on end where we wouldn't see him. When he travels now, he is able to have more time off when he is home (to make up for the long hours when he is gone). That allows more days off, more working from home, and a chance for him to spend the time with my nephew that I wish he had been able to spend with my brothers and I when we were little.
Obviously, I can see why Kate would really prefer that speaking and traveling- it gives a break while also offering a chance to focus on her job without distractions. If she had the full time nursing hours that she may want at some point, I honestly feel that she would miss out on far more.
I think Kate is a grown woman and can pursue whatever career she wants. Good Luck to her ( :
I think that K could make an excellent spokesperson and it doesn't surprise me that she is pursuing another source of income for when the show is no longer a source of revenue.
My instincts are that K thinks more about the family's financial security than J does. I think that J enjoys the perks but I think that K is the one who is planning for the future.
K is no different than the pundits who are all over the cable news shows as ...
"CNN Financial Analyst"
"FOX Lifestyles Editor"
"Today Show Style Contributor"
When I see these people on t.v. I think . . . "Says Who?" but the truth is that the people who land these kinds of gigs have an ability to market themselves and position themselves as an "expert in their field."
I kind of think of K in that way. She is certainly an expert in raising multiples, but I wonder how well she will be able to translate that to other areas.
============
Kate also is a self-declared home body, who struggles with speaking in front of others. I think it's good to see her grow in an area that she used to be uncomfortable in. Maybe this will be a great transition for their family when the Gosselins decide (or TLC) to no longer do the show. I would want to do it if it meant better pay and more time at home.
What in the world is Kate an expert in? What could she be saying any different to keep talking. Claim that she is an expert in multiples, it isn't like she is a fertility doctor.
I'm glad for her. Kate's come along way and she's seems to have done well for her family. Not an easy thing for woman to do, so Yeah! for her.
I am really surprised this topic generates any controversy at all. She's famous, so people want to see/hear/meet her. She's an expert on being Kate Gosselin, being married to Jon Gosselin, being the mother of the Gosselin children. She'll probably make much more money at this speaking career than starting again in a nursing career. Why would anyone crticize her for this decision, unless they just can't stand Kate Gosselin?
*It doesn't require cameras in the home.
*It doesn't require children to travel during the school year.
*It doesn't require the children to be on TV.
*It doesn't require any family drama or creative editing.
*It provides family income without the involvement of children.
*It allows for one parent to remain home (esp. if the kids are sick) without the need to "exploit" innocent family members or babysitters.
*It doesn't have to involve the "sin" of product endorsements, free medical procedure, cupcakes, free resort stays, or spa trips.
*All the children are treated equally.
Why isn't this satisfying Kate's detractors? Why isn't this being applauded by everyone on both sides of the Gosselin blogosphere?
Saint asked:
Why isn't this satisfying Kate's detractors? Why isn't this being applauded by everyone on both sides of the Gosselin blogosphere?
Because the detractors would have nothing to irrationally hate her about.
Over the years I've learned that in "damned if you do or damned if you don't" scenarios that it is usually the "damners" own issues.
I recall a situation in which I was having a discussion with someone about a very difficult family situation. Admittedly and wrongly, I got upset. I didn't yell or scream but I raised my voice.
Of course, this was enough for the person I was attempting to discuss this with to say, "You don't need to get angry."
So months later, we revisited the situation and we had a very calm discussion. No anger, no raised voices, no nothing. But nothing changed.
The person's answer this time? "You are so calm. It's like you don't even care."
K is in this position with people who have strong feelings against her.
BTW, I actually think that a nursing background can be a very good springboard for a variety of careers.
I know nurses who left clinical practice to pursue careers in
Pharmaceutical Sales
Home Organizing
Public Speaking
Mediation
Food/Nutrition Demonstrator
Elderly Move/Transition Coordinator
They've said that their background in the wards and in the classroom has been invaluable in these other areas.
Right on, morecowbell, right on!!!
Her public speaking skills are poor at best. She comes across as very cold and dull. Her voice has no enthusiasm or excitement at all. She'll need some serious coaching to pull this off and actually do well with it.
Pam:
I agree with you. Kate does need some serious coaching with her speaking skills. Her "um" every two seconds is very distracting. I don't know why she continues to say that, but she needs to learn that it doesn't sound good.
I think the people who assume she should just go back to nursing need to seriously consider that statement in regards to having 8 children. The family could not survive on a single income so Jon and Kate would BOTH have to go back to work. While all 8 might be in school there will still be a need for child care after 3pm. Anyone who works a normal job knows perfectly well that you don't get home at 3pm. So for anywhere from 3-5 hours a day, depending on shifts and hours, the kids would need care.
The cost of paying a babysitter, an after school program or a private child care provider for those hours would like cost more than a one of the incomes.
Kate wouldn't be offered speaking engagements if it weren't for the children. Now she's away speaking, pursuing personal stardom, and the children are at home with no Mommy. Is this dammed if she does and dammed if she doesn't?
Andie:
Jon and Kate could save money on babysitters, and private child care, if they had family to help them.
Sorry, but I just can't see Kate as a successful public speaker. She does not come across as warm and friendly and she can barely put a sentence together without "ums" and other filler. I also don't think she is good at being a corporate spokesperson. The tips she gives are laughable--meatloaf and sandwich recipes anyone could make--c'mon! I don't think these careers "exploit" the children because they are not being filmed, but I also think Kate would do better to stay home and spend quality time with her family rather than jet around the country for speaking engagements. It's almost as if she gets along better with her family from a distance.
Kate wouldn't be offered speaking engagements if it weren't for the children. Now she's away speaking, pursuing personal stardom, and the children are at home with no Mommy. Is this dammed if she does and dammed if she doesn't?
Is that a rhetorical questions? It's sort of like complaining that the food is terrible, and there's so little of it!
As for Kate being a terrible speaker, I've never seen her at a live event, so it's hard for me to say. People definitely can improve in that arena, I think - if practice doesn't make perfect, I think it at least makes one more comfortable.
I'm not sure what her long-term prospects are for inspirational speaking and/or being some sort of telivision personality. I wouldn't count her out, though - I think Kate is pretty good at achieving the goals she sets for herself.
It baffles me that anyone would deign to suggest what career path another should take. Seriously? Why can't she just go back to nursing? First of all I can confidenlty say that it's none of our business- yes confidentally.
Second, there are several nurses in our family and nurses work INSANE hours. It is highly likely that Kate will have more time with the kids as a speaker than working swing shifts/holidays etc.
Also, would you be complaining if it were Jon rather than Kate? I doubt it. I suppose she should have consulted the public before making a career move.....
My sister's childcare experience was that in the beginning a lot of family members offered to care for her kids after school.
She has two children who are relatively well-behaved and still it was very challenging to get family members to consistently follow-through in the long-term and she didn't have 8 kids.
ChinaMomof4,
How do you explain her "rock star-like" reception at these book signings if she is as lousy at this as you contend? Why does she fill the seats at these speaking engagements?
Are you frustrated by her success?
If TLC and J&K's management were smart, they'd have a voice coach for her. She would only need to have about a half a dozen or so lessons and she'd be fine.
I took voice lessons to get rid of an accent, and with the proper coaching she can do it. She will learn proper pronunciation (to get rid of the "are" and make it "our") and she'll learn to stop the um's and other filler.
She just needs better coaching for interviews and a voice teacher.
Coming out of holiday mode to say that I think it would be impossible for this woman to do anything that would "satisfy" that lot who seem to hate her and enjoy ridiculing her. What would they ever do if they didn't have her as an outlet for their anger and frustration? Kate's not my ideal when it comes to personality. She seems odd when she speaks to someone in a store (a la "thank you" with no eye contact and a dismissive attitude) I don't know why she is like that, whether it is her upbringing or the way she has been criticized so she figures why the hell bother. But to jump all over this public speaking issue seems incredibly hypocritical and tells me everything I need to know about the "advocates" for the children. The children won't be there. She will do this on her own. The kids will be home with Jon, I presume. She will be setting them up so they can wean the family off the cameras. If she's smart with her earnings she will save it for the future. It's a career she might do well in and can leave nursing behind which is a noble profession but won't pay the bills for 8 kids.
I'm also sure there is a certain amount of anger that she has been able to parlay their show into another way of making money. Would it be better if the kids went off the air and there was no contingent plan for income? Let's make the family completely poor and down and out. Then let's harp on that and blame J & K for it. Nothing surprises me when it comes to criticism of this family. No matter what they do it is fodder for snarky blogs. In the meantime, Kate will just got to her speaking engagements and that will be that. Time will tell if she can make a go of it. I wish her well. It will get the kids off TV sooner and I think that as they get older, this would be a good thing.
Totally agree with you Mary.
People should not judge others, nor hold it against them for their success. And, people shouldn't use one person for their anger or jealousy. Get off your butt and make your life better instead of complaining about someone who's doing just that for her family. It's easier to criticize others, than work on yourself.
I can't imagine why people would want to see this family in the same position as they were "in the beginnig" (the people who are either jealous or don't like them). People grow, people change, and smart people aspire for more and work for it, especially with eight mouths to feed.
I'll say it again. I'm glad Kate is pursuing other and additional avenues of income for their family. I think it's an extremely smart move to parlay out of the tv arena and cash in on the extra opportunites (like the book, speaking engagements, and spokesperson role). If someone wants to make her a spokesperson for their product, so be it. That's their choice. And, give the gal a chance.
If anything, with criticism of the show they might see in email (as they discussed on the Interview Chair), Kate has developed a thick skin, which is essential in doing the new career.
In a way, Kate putting herself out in the public is still putting the children in the public eye. The next book she has her name on is a photo album of the kids.
Saint,
Whoa, touchy aren't we? I am certainly NOT "frustrated by her success," any more than I am "frustrated" because Angelina Jolie can make millions of dollars making movies and have fancy houses all over the world. Good for her, but who cares? I am not jealous of celebrities. I like my life and am successful at what I do, and I have no desire to be famous.
Why does it make you so angry if someone says something less than positive about Kate? This blog is usually even-handed about her and the show, which is one of the reasons I like it so much more than GWoP. I am not a Kate hater by any means, but I certainly don't think she is perfect. In fact, the main reason I like the show is because she and Jon AREN'T perfect. It's refreshing to see a family where the parents bicker and aren't sweet towards the kids 24/7. That's real life!
As to why Kate gets a rock-star reception at her book signings, a book signing does not generally involve any public speaking, so I don't think that's a fair comparison. People go to her speaking engagements because they are curious about the family. I would go to one if she were in the area, because I like the family and the show. But once her fame fades--and it will--Kate just doesn't have that "sparkle" that sets really successful public speakers apart from the rest. That's the only point I was trying to make. I don't know why you read so much into it.
Manda
In a way, Kate putting herself out in the public is still putting the children in the public eye. The next book she has her name on is a photo album of the kids.
How do you feel about the Jolie/Pitts selling their pictures of the twins to the highest bidder?
Let's forget where the money went to. We are talking about putting children in the public eye.
Celebrities do those first pictures for magazines because otherwise paparazzi would be after their family trying to get the first picture. These celebrities are not shoving their children into the public. The public is after them. I think that the book shows that Kate's new career is not a way to wean the kids out of the public eye.
Manda,
They are still putting their children out in the public eye. Big time. I wonder how much it really discourages photographers from wanting the next big photo. Not much. Why do it at all? If it is wrong for Kate, it is wrong for the Jolie Pitts.
Nina -
How do you feel about the Jolie/Pitts selling their pictures of the twins to the highest bidder?
Let's forget where the money went to. We are talking about putting children in the public eye.
I don't think that's a fair comparison. If Jolie/Pitt didn't sell those pictures, pictures of their kids would appear anyway, and could possibly put someone in danger by the lengths photographers would go to to get the first shot of the children. Unfortunately, because of their profession and popularity, paparazzi follow them everywhere and get paid very well for exclusive pictures of the family. Photographers have actually broken laws to try to take private pictures. The safest and most controlled option is for Jolie/Pitt is to release the photos themselves or through a news agency. I think if it was an option that they could keep pictures of their kids private they would.
Last I checked, no photographers were following the Gosselin's every move, unless it was for their TV show. And it is Jon and Kate's choice to publicized their family for their financial gain.
AAP
I am glad you posted. I don't have your email address but the person who was going to write the post was unable to do so. Actually she had it almost completed and it did not save and then Christmas happened.
I can't remember exactly what it was about, but if you want to write something up I will post it.
ninabell53@gmail.com
Nina -
I was wondering what happened. The topic (I think) was about the how commericialized Jon and Kate's show has become. I'm down with a cold right now, and I think people were able to get their points across on another topic. However, I wouldn't mind coming up with something next time it comes up on the show, or if people still think there is a need for a separate topic on the subject. I'm going to send you another post with my email address.
AAP
Now back to your comment.I don't really care what Brad and Angie do but for the sake of this discussion I disagree. I don't give them a pass for that.
The security that surrounds them is unbelievable. I would take my chances with my children not being photographed rather than selling their pictures to people magazine.
Nina -
Yet even with all their security, when they were staying in France and Angelina was pregnant 2 photographers where able to trespass on the grounds of the estate they were staying at to try to get private pictures of the family and that is with the photographers knowing that they will have planned photo opportunities of the kids. Could you imagine what lengths photographers would go to if there has never been a published photo of the kids and they were the first ones to snap it? They would be able to reture on that picture alone.
The Jolie/Pitts kids will never have a "normal" life - I don't think you can even compare them with most other celebrity kids, but if the choice is to have them lead a life of seclusion always on the look out for the photographers, or have a few public, planned shots out there to lessen the competition of the photographers I know what I would pick.
As a said before, Jon and Kate have put their children in the public eye for financial reasons. What do you think the reason Brad and Angelina do?
I don't know why Brad and Angelina do what they do just like I really don't know why Kate and Jon do what they do. I am not privy to either one's private thoughts. What you say makes sense and of course it is not like I haven't read and seen that explanation before.
It just seems to me that we have different standards for everyone else but Jon and Kate. We can explain away everyone else's decisions.
Here Kate appears to be trying to branch out and possibly make a living separate from the show but this statement " In a way, Kate putting herself out in the public is still putting the children in the public eye." won't allow her to even do that.
The argument could perhaps be made that Brad and Angelina choose the lifestyle for their children as much as Jon and Kate. They decided to be in the public eye by their career choice; they use the press as any other famous people do when it suits them for business or charity; they depend on the press to generate publicity for their project which generates income for them. They put themselves out there which causes hysteria and people wanting to know all about their lives including their children. So their choices certainly could put their kids in harm's way and they surely know that and it's a risk that they take to continue living the life they want. It's true for anyone who is in the public eye for any reason--like judges, prosecutors, or even police officers.
I'm just saying...why is Kate different or judge more harshly?
Thank you Jace,
You said it far better than I did.
I don't think these upcoming speaking engagements are any different then the speaking engagements that the Gosselins have done in the past. Perhaps, the only real change is that Kate is stepping out more on her own and Jon is staying home with the kids?
My husband and I saw Jon and Kate at a speaking engagement last February. The Gosselins have a great story and an even better faith and love of the Lord. It was wonderful and we would go and see them again!
I don't think Kate is judged any more harshly than other celebrities and it doesn't seem to me that Jon or Kate take it at all seriously. Matt and Amy get their share of over-the-top hatred as do most other reality show celebrities.
Samantha, is it really about what is or isn't our business when discussing this show? Isn't that what discussion forums are about?
I'm not much of a Kate fan, but I do like that she is doing speaking gigs without the kids. Jon seems like a good dad and can handle things just fine while Kate is away. This means the kids don't usually get filmed while Kate is gone, so they get a "vacation" from "work"! I doubt if Kate will develop a lifelong career of public speaking, because there's just so much that can be said for raising children, no matter if they are multiples. If she can make money at it now and it does not affect the kids, then I see nothing wrong in it.
Nina -
But Jon and Kate have stated that they do the show to provide income for their family, so you do know that is one reason they continue on with the show.
I realize that this might not be directed towards me, but the statement you bolded didn't come from me, and I haven't really critized Kate and Jon other than to say that they used their kids to provide them with income.
As for Kate's public speaking career, I agree with a previous poster that she needs training to really be successful at it. In my view, the speaker/spokeperson career is what Kate's trying to futher with all the commercials/"fake situations" (sorry I can't think of the right word here) in the show.
I think she is using her "reality" tv show to try and create this image of an every day "super mom" brand that she can use once the show is over. What bothers me is that Jon and Kate insist things are real when they are not, to further enhance this image. She just doesn't come off to me as someone who is credible. I might be in the minority in thinking that Kate is fake, but I think that is something she needs to change as well for me to see her becoming successful.
It's hard for me to answer your question about whether or not I think Kate becoming a professional speaker as being better for the kids, because, based on the reasons I just gave, I still see her using her kids to do it.
Wouldn't one of the main differences be that in all the examples you stated, if you take the kids out, these people would still have the jobs they do? So it's really not that the parents chose this lifestyle for their kids, but continuing a career they have begun long before children came into the picture.
Take the kids out of Jon and Kate and you have no show. Jon and Kate chose this lifestyle for their family. I'm not judging Kate (or Jon) at all, just stating a fact. I don't see any of the people you mentioned selling pictures of the kids to make money other than Jon and Kate.
Samantha, I agree with Rain 88. This is a discussion board about the show. What should we talk about, how hot Jon is looking lately? Would you like to tell us what topics are/aren't acceptable?
Take the kids out of Jon and Kate and you have no show.
I am not so sure about this anymore. People came to the book signings to see Kate. They knew the children would not be there. They come to the speaking engagements and they know the children will not be there.
I agree that without the children the show would not exist as it is today. I am not so sure that there is not a venue for Kate and Jon sans the children now.
Jace -
They decided to be in the public eye by their career choice; they use the press as any other famous people do when it suits them for business or charity; they depend on the press to generate publicity for their project which generates income for them. They put themselves out there which causes hysteria and people wanting to know all about their lives including their children.
Everything you said can also be applied to Meryl Streep, yet can you tell me what her children and husband look like? I think it takes more than being in the public eye to create the hysteria that surrounds Brad Pitt and Angelina Jolie.
I was reading about how one of the reasons Suri Cruise is one of the most photographed celebrity children is because Tom Cruise & Katie Holmes have made a deal with photographers that they will arrange for 1 photo op a day in exchange for leaving the family alone the rest of the time.
Are you suggesting that celebrities should stop acting once they have children? Because to me it looks like children have entered the world that the celebrities already had, while Jon and Kate created this world for their kids. To me, that is what the difference is. I think I beat this dead horse enough - lol.
Nina -
I agree with your point. When I said that there would be no show without the kids I was referring to the fact that no one would do a show about Jon and Kate. I agree that now the show has been established, Kate can attract an audience on her own.
I really don't know where I stand in this healthy debate so I am going to pretty much stay out of it and enjoy reading your comments! I do want to say that as a reformed TMZ/Perez Hilton addict (I went through all 12 steps - HA. However, you'll have to pry my People magazine out of my cold dead hands!), there are lots of celebrities whose children are not in the spotlight, or are very, very little. I have wondered before about this. So do celebrities such as Brad and Angelina bring this on themselves through their own conduct, or are they "victims" of the paparazzi machine, or...I'm not sure.
Rain88 and Que-
So very glad you responded to my comment. This topic is perfectly acceptable, it isnt the topic I was respoding to. It's a very relevant topic actually, although Que I wasn't aware you were choosing the topics these days. Also, I'm well aware what discussion forums are for.
Kate says that talks about being a nurse. She chose labor and delivery because she loves babies. If she wants to work, why couldn't she do that again?
This is the type of statement that bugs me- That's what I was respondig to. People evolve, people change, their situation has obviously changed since she first chose nursing. I can't imagine thinking I know what is best for someonelse. It isn't about what any of us think is best for their family (regardless that this is a discussion forum) it's about what they choose. Period.
On another note, I hope you all had a great Christmas- we're still recovering!
Hi Nina. This is a bit off-topic, but I wanted to compliment you on an interesting poll. You guys have gotten a LOT of responses for a quiet holiday weekend! Just wanted to mention, however, that I had to check "None of the Above." The show I am eagerly awaiting is "Jon & Kate Plus 8." Hey, I know it's only been two weeks, but it is a returning show!
Anyway, I believe the reason people are checking "None of the Above" is because J&K is *not* an option. Just FYI.
Samantha,
I agree with you. Telling anyone else what their profession "should" be seems nervy to me, too.
I disagree with the "calmer" poster who thinks Kate has no *sparkle*. I think she has a lot of *sparkle* and I think the crowds at her speaking engagements and book signings a *prove* my point without my having to personally attack anyone else.
Samantha, maybe I misread your original quote because it certainly seems as if you are complaining about people who are talking about possible careers Kate could have, when the topic is clearly Kate's New Career. However, if it wasn't your intent to chastise other posters for their opinions, then I apologize.
Kate says that talks about being a nurse. She chose labor and delivery because she loves babies. If she wants to work, why couldn't she do that again?
This is the type of statement that bugs me- That's what I was respondig to. People evolve, people change, their situation has obviously changed since she first chose nursing. I can't imagine thinking I know what is best for someonelse.
Apparently you think you know better than the person posting that statement, which as I read it, is just an opinion. As opposed to an insult to the people posting about Kate continuing her nursing career.
It isn't about what any of us think is best for their family (regardless that this is a discussion forum) it's about what they choose. Period.
Well, then, is there a need for a topic on what everyone thinks about Kate's new career? Kate chooses to be a public speaker - the discussion is over. There's really no point for this topic to continue.
And can I say is anything Jon and Kate chose to do really our business?
As for picking topics, I wasn't aware that I was doing that. I just gave an example of a possible topic I thought you would approve of.
That "opinion," Que, in the context of this thread is like saying nursing is a better option than the public speaking. It's also unsupported. There is nothing in it to defend the opinion. Just a little "turd in the pool" so they say. IMO. It's about the 10th post down by "Laura."
The next two posters disagree with nursing as a better option. And they support their opinions! Good job Theresa and A-Mom-ynous! Then "Rene" posts with her reason why nursing is better (better hours!) and the opinion that Jon and Kate "talk in circles" because they say they do speaking engagements to have 2 stay-at-home parents and "when is that going to happen?" which is talking in circles...because nursing isn't going to provide 2 stay-at-home parents.
There are people posting here just to be downers and negative.
I also really think that if this thread were called "Kate Gosselin Has Two Arms" these posters would have something to disagree with about that.
I know I sound ornery tonight, but do I have to pretend I don't see what I see here?
New stories said that Brad & Angelina got $14 million for the pictures of their twins.
I also really think that if this thread were called "Kate Gosselin Has Two Arms" these posters would have something to disagree with about that.
Saint- I laughed out loud, so true! Thanks for understanding my point I thought I was speaking in a foreign tongue for a moment.
Linda-
I also heard that they got that much for those pictures. That amazes me- I dont understand the intense interest in celeb kids(at least not to the tune of 14 million!) Although it it is funny to hear what odd names they come up with- Bronx Mowgli, Zuma Nesta etc.....
I sometimes wonder if I were on television, what traits of mine would people be blogging about? What would they say about me?
What would people blog about you, if you were on TV?
I'd probably be criticized for spending too much time on the internet! Not exercising enough! My accent sounding too Minnesotan when I'm not from there!
I don't believe there was anything wrong with Laura's post. It's her opinion on an option for Kate. Why does that make her a turd in the pool? Isn't nursing a valid option. Why is that insulting?
Reality Show star is a relatively new phenomenom, so it will be interesting to see how this all plays out.
Isn't nursing a valid option. Why is that insulting?
Nursing is a very valid option for anyone who wants to be a nurse..... which clearly Kate does not want to do at this time.
I remember reading something that Jenny McCarthy wrote after she discussed her autistic son. She said she hoped people wouldn't judge her too harshly when she took roles that were questionable. In other words, she was going to take what she could in order to make money. She said she would do whatever it took to fatten her bank account so that her son was assured the proper care and so that she could invest some time and money into the autistic research world.
Moms and dads do all kinds of things to make money to ensure their families are well taken care of because that's what we do.
My husband currently works two jobs to make ends meet.
In other words, Kate is doing what she feels necessary to make ends meet and to ensure that her children's financial future is cushy. Good for her!
It's none of my business if she chooses to work as a nurse, a public speaker or anything else she chooses. Last I heard, this is a free country and we can do what we want to do.
Anonymous
Please resubmit your comment with a screen name.
Thank you
Rain88,
I am sorry you do not understand the words I wrote.
I think maybe you need to reread my response.
You say I called someone a "turd in the pool" but I haven't.
Nor did I say nursing is not a valid option or an insult.
Try again.
What was wrong with Laura's post then? She suggested Kate could be a nurse. I took her post at face value and didn't see any animosity in what she said.
Nor did I say nursing is not a valid option or an insult.
Try again.
Here's me trying again.I re-read your post, Saint and I still don't know who/what the turd in the pool is in this scenario. I've heard the epression "dropping the kids off at the pool" but I don't think that's what you meant.
That "opinion," Que, in the context of this thread is like saying nursing is a better option than the public speaking.
Saint, I'll say this again. The topic is about Kate's new career. Maybe the poster believes that nursing is better than public speaking. Doesn't she have a right to her opinion? She's not stating for a fact that nursing is better, so why should she need to support it?
Why is it ok for you and Samantha to criticized an poster for her opinion, yet it's not right for the poster to "to suggest what career path another should take." Why does free speech only belong to you and Samantha?
Kate doesn't read this blog. No one posting here thinks what they write is going to affect Jon and Kate's life at all. Wouldn't you at least need a conversation with the person before being accused of dictating what a person should/shouldn't do with their life?
I don't think their agenda was ever seeking fame.
Just stating a fact not judging them; what did they expect by sending out tapes of the children to various TV outlets as they stated they did? Did they expect a TV show probably not but to think they didn't expect any fame is a little far fetched. Not saying its a bad thing just saying it didn't happen without some help from J&K.
There are people posting here just to be downers and negative. I havent posted here in almost a week oh, oops wasn't talking about me lol.
Some people just can't stand Kate, some love her, some of them could care less either way. Kinda reminds me of Patrick Swayze in the movie Roadhouse, when he said "opinions vary." But since this is a blog it is nice to see other opinions, and thoughts or ideas, at least I think so.
NC resident,
Welcome back and I hope you had a nice holiday.
Nina thanks and yes I did my mom isn't doing well, though. I vacummed, dusted, cooked to help her out. Hope you and everyone else did as well.
Que-
At no point did I say that anyone wasnt entitled to their own opinion. Interesting that you site freedom of speech and continue to lambaste me for my comment. I have every right to disgree with another poster which is exactly what I was doing (as most of us do when we strongly disagree.) You can't post here and expect to go unchallenged, I don't and neither should you. Interesting that it seems to have ruffled your feathers a lot more than Laura's. I have nothing more to say on the matter so post away, let me have it for daring to question someonelse's opinion- I don't play games and I won't be responding to you on this topic any further.
Que and Rain88,
I hope I can just combine parts of your comments to answer.
What was wrong with Laura's post then?
My answer, again, from one of my other comments: "There are people posting here just to be downers and negative." That's what a teacher calls the "main idea" of the paragraph. Here's a "supporting detail:" "It's also unsupported. There is nothing in it to defend the opinion." That's my opinion.
If you are swimming, Rainn88, and you see a turd in the pool, you should get out.
If I am reading a thread and it looks like a one-time poster writes a comment that is negative, just to be negative, without an explanation to support it, it is like seeing a "turd in the pool." Most of us ignored these comments for what they were, not real discussion, because we end up with this "explain to me why we can't poop here" stuff. Samantha noted that the comment baffles her, and frankly I agree. If that comment was posted here just to express an opinion, then my response is, "You are nervy to tell someone what to do for a living." That's my opinion. It is far more likely that Laura just dumped a turd in the pool though since, as Samantha also pointed out, "Interesting that it seems to have ruffled your feathers a lot more than Laura's." Laura hasn't defended it.
Why is it ok for you and Samantha to criticized an poster for her opinion, yet it's not right for the poster to "to suggest what career path another should take." I said it's nervy, because that's what I think. Samantha is baffled by it, because she is baffleed by it. Those are opinions in response to a comment. I also described the comment as negative for the sake of being negative.
Why does free speech only belong to you and Samantha?
I will not defend this position I have not taken.
Actually I was having a bit of a problem over the weekend with the same person posting over and over again but using a different screen name and I suspect that Laura was one of those trolling type posts. I deleted some of them and rejected most.
NC Res,
Welcome back!
I also like varied opinions.
I like the commenters to discuss the opinions though and not demand that they go unchallenged.
I don't actually know anyone on here, so I am sure that no one should take my opinion as a personal attack or an attempt to strip tham of their First Amendment rights. :)
I took Laura's comment at face value and was trying to understand why she upset you with what seemed to me a valid response to the topic. I had no idea that she was trolling.
Nina,
when you write that you suspect Laura was "one of those trolling types," do you mean that you think she was just being negative for the sake of being negative? That's my point in all this. It can be ignored, or it can be responded to. I thought Samantha was very reasonable in her response. I didn't think she should be accused of wanting to control the topics.
rain 88
No I know you didn't. It is hard for us to tell also. I posted it and I should have deleted it but people had already started to respond.
Ok,
I see the pool has been cleaned. I apologize for prolonging this. I see I am going "overboard" at this point.
Adult swim!
"Are you suggesting that celebrities should stop acting once they have children?"
Actually, I was making a point about double standards.
Kids in the public eye are there because of their parent's choices. Whether it is Brangelina or Jon and Kate. No one would suggest that Angelina should give up her career and do something else. But Kate is evil and awful according to some.
If we carry it to it's logical but ridiculous conclusion, maybe Obama shouldn't have sought the presidency? He has now put his young girls are now put in the spot light forever. No privacy; everything they do will be public knowledge...No, the situations do not compare in gravity, but in each case kids are sacrificing anonymity for their parents' choices.
Kate is attacked for it because she is disliked but she is not doing anything differently than other parents. In fact, it seems that they are taking steps to put the kids less in the public eye than before as they get older. But she will get no credit for that. It actually wouldn't matter what she did, some people (general people) just want to complain about her like it's their job. :)
Well yes
This particular person does not like our blog and she drops these type of comments to stir things up and does not participate in conversations. She uses different screen names. Her comments are always negative.
But there are others. LOL There is one person who likes to post both positive and negative comments. She "dumbs" up the positive comments though so that people think that the "fans" or "pro" Gosselin commenters are not very bright. Then she goes on other blogs and states that she knows for a fact that we don't post all of our comments, even the pro comments.
We try to post all comments and certainly do if it is a regular poster here whether they are fans or non fans. It would be great if everyone would sign up for a google ID. It would make it easier. But at this point we don't require that because I like the participation from posters such as NC residetn, AAP, Rain 88 and Linda that don't use google ID.
Saint-
Thanks for more thoroughly explaining what I apparently could not. I would never want anyone to think that I want to control the discussion bc I don't, but I will respond to other posts (both good and bad)- I'm glad you understood where I'm coming from!
Saint, love the Adult Swim comment :).
I've been reading the comments and trying to figure out why it is that some don't quite compute with me. I think I finally discovered the reason.
Part of the root issue here is in how Kate "got" her career. Some think she should have stayed with nursing, others think she is being wise to "strike while the iron is hot" so to speak.
You know what, though? None of that is necessarily valid. How she got here cannot be changed. Whether you are for or against the show, it has happened and the fact that Jon and Kate plus 8 exists cannot be changed.
So, because of that, I am very much in support of Kate branching out and creating her own brand. How can that hurt the children? It gives her money which is gained without their privacy being lost. Writing books is an outlet to share things she has learned (and honestly, Multiple Blessings was really inspirational to me. It helped me see the world a little differently, so she has succeeded in that quest). By doing more work outside of the home Kate is providing in a way Jon has not really been able to, as well as allowing her children a more 'normal' life.
In the end, the path up to now cannot be undone, so I think Kate is making the best of a situation that so many are against. The actions of the show are supposedly what the advocates are against, and her new career steps away from the show. Even those who do not like Kate for who she is as a person should be at least grateful that this gives the kids a break from her behavior. Personally, I think its a positive step in the right direction, and a way to shift focus from the kids.
Jace, I agree with you, too-- public eye is public eye, whether through a tv show or by seeing pics online and in magazines every week. All families who make that choice should be aware of the consequences, and do their best to protect their children. Again, I see these changes to be a reflection of that direction for Jon and Kate's family.
I see nothing wrong with Kate doing public speaking. I think it is better to be away from the kids one or two days a week versus up to 16 hour days at the hospital. If I remember right, when they were moving into the house (they just moved out of) and Jon had to pack and do it almost all on his own he stated she had a 16 hour shift I (I think it was that or 14 hours). Either way, that's a long time to be gone. And before I get lambasted that other women work as nurses with families, yes they do but how many of them have sextuplets at home? I would find the full time mom job hard enough with that many children. I guess my point is, if Kate decides to make this a career path for the time being, good for her. I actually would rather her be doing that than the constant filming of the kids. I still hope they taper their shows down to 2 a year.
At this point, Kate could be a nurse and some people would piss and moan she is gone all the time from her family or if she public speaks then she is a fraud out promoting her family. Either way, nothing will satisfy the masses so they need to do what makes them happy, supports their family and brush their shoulders off when the insults are hurled their way.
And Samantha,
I have never seen you try to control a conversation. You are just passionate about how you feel and that's a good thing. Free will. Never give it up. Pretty much sums it up for all the regulars here, everyone has differing and some same opinions. Either way, its never dull :)
It would be great if everyone would sign up for a google ID.
I created one and forgot the password and user ID. haha Any ideas on how to retrieve that??
NC Resident
Go to google home page and go to the area where you sign in. There is prompting for you if you have forgotten something. I am not sure if they will be able to help you though if you don't have any info. Probably best to start over. You can just change your user name slightly if you do a new ID.
Also, once you have an ID and sign in with google, you do not have to fill it out under the comment box each time. It will automatically fill it in for you if you are signed in.
Nina, I would like to respond to this one last time and then I'm done.
It baffles me that anyone would deign to suggest what career path another should take. Seriously? Why can't she just go back to nursing? First of all I can confidenlty say that it's none of our business- yes confidentally.
To me this statement does not challenge the OP beliefs about Kate returning to nursing. Instead chastises the OP for daring to offer a suggestion on what Kate's career could possibly be. Saint's comment about the poster being nervy to do so is also along the same lines.
We all agree that this board offers us free speech, so how about we challenge the ideas and not the person's ability to offer a suggestion, even if we can "confidentially" say that it's something you don't believe Jon and Kate would/should/could do.
Que,
I hope you don't mind my responding to a comment you made about me and Samantha to Nina.
You are right that sometimes posters criticize commenters more than their comments. Look at this one:
What should we talk about, how hot Jon is looking lately? directed at Samantha. Low blow.
Followed by this:
Apparently you think you know better than the person posting that statement,
or this unhelpful nugget: Why does free speech only belong to you and Samantha?
I hope we won't see any of these personal digs anymore.
Que I reread this thread twice and felt as you did. The original post was discussion on Kates new career: How do you feel about Kate’s (potential) new career?If everyone felt this was taboo to discuss why wasn't it said to the mods let not discuss this?
I also have questions why when we discuss a show that is editted and a limited to window in their lives as many here say, it's editted we don't know what happens. Those comment are usually made in response to a negative or contrary post. Not being rude but I really can't assume Kate is a great mom, wife or cook based on the show. The last chicken thing Jon said Kate made, but we didnt see it. But I feel that if everyone said Kate is great at this, this and that it would not be challenged based on editting or limited windows in their lives.
We have no more evidence to support the good or the bad so much of this is opinion. Without opinions we would have no message boards.
If everyone felt this was taboo to discuss why wasn't it said to the mods let not discuss this?
Who said it is taboo? Who? Samantha? Me? Samantha gave a response to Laura, and Que made that crack about Samantha trying to control topics.
Que said something to Nina about how Samantha and I should respond. She just suggested a rule about responses ("how about we challenge the ideas and not the person's ability to offer a suggestion") that she's not really followed herself in the thread. You just complained about responses that mention editing. Now, I actually agree with what you then wrote, (which I think is) that editing works both ways. And that's how I think the discussion should work. You challenge what someone writes and say why, without trying to institute a rule about how we can respond.
I don't mind if you speak up. Look, if you want to criticize, do so. May I respond?
Saint and Samantha, I apologize for the tone of my post. It was sarcastic in nature, and I was trying to use my sarcasm to illustrate the tone of Samantha's post.
Samantha gave a response to Laura, and Que made that crack about Samantha trying to control topics.
I still stand by original assessment of Samantha's How dare you tone in her post, and how she can confidently say something about Kate when I don't believe she knows Kate personality. In addition, while Laura might have been a troll, on face value there isn't anything insulting about her post, and I don't believe anyone knew of her trollish nature when they commented on her OP.
My personal pet peeve on this blog is when someone takes a holier than thou approach, trying to chastise a poster for stating an opinion about Jon and Kate they don't agree with by stating this is really none of our business to talk about. I gave Samantha full responsibility for this attitude, when I know she is not the only one who does it. Again, if I took my comments too far I apologize.
Que said something to Nina about how Samantha and I should respond. She just suggested a rule about responses ("how about we challenge the ideas and not the person's ability to offer a suggestion")
Actually, I wasn't just directing this towards you and Samantha, and was including myself in the statement. I thought it was a fair way to end it and move forward.
Saint said: Samantha gave a response to Laura, and Que made that crack about Samantha trying to control topics.Samanthas' intial response was not appropriate I feel. That's what my comment was related to, the other comments I looked over. Since the topic was her new career how can someone say its nobodys' business and expect the thread to continue?
Nothing discussed about this show concerns us, or is our business per se right? To me it looked as if someone felt like they needed to thwart a negative comment about Kate. Personally I didn't feel her comment (Laura) was negative at all. Kate was a nurse, just last week she confirmed she was and still is a nurse.
Not speaking for, or defending Que, but that comment about Jon (looking hot) has been posted on at least one other thread here. Maybe that is why they said that. But personal attacks are not acceptable when we come to discuss and debate the show. IMO Lets hope we do not see any more I agree.
I just want to thank everyone involved in this discussion for talking it through in the manner in which you are doing so.
I know it is important to let the people involved in this to work through it.
Thank you everyone,
You feel Laura's comment was fine. I didn't. I thought Samantha's response was fine. You didn't. Que defended Laura; I defended Samantha; NC Res defended Que.
Agree to disagree?
I like you all, and I hope we can disagree and/or agree on another thread.
:)
MY ORIGINAL POST:
It baffles me that anyone would deign to suggest what career path another should take. Seriously? Why can't she just go back to nursing? First of all I can confidenlty say that it's none of our business- yes confidentally.
Second, there are several nurses in our family and nurses work INSANE hours. It is highly likely that Kate will have more time with the kids as a speaker than working swing shifts/holidays etc.
Also, would you be complaining if it were Jon rather than Kate? I doubt it. I suppose she should have consulted the public before making a career move.....
I said I wouldnt respond further hoping that we could stop beating adead horse but apparently that is not to be. I have been nice, now I'm just annoyed.
Que said:
I still stand by original assessment of Samantha's How dare you tone in her post, and how she can confidently say something about Kate when I don't believe she knows Kate personality. In addition, while Laura might have been a troll, on face value there isn't anything insulting about her post, and I don't believe anyone knew of her trollish nature when they commented on her OP.
My personal pet peeve on this blog is when someone takes a holier than thou approach, trying to chastise a poster for stating an opinion about Jon and Kate they don't agree with by stating this is really none of our business to talk about. I gave Samantha full responsibility for this attitude, when I know she is not the only one who does it. Again, if I took my comments too far I apologize.
I have and will continue to respond to other posts- you certainly feel that you have the privelage to do so. I have never been "holier than thou". And yes Que I do feel thta you have taken your comments "too far"- over and over again. I cant fathom why my comment that I can't understand why someonelse feels that they know what is best for another has infuriated you so. I do not owe you an apology, nor do I owe Laura one. You act as though I launched a vicious personal attack when all I did was say that another comment baffled me- which it did. By the way, I never said I knew Kate- I said that I could confidentaly say that its none of our business- discussing is one thing, stating what someonelse should do is far too presumptious. I have been posting here for months and have had no such issues with any other poster- Kudos to you for bringing some drama to the board.
I don't think QUE or NC resident have taken their comments too far. I had the same reaction to the "none of our business" comment.
I think I've finally got this Google ID thing figured out, but for some reason I seem to have to recreate my account every time I leave and come back.
If you have google as your home page, once you sign in you can visit all of the blogger blogs without signing in and out.
Nina thanks for the Google help. Formerly known as Prince oops Nc resident hehe
TLCed Out
Great, I am glad you were able to figure it out.
Saint, I agree to disagree, and hope we can have some more interesting conversations in the future.
Samantha, I'm sorry my apology and explanation wasn't up to your standards.
Happy New Year's everyone! I'm off to have some sparkling grape juice with my kids.
Post a Comment