Thursday, January 1, 2009

OPEN DISCUSSION

Feel free to discuss whatever is on your mind.

324 comments:

1 – 200 of 324   Newer›   Newest»
CincyMom said...

I saw a commercial the day they showed the top J&K+8 shows that showed them previewing next week's show telling the kids they are moving? Has anyone talked about this yet?

I haven't been reading since my computer's down.

Anya said...

CincyMom - sorry about your computer! Hope it's back up for good.

I didn't personally see the commercial, but several did. I think it's been mentioned on this site, GWoP and Baby Mama's site.

I think some have suggested the title of the episode "Soup and a Surprise" references the move - the "surprise" is J&K tell the kids they are moving.

peanutbutterjellytime said...

My sister emailed me an article in the Wasington Post. It was titled, The List: What's In and Out for 2009. On the list of "out and spent" are Jon and Kate Plus Eight. Could TLC be getting ready to end the show?

Nina Bell said...

Peanutbutterjellytime


I saw the article. So are you saying that you feel that the Washington Post has some type of inside information? I was just wondering what all of the fan's on the show had to say.

Lizabeth said...

PB&Jtime, I saw that article also. That said, I do not trust an author who says that Jim and Pam from The Office are 'out'... not to mention the thought that using CAPS LOCK would ever be allowed in proper conversation :).

Just my opinion, but I would take that 2009 list as one journalists take on culture, not any kind of actual insider info.

Nina Bell said...

Here is the link to that article if anyone wants to read it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/artsandliving/features/2008/year-in-review/the_list_2009.html

peanutbutterjellytime said...

I'm not sure what to think. I was kind of sad to see some of the things that are "out" or "spent."
Could he have some insider information? I don't know. Perhaps it's just another journalists opinion. I guess time will tell.

It would have been nicer to see Jon and Kate "in or saved."

Nina Bell said...

Thank God they put crock pots on the Saved list. What would we all do without our crock pots?

merryway said...

Oh, I dislike the writers that are obviously denouncing what everyone likes to try to be ahead of their time. Jim and Pam rule.

At a New Years party, a good friend of our group was out of state for the birth of her grand-daughter. From that, it somehow led to the Duggars. These were friends of a friend. I asked them if they watched J&K. No one did, but two had said they had seen it and didn't watch it because of Kate. One of them watched the Duggars and thought the mom would have another child. I still haven't come across anyone who regularly watches J&K.

merryway said...

Oh, I see it's not one of those types of articles. I like Dwight & Angela too :)

Theresa said...

I think the In and Out columns of any paper is just end of year "fluff" pieces. Washington Post or not.

themrs said...

i think the WP article is just more of a pop culture kind of thing. like "that was so last year". what people are tired of and what's the new thing. some of them were pretty funny. i noticed that the GWOPers haven't infiltrated the list yet, LOL. by tomorrow there will be 300 comments by the same person with different names spouting exploitation and that kate is a b.

Nina Bell said...

I guess to be on the out list means that at one point you were on the in list. There are quite a few people that won't admit that the show was ever on the in list.

Anya said...

Sorry, I think In/Out lists are lame big time. I hardly ever get a chuckle out of them.

I didn't know until I got to the end of this one whether J&K would be "in" or "out" and I didn't much care. Nina's comment is right on. It's the same with Jim & Pam, they are "out" now because they were "in" last year - right? Whatever! I love all my "Office" couples. Kelly and anyone is great too!

If young people are any indication of trends, my 17-year-old loves J&K. I don't think I could pay her to watch The Duggar's (I don't mean this in any way offensively because I actually have no problem with either family).

By the way,

GO PENN STATE!!!!

nc resident said...

I saw on another site two things about the book not previously mentioned here I don't think. The first question I have is does Kate mention being rude to Jons mother? The second was about the donations that went to a consignment shop. Whos idea was that Kates or one of the Nanas?

Thanks to anyone that read the book and can answer those.

FIONA said...

That article was lameO!

It sure doesn't appear that Jon and Kate are OUT.

I think the Walk in the Woods show may be part of the outtakes we keep seeing on TLC.

Has anyone seen Alexis sneaking around the picnic table? All of those clips, Jon and Kate walking hand in hand could be part of the Woods show...it could be part of their new McMansion property.

I wonder if they are actually going to show the new house on the first episode of the new season. Seems like they would drag it out like they did the wedding....

Saint said...

Merryway,
Some in my family watch it. my mom actually thinks a little "gwoppy" about Kate, though I am certain she would never turn on the computer, never mind read a blog like GWOP. So I said, "Are you sure you're not just jealous?" She said, "Of course I am jealous! Why didn't I think of making a show out of my big family?" For the record, she doesn't like Dr. Laura either because she makes money giving out the same advice my mom gives out for free! Lol.

Saint said...

It looks like in/out lists are "out" around here!

peanutbutterjellytime said...

Nina Bell,

I agree with you 100% about crock pots. I hope that they stay on the saved and in list FOREVER. My crock pot is my best friend. :)

Linda said...

Saint -

You are so funny and actually so is your mom! I came from a big family too.

Years ago when Dr. Laura was more popular my mom said the same thing about her ... that Dr. Laura wasn't doling out much more than common sense except she was getting paid for it.

Saint said...

I hope they show the property. The house at the other website looks beautiful...but I am all about the surrounding property.

If you own over a certain number of acres in PA, you pay real estate taxes at a much lower rate per acre than those of us who don't have big properties. My son's friend own 12 or 16 acres (or something like that,) and he said they have the "farm rate" even though they have no farm...just woods and a creek. I am a good 11 or 15 acres short of that requirement. :(

(I haven't looked that up, I am just describing a conversation I had with this 15 year old kid. I think he's right though.) Anyway, I thought some people may start the "how will they keep the house up" stuff. The taxes should be manageable. Jon may have to buy a tractor, though (lucky Collin!)

scarfoot said...

NC Resident,

I will try to answer your questions about the book. I do recall Kate addressing the relationship between her mother and law and the house remodel. I don't have the book here in front of me, but I believe it said very, very little about it. I think she said that she was upset about the design of the rooms, and that this created tension with her mother in law. I donated the book to the library, so I no longer have it. I inferred that possibly Jon's mother in law had something to do with the remodel. I don't recall that it expounded on that any more. It did not say that they never spoke again as a result, or what the issue was.

I can answer your question about the consignment shop. According to the book, they received quite a bit of clothing. Some of it was not in good condition, some of it was incorrect sizes, and they had so much extra that they didn't need all of it. According to the book, Nana Joan encouraged her to take the clothes to the consignment shop. Her reasoning was that the clothing was donated with the intention of helping the Gosselins. Because the clothing wasn't fitting their needs, by taking it to consignment, those people were still supporting the Gosselins and making the clothing available to others. That isn't explained very well, but it did make sense to me when I read it in the book.

michelle said...

I've been watching on and off today the Discovery Health channel. It's a marathon about multiples. Jon and Kate were truly blessed having six healthy tups. I know they also feel this way. I do believe that Jon and Kate know they are very blessed. I do hope Jon and Kate will bring in their extended family back into their lives, if their parents, sisters, & brothers really are not a part of Jon and Kate's lives now. I just feel you should never give up on your family, especially your parents.

It will sometimes seem almost funny to me that I am writing about a family that I do not even know and is really none of my business what Jon and Kate do. Does anyone else get that "funny" feeling when talking about a family that we really do not know, except what the camera shows us in their episodes? How in the world did are t.v. programs become all these "reality" shows?
I still enjoy watching all the re-runs of Will and Grace, Frazier, King of Queens, and even Golden Girls.

michelle said...

I just read the IN and OUTS article. I take that with a grain of salt. Just the author's opinions. I don't see Jon and Kate plus 8 going off the air any time soon. There are too many fans who enjoy watching the show. I think this show is #1 on TLC, right?

Well, I need to stop blogging now and cook some dinner ( :

Kikibee said...

About the book, which I have right here because "somebody" got it for my daughter for Christmas...

I've just been skimming, but I don't think Jon's mom was involved in the house makeover, she was with them when they saw it. Kate talks about the logistics of getting all the babies home (first time home from the condo) and mentions that her mil had the foresight to contact the producers of the show that did the renovations and they sent a limo.

Then she says that after the camera crew left "tension was high between Jon, his mother, and me."
Something I found interesting is that she next details her rules and routine for visitors and helpers and says "I was called names and criticized to no end for being an over-the-top, neurotic drill sergeant". Now, this is entirely conjecture on my part, but I wonder if some of this criticism came from Jon's/Kate's mothers? Maybe they were put off at having to take their shoes off and put gowns on like the rest of the visitors. I can imagine everyone's nerves being frayed and things being said by all sides that haven't been forgiven. Not that it would be a good reason for the families to be on the outs, but it makes more sense to me than the "they wouldn't give us money" reason that some people believe.

Another thing I hadn't seen mentioned is that the hospitalization for hyper-stimulated ovaries occurred when she was already pregnant. So, there goes the notion that she went ahead and "did it" against her doctor's recommendation.

scarfoot said...

Kikibee,

Thanks for looking! I do remember Kate talking about her hospitalization due to hyperstimulated ovaries. Kate also explained that she was inseminated in the doctor's office, so she did not intentionally "take care of business" against doctor's orders.

Linda said...

Kikibee-

Can you explain briefly what were her rules for visitors?

merryway said...

That rumor is beyond belief. To try to become pregnant with vast multiples one would need to be ignorant, crazy or suicidal Interesting how the fact that she was already pregnant isn't mentioned in that conspiracy theory that is sometimes touted. I also hadn't realized she was inseminated. In all their microscopic searching how are these things overlooked?

Kikibee, Scarfoot, thanks for the details on the book.

I cannot imagine the worry and stress of bringing six preemies home. It's not the time you want people streaming in and out of your house. I would want to be on top of every second and every move around every child. The worry alone would exhaust you. It would be so hard to turn your babies over to others to be fed and cared for. But, of course, you have to have that help. I can't imagine how protective I would be.

Saint, your mom sounds like a funny lady. Dr. Laura gives me the shivers I can't hear her name without thinking of one my fav episodes of Frasier where Christine Barinska is parodying her.

merryway said...

Julie speaks again. She is ever so dark in her comments. Her continued interest in those children is kind of creepy. Maybe she doesn't want her sis to make up with Kate. My opinion is based on real life interactions and knowledge, not perceptions from a TV show. Hey, weren't the Gosselins supposed to move to SC? Actually, I've never seen Julie on any episode of J&K, so she must not exist.

seeing the light said...

where did julie turn up again?

Kikibee said...

Glad to be of help, just had to steal the book back from my daughter.

Rules for visitors- take off shoes, scrub hands with soap from the NICU, go to closet and pick a clean hospital scrub top to wear over clothes. Also,long hair tied back and no heavy perfume.

I was just reading about how she and Jon went to stay with her parents after she was discharged, along with the twins who had already been staying there. Apparently, the twins had trouble adjusting to her being back with them and that is when they moved to the Ronald McDonald house. She doesn't say anything negative about her parents, but it sounds like there might have been some friction there, which is understandable.

I've been reading at the "other place" where they have been talking about the book. Boy, they don't cut her any slack at all for anything she went through. She "asked for it" (six babies on purpose, of course) so she's not allowed to complain, or I guess even comment, about her difficulties.

Linda said...

There was so much rumor that was touted as established fact that has turned out to be lie after lie ...

Here is my list so far ...

*LIE -Gosselins are moving to North Carolina so they can isolate the children further and because North Carolina has virtually no laws regarding children participating in the entertainment industry.

WRONG - Gosselins are moving within Pennsylvania

*LIE - Carla has been pushed out of the childrens' lives.

WRONG - Carla was helping at their tag sale.

*LIE - Nana Bev (along with every other caring adult) is out of the childrens' lives

WRONG - Nana Bev had moved and was briefly reunited with the Gs in Memphis.

*LIE - K knew she had hyper-stimulated ovaries and chose to proceed anyways "banking" on the chance of multiples and the fame it would bring her.

WRONG - K was already pregnant when she was hospitalized for the hyper-stimulated ovaries.

=========

I wonder what else will be revealed as lies?

Estrangement from Beth? (My bet is that Beth's return to college to finish her bachelor's degree is the reason behind Beth's absence.)

Car accident?

happymama said...

Kikibee,

The rules for visitors at home are the same rules that the NICU uses. The only difference, is that instead of taking off your shoes at the NICU, you have to put on shoe covers. I believe this is where Kate got her rules from.


Linda,

You mentioned car accident. What is that about?

Saint said...

where did julie turn up again?

"The Truth" is back at an open discussion at (where else?) GWOP. Check the newer comments on the open thread for this week.

Her presence inspires two commenters to adopt the screen names of "Aunt Jodi admirer" and "They Need Aunt Jodi."

"Truth Breeds Hatred" says (in part) in the open discussion thread of GWoP for 1/1/09: There is nothing said about the children on this blog that even compares to what they are faced with in their every day "reality".

She is referring to things said about the Gosselin children at GWoP. Negatively. Is she admitting that she knows they exploit the children for their own amusement at GWoP? Is this for real? She admits this?

Ugh!

merryway said...

Julie's comment is on the GWOP Free Discussion last page. I'd bring it over, but parts of it are bolded and I don't know if that copies over.

Linda said...

When my youngest son was born, there was a particularly deadly strain of the flu that was going around at the hospital where he was born.

I remember that our pediatrician asked us to require everyone who was going to hold the baby to wash their hands before hand. (BTW, I always wash my hands before I hold a baby.)

You would have thought that I was the anti-christ when I asked people to do this. OMG. They were ridiculous.

So I asked the nurses to put up a sign and then I took the sign to my home too.

uggh.

So I have great empathy for Kate in being hurt at the name-calling when she was trying to protect her kids.

--------

happymama -

There was a rumor touted as fact that Kate (without the kids) was involved in a relatively minor car accident but that police were called to the scene as is routine. The rumor went that Kate pleaded/demanded that the officer not include her name in the police report or let her go quickly because .... "I'm a celebrity."

Linda said...

okay -- coincidentally GWOP is also discussing the car accident on the same free discussion thread.

Except now. It is a hit and run!

These rumors just snowball.

michelle said...

I completely understand why Kate would have such demands with her tups as babies.

I remember in their very first hour episode, Kate and Jon had mentioned that she was orignally pregnant with seven babies until she started bleeding and then she was pregnant with six. Was this mentioned in her book? Does anyone else remember them talking about the seven in their first show. Those two hour specials were my favorite episodes.

I may want to buy this book. I do love reading. Has anyone read the book, "The purpose of Christmas"? I gave this as a gift. I highly recommend the book. It's really good.

Could someone explain what Julie had said?

nc resident said...

WRONG - K was already pregnant when she was hospitalized for the hyper-stimulated ovaries.
Linda I do not have a clue what happened but I think in fairness Kate said what follows on the show. That she was hospitalized with hyper-stimulated ovaries and four weeks later she was pregnant. Not pregnant at the time she was in the hospital. Now maybe she quoted things out of order (now Saint I aint getting soft on Kate hehe) but I think this misconception comes from what the viewers saw on the show. Overstimulation= hospital stay, then she is pregnant which some think means the doctor should have skipped that cycle. Would a doctor inseminate an individual with hyper-stimulated ovaries? In fairness its easy to see how this might get misconstrued. Another thing that people maybe incorrectly pick up on is a comment she made to Jon about not being mad at her. Personally I have some concerns with the fact that a show is aired and if rerun its edited. There has been alot of that.

nc resident said...

Does anyone else remember them talking about the seven in their first show. Michelle if I remember correctly she had seven follicles one didn't develop and the bleeding caused them alot of concern.

nc resident said...

*LIE - K knew she had hyper-stimulated ovaries and chose to proceed anyways "banking" on the chance of multiples and the fame it would bring her. Not that it may matter but Kates' mom was quoted in the paper as saying that she got her twins and more when the tups were born. While it does not mean she expected six it does mean the comment they wanted just one more doesn't ring true.

scarfoot said...

nc resident said...
NC Resident

*LIE - K knew she had hyper-stimulated ovaries and chose to proceed anyways "banking" on the chance of multiples and the fame it would bring her.

Not that it may matter but Kates' mom was quoted in the paper as saying that she got her twins and more when the tups were born. While it does not mean she expected six it does mean the comment they wanted just one more doesn't ring true.


I've never really understood why this is an issue, and maybe someone can help me. First of all, it was her mother, not Kate saying this. It's hard to construe tone and meaning from written text, as we know well from blogging. Who is to say that Kate was lying, or her mother was attempting to make a joke, or Kate had said something offhand to her mom such as "Wouldn't it be cool to have another set of twins?" That doesn't mean Kate went to the doctor secretly gunning for multiples, but pretending for everyone else that she wanted a singleton.

I've also never understood the issue with Kate wanting multiples anyway. For some reason, people seem to take issue with if she did or did not want multiples. Perhaps I'm being very naieve, but I can think of many, many women who have hoped for twins when they are pregnant. Is that so bad? I'm absolutely certain, whether you dislike Kate or not, that she would ever purposely decide, and hope that magically somehow it would take, to get pregnant with SIX babies (which is extremely rare). And, let's say she did want multiples - what basis do we have to guess that she did it for fame?

I always chuckled when I read all these conspiracy theories about Kate's secret plans to get pregnant with higher order multiples. I can just see it now. As if Kate evilly rubs her palms together before her appointment, and thinks "Hmm, I'm going to get pregnant with six at once. How can I best make sure that happens? If I can get pregnant with that many, I will be a medical marvel, will be famous the world over, and make tons of money off of my six matching dolls!" So she, using her amazing manipulative skills, talks the doctor into getting her overly medicated so it will happen. Then, the doctor warns Kate that she has hyper stimulated ovaries and that she should not have sex. Knowing that having sex at that very moment will make sure she has sextuplets, therefore assuring her financial stability, Kate goes home and forces Jon to help her accomplish her goal, despite the significant swelling in her abdomen and pain.

scarfoot said...

NC Resident,

Can you tell me which episodes have been edited before being rerun? I've seen this posted from other people (on other blogs) and am curious to see it myself. Thanks!

michelle said...

I just read the comment by "Truth..." at the other site. It could be someone pretending to be Julie.

If it is really her though, she seems to have concern for the twins and tups.

nc resident said...

Is this for real? She admits this?

Saint, I read that as no matter how bad people think or write about the kids treatment things are worse in the home. Not that GWOP is mistreating them.

Anya said...

nc resident said...Kates' mom was quoted in the paper as saying that she got her twins and more when the tups were born.

Nice to see you posting again, NC Resident. Hope you had a nice holiday.

I have seen this quote quite a few times and I always had the impression it was made when Kate was a young girl. (Perhaps a teenager?). I think her mom also said that Kate had indicated she wanted babies that looked like China Dolls (hope I not offending anyone using that phrase - I am just quoting Kate).

Anyway, I don't put a lot of weight into either statement. I was a young girl once and I think the "idea" of twins seemed somehow fun and exotic (2x the cute!). I still look at baby twins and think how adorable! The difference is NOW I know the difference in the work involved. I don't think Kate would have had a clue at the age she made this remark.....

honeyhush said...

We had guests today. One of the couples, unbeknownst to me are regular viewers. It was refreshing to have a brief conversation w/ people who have never read an article or a blog. We didn't agree on everything, but we did agree on most points. The wife thinks Kate mistreats Jon and is envious (her word )of the vacations. She freely admitted some jealousy.
There was a car accident mentioned. What's that about?
And YAY! the Washington Post says I can keep my crock pot! LOL.

merryway said...

Kikibee, I was confused about something. I assumed overstimulated ovaries meant they were going wild producing too many eggs. If Kate was already pregnant when she was suffering this, wouldn't that mean that ovaries were still producing eggs after she was pregnant? Is that possible even on fertility drugs? I think this might be wrong.

Michelle, if you click on the “the truth will set you free” it takes you Julie's website. It's not my opinion that her first interest is the Gosselin children.

nc resident said...

I've seen this posted from other people (on other blogs) and am curious to see it myself. Thanks!
Scarfoot, many claim the Mady day out was edited when it was shown on the marathon top 10 shows 2 days ago. I know of 2 for sure. The NC beach trip where Joel was followed around. When reran his rear was blurred out. Also in a show intro when Kate is yelling at Jon at the corn maze that was deleted as well. The hellooooo part hehe. I will try to research some more. Thanks for the book information, saw some GWOP comments that made no sense as usual, so I wanted to ask.

On the behind the scenes show on the marathon aired two days ago Kate said that the show was a real look into their lives. She stated that if they did not do it or would not do it they wouldn't just do it for the show. Basically they would not be in a situation of doing things just to film. I say this because when this show first came out it was a documentary on the Discovery Health channel. This consisted of two episodes.
Then came the show J&K + 8. TLC had so much flack from viewers they put out a disclaimer that this is a reality show and no longer a documentary. My question is if TLC says its a reality show why do J&K insist "the show is their life". Actually its a reality show which may include scripted scenes or pre-discussed and planned situations of they add to their life. But then Kate has said many times the show is edited and that makes her look bad. Why does Kate agree to look bad. I would not allow that, who here would? Either Kate is usually that mean to Jon, and we see the worst. Or she usually is nice and they show only the bad moments, which means she doesn't care what we see as long as we watch. That's another issue I have with the show.

Nina Bell said...

Honeyhush,

I know. I am so relieved. About the crock pot. That car accident was a rumor that was started last summer but there was no police report filed that anyone can find. Who knows.

scarfoot said...

Merryway,

I believe it said in the book that her ovaries were grossly swollen within her abdomen. She was already pregnant, although very early, because she was scared that the intense pain was from a miscarriage. However, I know you directed your question to Kikibee, and she has the book in front of her, so I leave it up to her!

NC Resident,

Thanks for the info about the episodes! I had read recently on the other site that the 'Hello' was taken out, however, I did actually see it on an episode very recently. I definitely noticed it, because I had just read that it was gone. So I'm not so sure what is going on. That seems like a trivial thing to edit, compared to a body part. I am very curious about the editing as well. So if you find anything else out, let us know!

nc resident said...

And, let's say she did want multiples - what basis do we have to guess that she did it for fame?

Maybe the fact she sent out tapes to television stations for publicity, or a show possibly. They used almost every media outlet available, to reach the public. I don't think that she said hey lets have six, think of the fame, give me another pill or two, doc. The fact remains they did acheive alot of fame quickly some by curiosity of outsiders because of sextuplets some by them making the contact.
As for her moms statement to me much of J&K's lives and story don't add up. Busy as a bee with 8 kids but "carved out time to write a book". Spent many weekends with Beth away from her kids to write a book many stated here even, can be read in 3 hrs. Website said looking for a Christian publisher to publish book because fans asked for her story. Then she said its for her kids, to show them how much they were loved. While many don't see this as any reason to question to me it's another inconsistancy of many we see. However if I'm shown something I will consider another opinion. On the issue about the twins again. I think personally Kate was afraid of the backlash regarding multiples. If the public that helped her and Jon found out they wanted more than one and had no means to support them as they didn't they would be upset. By saying she only wanted one this kinda gives em a pass if you know what I mean. JMO

scarfoot said...

Yeah, I'm sorry, any article that says that Jim and Pam are on their way out is not an article I plan to believe anytime soon!

I'm a recent convert to "The Office" and Jim and Pam was a major reason I watched the show! I have to frequently remind myself that Jim is not real and I cannot be in love with him!

nc resident said...

Nice to see you posting again, NC Resident. Hope you had a nice holiday.

I did and hope you and every else did. My son Navy man back from Iraq came to visit.

scarfoot said...

NC Resident,

Thanks for your response. Do you know which media, and how, Kate contacted to be on television and/or start a show?

Nina Bell said...

Scarfoot,

There are a lot of us here that love The Office so Anya suggested that maybe we open up a thread to discuss the show when it starts back up. And yes, I love Jim too, even though I am old enough to be his mother.

scarfoot said...

NinaBell,

I'd be all over a post about "The Office!" In fact, I'm a LOST addict as well, so maybe we should post about that (looking at your poll numbers). Clearly, my plan post-Masters degree is to watch as MUCH television as possible. HA!

nc resident said...

Thanks for your response. Do you know which media, and how, Kate contacted to be on television and/or start a show?
When the tups were born there was a huge press conference. Newspapers, TV and radio, were there.
On the how we got here episode Jon says they were contacted via their website by Discovery Health. Kate said earlier on that she had sent out tapes of the children to tv outlets, she never said which ones. So its a fair assumption Discovery or someone with them got a copy and contacted them. Posted a link below good pictures of the kids.



http://www.becomehealthynow.com/article2/womenpreg/1188/1/

merryway said...

Scarfoot, thanks for the info about Kate's condition. It sounds really painful. I was wondering how that might have worked.

My crockpot can't go anywhere based on a list. I've had it over 25 years and made thousands batches of chicken n dumplins. It's ugly, I destroyed the front when I was in my 20s trying to clean it with oven cleaner. I can't bring myself to get a new one until this one breaks.

Nina Bell said...

Merryway,

Do you have a good recipe for crock pot chicken and dumplings that I could have?

merryway said...

Nina, I sent it to you via email. They're just the Bisquick kind, but they are tasty and are great as left overs.

Guinevere said...

Also in a show intro when Kate is yelling at Jon at the corn maze that was deleted as well. The hellooooo part hehe.

You know, show intros change. I don't see that as evidence of anything particularly sinister.

My question is if TLC says its a reality show why do J&K insist "the show is their life". Actually its a reality show which may include scripted scenes or pre-discussed and planned situations of they add to their life.

When has it ever been said that there are scripted scenes? I think what's been said (and I saw bits of the marathon too, and heard again Kate's response to Jen regarding the way the show is put together) is that there may be discussion between the producers and J&K about what they want to capture in filming a particular day/week/whatever. I do think with some of the trips lately, the show has been the impetus for the trip, but that's a far cry from "scripted scenes", IMO.

But then Kate has said many times the show is edited and that makes her look bad. Why does Kate agree to look bad. I would not allow that, who here would? Either Kate is usually that mean to Jon, and we see the worst. Or she usually is nice and they show only the bad moments, which means she doesn't care what we see as long as we watch.

I don't think Kate has control over the editing. I don't believe she's stated that the editing makes her look bad - that would suggest that she has issues with the producers, which as far as I know, she doesn't. What I've heard her say is that if we're seeing an edited show, 22 minutes or whatever, and there may be several scenes of J&K bickering, we may get an idea that this is how they are all the time. But J&K are pretty much together 24/7, I think (unless she's away), and so if they bicker a few minutes, or even a bit more, in the 168 hours that make up a week, and the show happens to portray that bickering, it may give some viewers (especially those inclined to believe such things anyway) a skewed view of how much strife there is between them.

Saint said...

I have to frequently remind myself that Jim is not real and I cannot be in love with him!

Oh that made me laugh out loud...for real!

I LOVE The Office.

Saint said...

Hi NC Res,
I think Julie has admitted that she knows the kids are mocked on GWoP before (and that it's OK because it's for fun)...maybe that's why I read that as a reference to mocking Gosselin kids on GWoP.

Does anybody else remember that? I am afraid it was in the comments at "PennMommy's" blog and the comments aren't cached (lucky for Julie.)

Lizabeth said...

Oh man I can totally dig the love for Jim Halpert. In fact I have an I <3 Jim Halpert sticker on my guitar case, and actually consider him (with Chuck Bartowski) to be what I look for in a guy. Yeah, they make mistakes, but they are sweet, lovable, and have great hair :).

As far as all the show editing information as well as what happened with the remodel I do remember some other info from the book. Jon and Kate accepted the remodel and asked to redo the garage into a master bedroom (the main thing they felt would be good for their new huge family) as well as to do the living area. They never agreed to have this crew do the nursery or Mady and Cara's room. Honestly, I can't blame Kate for feeling uneasy and then just completely thrown by what happened. She did not want them to do the nursery and they did-- the one place where she wanted to have time to nest and plan and organize, and they painted Humpty Dumpty on the wall... yeah that would get me freaking out, too, and I am a more calm person in general than Kate.

With editing I have no idea what Figure 8 allows Jon and Kate to see or do. I think they get frustrated with how things are portrayed since we have heard Kate mention "If we have 2 fights in 2 days of filming, they will make it seem like it all happened within 5 minutes." Just like anything else shown, I try to take it all with a grain of salt. We are seeing real things that happened, but they are not necessarily chronological or timed accurately.

Nina Bell said...

Sure Saint,

I remember that. In fact I am sure someone probably has that copied. It's all good you know for a blog to make fun of and degrade the kids. Because you know it is the parent's fault for having the show. It all comes back to that.

Saint said...

NC Res,
You wrote, " Personally I have some concerns with the fact that a show is aired and if rerun its edited. There has been alot of that.

I disagree that it is a problem, if they re-edit things that shouldn't have been shown in the first place, or things that, upon viewing, the people involved don't want shown.

The 2 things you metioned seem like good things to edit out.

Linda said...

If the public that helped her and Jon found out they wanted more than one and had no means to support them as they didn't they would be upset.

I look at this another way.

I have a neighbor who adopted twins from another country. She has said that had they adopted more she would try to get another set of twins. Her feeling was that the bond between the twins would be such that a singleton might feel left out.

I can see a mother of twins hoping that her next pregnancy might also be twins because she could see the bond that exists between them.

It is my understanding that Jon lost his job during the tups pregnancy and I'm not sure that they could have predicted the job loss.

SamanthaNC said...

Saint-
I remember that, not exactly what she said, but basicaly that it was all in good fun, and nothing compared to what they may face in the future. Ugh.

I have never seen the office but you guys have me very interested in Jim lol! I LOVE Lost- my husband thinks its the most ridiculous show in the history of television...... =)

Saint said...

Some women really want twins.
I have a sister-in-law who wanted twins. She's a twin herself and she sees being a twin as a huge blessing. Little girls often imagine having multiples. My daughter had (and loved) the Bitty Twin dolls from American girl. They are very popular dolls. When I was little, I and two of my sisters each got a doll that looked the same. We gave them rhyming names and called them triplets (even though they each had a different mother!) Kate's mom was fondly remembering her own little girl playing "twins" when she made that comment.

And the reception the Gosselins got because of their septuplets was completely positive. There would have been no reason for Kate to fear a backlash...and no time to dwell on it either.

To me, the imaginings of some who don't like Kate, like this notion that she manipulated her way into multiples, is evidence of jealousy or resentment of her success.

There is plenty to criticize Kate for, if that's your inclination, without this kind of streeeeetching of the facts.

themrs said...

"I have to frequently remind myself that Jim is not real and I cannot be in love with him!"

LOL i don't watch the office but i have to do the same with "dr. mcdreamy". i actually tell myself, he is not a real person. then i find myself discussing the characters with my BFF as if they are real people and we know them. kind of a sad commentary of my life, huh?

Saint said...

Samantha,
You said, "I remember that, not exactly what she said, but basicaly that it was all in good fun, and nothing compared to what they may face in the future. Ugh."

That's why I read it that way...as an admission that they mock the kids, but because Julie envisions so much worse for them, she's OK with it, you know, and it's funny.

It made me squeamish when I read it the first time. I just can't believe she'd do it again! Doesn't she see how that encourages the parodies?

It's so disappointing to me, you know, because I have a soft-spot for older sisters who defend their younger sisters (even as adults.)

I can't defend a grown woman who actually knew these kids at one time encouraging others to exploit their situation ("they're on TV!") to mock them. It's awful.

As Julie said in her comment at GWoP on 1/1/09:
There is no "middle ground" when it comes to child exploitation. It is wrong. Period!

Ah! The irony! She sets the rule and breaks the rule in one comment!

nc resident said...

think Julie has admitted that she knows the kids are mocked on GWoP before (and that it's OK because it's for fun)...maybe that's why I read that as a reference to mocking Gosselin kids on GWoP.

If thats her position she is very wrong. Adults should protect children.

merryway said...

SamanthaNC, All the episodes of the U.S. version The Office are on surf the net. I quit watching in the first season because Steve Carell's character was so annoying and too ignorantly mean (Yankee Christmas Swap). It was Jim and Pam that kept drawing me back. It seemed to me that they toned down the meanness of Carell's character after the first season and made him more palatable to watch. Carell plays Michael very well and now I think he's outrageously funny. The longer you know the characters the funnier it gets. I also love 30Rock and think it's genius to watch. Tina Fey and most of the cast are amazing. She makes every minute in the show count for some sort of joke.

Saint said...

Merryway,
You are describing our "Must Watch TV" night.

themrs said...

ok, i have to get mushy for a moment ( i have PMS so that's my excuse and im sticking to it:) i just have to say that i love this site and you guys crack me up every day. i used to be a regular reader/ poster at the other site, i even wrote a post for publication. i found the site after having many concerns and uncomfortable feelings about the show. after awhile, the comments began to make me feel so uneasy. although i have serious concerns about the gosselins, i felt people went way too far. then it got to a point where any comment i made that "went against the flow" was rejected. when the PM fiasco happened, which sadly i was dragged into unknowingly, i found this site. i appreciate that many different view points are represented here and everyone can play nice :) i always know that when i open my email i'll get a laugh. when i first came here, i was afraid to sign in with my google id because i was afraid that people who didn't like my opinions would come to my personal blog (which is all about my family) and harass me. after some time here, i realized that this would not happen. funny how on so many sites there is a need to keep anonymity to protect yourself from crazies. ok im done with my rant, Happy New Years!

Rufus said...

Guinevere said...
When has it ever been said that there are scripted scenes? I think what's been said (and I saw bits of the marathon too, and heard again Kate's response to Jen regarding the way the show is put together) is that there may be discussion between the producers and J&K about what they want to capture in filming a particular day/week/whatever. I do think with some of the trips lately, the show has been the impetus for the trip, but that's a far cry from "scripted scenes", IMO.


Handing the family toys and asking them to talk about them and include them in their "everyday lives" is scripted enough for me. If that's going on, who's to say there isn't more scripting that we're just not as aware of?


Also, I'm all for some crock pot recipes. All I know how to make in mine is a roast with veggies.

Kikibee said...

About Kate's ovaries, for those who asked.
She had the IUI, about 2 weeks later had a positive preg. test. Started having pain and bloating, went to youngest sister's wedding, left early, belly swelled, went to hospital.

Ovaries had blown up and were rubbing against her other organs. EEEK! Two and a half liters of fluid drained from abdomen.

I think she wanted at least one more, but was fine with the possibility of having 2 (maybe 3) again. Can you imagine what they would say if she actually said she wanted twins again?

Julie's comments are rather vague. Is it the fact that the kids are being filmed that is worse than calling them future psychos, junkies, and unwed teen moms,or is something
more sinister going on at home? And how do you decide which is worse? I guess it is whichever one you (and your sister) are not involved with.

Saint said...

Happy new Year, TheMrs.,

I know just how you feel!

This blog could do a whole post on the lies told about and around the Gosselin blogosphere.

I was a PennMommy reader! I just "accepted" that Guin and Anya and Linda were calling the hospital and harrassing PennMommy's family! I believed Jon Gosselin mocked somebody's kid because her mother was late picking her up from school because she was getting chemo (was that BK or Etwon Mom?)! I actually thought Kate Gosselin screamed in a raging fit at a neighbor who invited the twins for ice cream (BK, again?)!

Yeah, I was really, really suckered in. It's hard to believe people would just make up that stuff...but it's so preposterous in retrospect that I can't believe I accepted it! I was reading for amusement, not crtically at all.

I hope I have apologized for my blind acceptance of the crazy out there. I really believe some real good has come from this blog.

Done with my PMS-rant.

CincyMom said...

Happy New Year's all,
STILL don't have a fixed computer. I'm using hubby's since he's off work. But I spent another 3 hours at the laptop store yesterday (when they told me it would only take 5 minutes). Had to leave at 6 when they closed and still waiting this morning for my computer. My newsletter is due Monday, which means I will have to work around the clock this weekend, if I get my laptop back today. That's my rant, too!

So....reading through the comments. I, too, love me a crockpot. The only problem is if you are at home while it's doing the job, you have to smell the food all day! :)

Jim--oh, too cute. I really liked when he and Pam worked together to convince Dwight that computers were alive and working against him to make more sales.

Edits: I think they are fine to do when things can be negative (like Aaden with the pull-up). It was a cute moment for a family to see, but not the general public. I think the whole thing with edits just goes to show what a hard time the production staff must have with their massive piles of footage. Any one thing can make you happy and say "aaawww" or annoyed.

I do find it interesting that Jen is also listed as a "writer." Is that just for the questions she asks? If it's not scripted, why need a writer? I'm sure it's not a conspiracy, but one more thing that makes people wonder if they are being "had." Some people let it roll right off their shoulders, and others get fanatical (think: the "other" sites).

Anyway, I should probably try to see what work I can do on his computer even if I don't have my newsletter template. Wish me luck!

Florida Mom said...

Saint,
I second everything you said.

I find it humorous that people who defend Jon and Kate are called sheeple. I never felt more like a "sheeple", than when I realized the Penn Mommy stuff was made up.

nc resident said...

Anyway, I should probably try to see what work I can do on his computer even if I don't have my newsletter template. Wish me luck!

CinciMom my visit was great the weather held out I left this past Monday. Visited my mom in Sharonville and aunt in Batavia. Good luck with the computer. I had 2 hard drives crash on a Dell and lost Homeowners Association letters and my Microsoft Money. Backups, yeah I should have.

merryway said...

About Kate's ovaries, for those who asked.
She had the IUI, about 2 weeks later had a positive preg. test. Started having pain and bloating, went to youngest sister's wedding, left early, belly swelled, went to hospital.

Ovaries had blown up and were rubbing against her other organs. EEEK! Two and a half liters of fluid drained from abdomen.


what I find sickening is that the comments that “Kate knew”, “Kate doesn't know what hell is”, there's gotta be a theory that Kate planned it this way to try to ruin her sister's wedding. The puzzle for me is always “why do people think in this fashion”.

Themrs, I would be more worried about the other blog harassing you. As a newcomer to the blogging world, I was shocked at the planned attack and the ongoing baseless gossip of mods or whoever on this blog calling the hospital where Jason supposedly died. I mean who thinks of things to do like that? Sorry for the pms, I spent yesterday childless, curled on the couch watching twilight zone and scarfing chocolate, finished it with a big steak (I never eat red meat except for those bad pms moments) and feel much better today..utopia!

Hello to honeyhush also.

Yeah, I was really, really suckered in. It's hard to believe people would just make up that stuff...but it's so preposterous in retrospect that I can't believe I accepted it! I was reading for amusement, not crtically at all.

I think it's kind of what you get hit with first in the blogging world. I had no problem believing that Kate did the things that Julie said. The writing was obviously slanted, but I could picture Kate doing all those things, especially with family where emotions run high. I had no prob believing the yogurt story, etc on PM's blog. It wouldn't be the first time my tv has lied to me. The thing is even mean people love their kids and should have a right to parent their children. Since the privacy of Kate's children is often the issue it's easy to take a leap and assume she might be a bad parent if she's showing disregard for this major issue. It's the insane hatred that goes with these observations that I find disturbing. Because the kids are so adorable and we get to watch them grow, it's hard not to feel emotionally involved since they are real. I think most of us here have strong mothering instincts (apologies to the men) which is prob one of the reasons we started searching. I think it's a dangerous thing for a mom to put herself on public display, anyone that's been through custody issues know how scrutinized the job is and what standards you are to be held up to. The public is very demanding of moms and quick to rip them apart.

As far as being scripted, I think some of the explaining moments of the episode where J&K are on the couch might be. They are so repetitive and it seems like I saw Jon looking down like he was getting the line before he read. They apparently are told to say it repeatedly so I can see that being on a card. The show is a catalyst for their situation and vacations, it certainly influences their lives with the “in-show” commercials, so I can see where the say scripted if they mean planned. It's not my opinion that the kids are given lines.

FIONA said...

FROM JULIE

The Truth Will Set You Free said...
Uneasy--I completely agree with your comments about Mady! The "drama" brings in ratings, and that's all that matters.

Tammy H--I'm sure Jon would love all of those things that you mentioned. "Why on earth didn't Jon be a man?" This is the key to the entire problem, IMO. He hasn't stepped up since the very beginning. If he were the man this family needs, Kate wouldn't have had to take such extreme measures to support their family. I really believe it all started out of desperation, but somewhere along the way, it became more about greed than actually making ends meet.
-----

She ends her post with a Happy New Year! Still don't understanf how her blogging about her sister's family in any way shape or form is helpful to anyone. One would think that she would be very much against the terrible things that are said about Jodi's neices and nephews.

What do the rest of you think about Julie's blogging?

Theresa said...

Saint said As Julie said in her comment at GWoP on 1/1/09:
There is no "middle ground" when it comes to child exploitation. It is wrong. Period!

Ah! The irony! She sets the rule and breaks the rule in one comment!

January 2, 2009 7:03 AM


___________________

If I were Jodi, I'd cut off all ties with Julie, whether she's my sister or not. She seems a few McNuggets shy of a Happy Meal. If she can say these things about kids, and kids she's related to in some way, I wouldn't want her around my kids at all.

Cincymom--Good luck with your computer. I hope they get it fixed asap for you.

Rufus said...

How is it that Free Discussion always comes back to PennMommy? I love it! Wheee!

And truth be told, there were only a small handful of people who didn't get suckered in by all the stories that were ultimately deemed to be lies. Even as I read them and occassionaly said, "Huh. Well that doesn't make sense," I continued reading and believing. Unfortunately, it's a lot more fun/interesting to hear crappy stories about people than to hear they're just normal.

CincyMom said...

NC resident--glad your trip was safe! I'm about 2 miles east of Sharonville and my laptop is about 2 miles west of Sharonville : )

Fiona--Julie blogging. I think her sister supposedly asked her to stop since it wasn't helping the situation. I actually think she's exploiting her relationship with her sister to seem important on a blog.

Regarding the upcoming show--I am actually excited to see it. I bet it drags out (like Hawaii) over a few episodes since it is such a big event but I hope we at least get a peek Monday.

nc resident said...

I actually think she's exploiting her relationship with her sister to seem important on a blog. I came in about that time and didn't get sucked in because I never could understand that whole thing. Her comments seem to be the same thing she said months ago am I correct. If she knows something for a fact why not call CPS or the police. If I see someone being stabbed I'm not gonna fire up my Mac and blog about it. And yes she does appear to be a sandwich or two short of a picnic. hehe another saying

Theresa said...

I agree Cincymom--Julie is exploiting her realtionship with her sister to seem important on a blog. Very pathetic.

NC--love it..If she knows something for a fact why not call CPS or the police. If I see someone being stabbed I'm not gonna fire up my Mac and blog about it.

:)

Exactly! Do something if there really is something wrong. (which, I believe there's nothing wrong. Those kids are well provided for and very much well-loved).

Linda said...

That is the irony (read that: hypocrisy) of the whole Julie blog and GWOP.

They are as exploitive of the children as they accuse J&K to be.

If GWOP did not publish abusive posts about the kids, the parents, the parents' body parts, etc. then I don't think that they'd get the kind of hits on their stat counter.

I've always thought that the rabid hatred against the Gs made them and the bloggers around them ripe for a hoax.

Those with inside information (like Julie) are given hero status. The nuggets of information they parcel out bit by bit are like trophies. Remember, Julie was "so brave" for coming forward. She was "so courageous" and "spoke truth to power."

It's no wonder that someone like PM wanted some of that. And she got it. She didn't spill her guts. She gave out bits of information which kept people coming back for more. And then she got the adoration too . . .

"You are so brave."
"Thank you for coming forward."
"Those kids are lucky to have someone like you who cares enough to risk everything."

And then remember, the supposed letter from the attorney. It just heightened the drama and the fact that PM was willing to "speak out" anyways made her seem more credible and "brave."

Puleeze.

BTW, I'm not convinced that this is the end of the hoaxes either . . .

Linda said...

Fiona,

Julie ending her GWOP post with "Happy New Year" really struck a nerve with me too.

It seemed kind of a cavalier ending to a comment that discussed such serious yet vague accusations.

FIONA said...

Linda-No kidiing....what is wrong with her?

I don't know if I believe that Jodi and Kevin are completely out of the G's life. Maybe they just get together on a limited basis...I certainly don't claim to know. However we do know that Jodi put a video out there saying Julie's blog was true...that in itself would have to cause distant and hurt feelings.

Is that enough to cut the Kreider bunch out for good?

I would not be at all surprised if Julie is wanting more recognition. Seems like 3F has taken her spot in the light.

michelle said...

Merryway,

I don't understand what in the world Julie's motivation would be. I would think that by blogging it would make any kind of reconcillation(sp) (in the future) between Jody & Kevin with Jon and Kate more difficult.

michelle said...

I thought I read somewhere (sorry, I can't remember where-so this could be wrong) that Jon just stop going to work when Kate was pregnant with the tups??

themrs said...

Rufus- if you send me a comment on my personal blog (adayinthelifeofthemrs.blogspot.com) with your email address, i won't publish it but i'll email several super easy delicious crock pot recipes. i use mine several times a week. i have some great recipes.

as far as PM goes, i'm ashamed that i fell for it as hard as i did. she and i were even emailing for awhile. i was fairly new to the blogging world then and bought it all hook line and sinker. the funny thing is that most of the stories she told about kate could easily be true, yet when she started saying they had called CPS my suspisions were raised. there are many things they G's choose to do that i disagree with, but as a social worker i know for a fact that none of those are abuse. then when her son supposedly got sick, i was appalled that anyone could accuse her of lying about such a serious thing. i sent her emails of support and encouragement. interestingly, around that time i stopped hearing back from her. at one point i thought she was going to have me moderate for her. so then i wander over to this site (first time i had been here) and read the explanation of why the mods here felt she was fake. it made so much sense to me i really started to question what was true. as i researched it more i became more unsure. to this day, i really have no idea if that person was possummomma or someone totally different. on a positive note, i learned something valuable from that situation. because of it, i removed all my family's names from my blog and the state where we live. i decided that the internet could be such a dishonest place, i didn't want anything identifying about my family there. pretty sad... considering i started my blog so out of town family and friends could keep track of how our family is doing. either way, i'm alot less trusting now. whoever said that they think the hoaxes will continue is probably right, i hope next time i'm a little more discerning!

Rufus said...

themrs-
THANKS! You're great. A comment has been sent. :)

Saint said...

TheMrs.,
I followed up on Penn mommy through that whole month afterward. The mods here got it right.

The whole thing was debated at other sites (not Gosselin ones) and other posters from other types of blogs started linking to more of her scams. She scammed people who like stamping and some hysterectomy site.

The thing is, I didn't recognize all the various screen names she used, but I did recognize the Gosselin ones: BK, Etown, PennMommy. A lot of the Gosselin stories that no one can "remember where I read that" can be traced back to those names.

So you emailed her back and forth? Did she seem a little "off" behind the scenes, too? Did she share with you the "inside scoop" that some posters still believe she knew about J&K and convinced Julie with? Do you know what that they're talking about?

Saint said...

TheMrs.,
Did you email her or did she email you first? I didn't recall seeing an email for PennMommy back then.

Did you email her about anything after GWoP took her post down, or did you just give up?

I could ask a million questions...the woman was really fascinating to me. Who does that???

MoreCowbell said...

I think it was when PM's "son" got sick that the red flags really went up for me. I questioned how someone who had a child THAT deathly ill, could spend so much time worrying and blogging about the Gosselin's. Of course, I was met with all sorts of "HOW COULD YOU?" type posts for expressing doubt. But, it just didn't make sense. And yeah, I was mean enough to be pleased that I had pegged her correctly, but even more pleased that she was outed before she scammed anyone else by playing off people's sympathies. Don't feel bad if you did initially buy her story. She's obviously had a lot of experience lying and screwing with people's heads on many other blogs.

Nina Bell said...

themrs,

I would appreciate any crock pot recipes you have also. ninabell53@gmail.com.

Merryway,

Thank you so much for the one you sent me. Sounds delicious and I will probably try that one this week.

Guinevere said...

I don't understand what in the world Julie's motivation would be. I would think that by blogging it would make any kind of reconcillation(sp) (in the future) between Jody & Kevin with Jon and Kate more difficult.

Perhaps you've answered your own question here. If Julie is jealous of Jodi's relationship with the Gosselins (just speculating), she may have an interest in keeping Jodi estranged from them.

I almost think Julie is a better manipulator than PM. She's more subtle, anyway. I have in the past been drawn in a bit by her online persona, the air she has of being dignified and righteous. It hasn't made me like her, or think she's right, but it's blinded me at times to how angry I think she really is and the possibility that she actually is yes, a little bit nutty. I've said before the only reason I started to ever believe PM at one time was that Julie vouched for her. It wasn't that I thought Julie was so honest; I just thought she would have taken better care of her own online reputation and not be taken in by a liar without any evidence that the woman really knew the Gosselins.

The fact that Julie doesn't see the disconnect between ostensibly being concerned for the Gosselin kids and being okay with them being mocked on a blog that she frequents indicates to me that she is either a total phony or at least a little bit loony.

Linda said...

I think that GWOP is actually a hoax too. And Sharla has admitted as much when she commented a few weeks ago that the purpose of the blog was never to advocate about the kids.

As for me, I knew it was never about child advocacy. It has always been about snarking on and trashing the Gosselins (big and little) with the occasional post about "child exploitation" thrown in their to give a veil of legitimacy.

The whole blah blah about we are "social workers, lawyers, CASAs, etc." was another way to give the illusion of legitimacy to the blog and the filth that they push.

Nina Bell said...

Linda,

You don't see too much of that anymore do you?

Linda said...

Around the time when GWOP changed their picture to include bigger baby geese, they also removed the disclaimer about the comment section and no longer talk about the supposed professions of the moderators.

I wonder why?

Nina Bell said...

I just wanted to say that I really enjoy the people that post here and with all of the talk about recipes I started to remember a very long comment that was sent my way last August by a person who frequented GWoP and had told me she was friends with the moderators there. Her comment was intended to make sure I knew my place in the Gosselin blogging world.

This is a small portion of her comment:

Otherwise, it may be a little too late to change course and suddenly try to make it something it never really could be in the first place, a happy Utopian Gosselin Is Love Land where everyone sits around playing Duck-Duck-Goose, lamenting over laundry and sharing organic recipes with one another.

Well I am not sure our recipes are organic but I sure have had a hell of a good time playing Duck-Duck-Goose with you all.

FIONA said...

The Mrs.,

Would you mind sharing any of the emails or info from your PM experience? I could ask a zillion question's too.

I was pretty sure she was a fake or a nut when she was blogging with a kid in ICU! Yea, right.

Linda,

So what do you mean "GWOP is a hoax"...do you think the mods get some sick twisted pleasure at stirring up the hate? I don't doubt it. However, in the beginning, I bought the whole advocay thing as well.

I want the crock pot recipes too!!!

kristin said...

Any chance we could start a crock pot recipe post/thread? I LOVE my crock pot and would love some new recipes!

MonicaW42 said...

What I dislike about the whole "Julie" thing, is how she took to a blog about it. It is one thing to defend your sister and stand up for her and then associate yourself with people who strongly hate that family. If you are so worried about those kids, there are legal channels to take and not put your sisters name out there.

On a sad note....did anyone read where John Travolta's 16 year old son Jett died today :( very sad. Even sadder it's not a hoax death.

That just made me so sad, having a son of my own.

Saint said...

I want the crock pot recipes too!!!
Me too!

Nina Bell said...

Per your request, a crock pot recipe thread has been started.

Saint said...

Thanks for sharing that email, Nina. It's really ridiculous to think of the "passion" that so many over there feel...to the point of letting you know your place! Like GDNNOP has anything to do with whether TLC keeps the show on the air!

Speaking of GWoP, the Princesses are back and they are as funny as ever (IMO.)

I don't see how anyone from GWoP can read them and not hide their heads in shame.

I also learned a new word there, "doppleganger." LOL!

SamanthaNC said...

Just read the news clip about Jett Travolta. So sad. Things like this are always very tragic but somehow it seems worse so close to the Holidays, New Years Day will probably always be a sad time now. It would also be hard not to think about how that was their last Christmas with him. They are in my prayers.

MonicaW42 said...

Saint,

I was happy to see them posting again. You can get withdrawals from their remarks. I wonder which "one" person steals all their names and posts at GWOP with them?

Rufus said...

As much as I had many "HUH?" moments with PM, my radar didn't truly go off until the whole "people are calling the hospital and the operators are mad" thing happened. That's when I just had to laugh out loud.

After having just been in the hospital for 4 months, I can assure you all that not only do hospital operators not give a crap about how many phone calls come in, but there is more than one operator manning the phone lines so they wouldn't know that "We have just received 12 phone calls in a row for Jason and this has to stop! You're overloading our phone system." It was just beyond absurd. Bwah hah hah hah!

merryway said...

Michelle, you asked upthread about the book. Scarfoot wrote a nice review on 11/7/08. It's in the blog archive down on the right on front page. In the threads before and after I think there might be some more tidbits about the book. I think Lizabeth wrote some details in there somewhere. I haven't read the book either.

Re: Julie
If I see someone being stabbed I'm not gonna fire up my Mac and blog about it. And yes she does appear to be a sandwich or two short of a picnic.

That's how I feel, she's always got such dark hints. If I was Kate I wouldn't want my children near her because of her behavior. By Julie's own admission she's quite removed from the situation. She spent one day with Kate some time ago and something else, but nothing recently. She wasn't “summoned” this time. The posts usually go: “I wonder what Julie thinks of all this” and then she appears a few posters down with words of doom. The responses in reply are usually that an archangel has spoken and therefore all the haters are validated.


If it's not too much trouble, I would be all for a thread with crock pot recipes, I am tired of cooking all the same old things in mine and would love to see someone else's fixins.

Nina, you make me so curious about the stuff you guys receive. You get the front row seats for the view of crazy town. I don't know if it's “been kept in it's place”, but I do so enjoy this blog. Duck duck..

Nina Bell said...

I think I will place a link to Scarfoot's book review on the sidebar so people can have easy access to it. Also the crock pot thread has been started .

Kikibee said...

Who else is waiting for Julie to apologize for, or even acknowledge,
her role in the PM saga? Yeah, like that would ever happen. If Julie cared at all about the kids she could have at least said that she couldn't verify what PM said about CPS and such.

I think Julie was jealous because Jodi got to do interesting things because of Kate, and because she wasn't included.

And, you know, if Jodi got fed up with Julie we would probably never know. Julie sure wouldn't tell anyone.

Saint said...

Nina, you make me so curious about the stuff you guys receive. You get the front row seats for the view of crazy town.

And if you ever write a book, I want an autographed copy!

Saint said...

Who else is waiting for Julie to apologize for, or even acknowledge,
her role in the PM saga?


Saint raises her hand.

themrs said...

saint- i believe i emailed her first, i honestly can't remember. after she stopped emailing me i didn't email her again. then i started getting emails from another person who was a supporter of her (from GWOP) along with several other posters including julie. i still don't know how that person got my email address because i don't post it anywhere. that's when i kind of freaked out and removed identifying info from my blog. this was the same time i recieved an email inviting me to the secret blog but by then i had come here, decided it was all crazy, and stopped going to GWOP or associating with any of them.

Saint said...

I think that GWOP is actually a hoax too.

Linda, a comment of yours was the first I ever read that Penn was a fraud, so I am taking this seriously.

I just started reading through the new open discussion at GWoP and you know what? It just may be a hoax.

I don't make a habit of reading, certainly not top to bottom. Usually there are, like 450 comments anyway. But this new thread is still manageable. You know what I see there?

I see someone who calls herself "Don't cancel The Gosselin 8" who supposedly thinks the show should be kept on because Kate would be worse off camera to the kids. This can NOT be for real. Later, the same poster is taking the incongruous position that God wants them on TV or something. OK, this is not a real commenter. This is someone playing a game.

There are other "fake" comments there that I think are just meant to stir the crazy pot. And there's FXFanatic bubbling to the surface, criticizing the Gosselins for not having 2 parents at home 100% of the time. Um, maybe she should check what she shares on her own blog before offering the Gosselins advice?

Are the mods there just having some fun with these people?

michelle said...

I'm sorry, I don't know what scarfoot is? You are talking about the Gosselin's book, right? ( :

I heard on the cable news channel about Jett Travolta. So Sad and my heart and prayers go out to John and his wife and daughter.

I bet I did hear the "rumor" about Jon just not going to work anymore when Kate was pregnant with the tups from one of the "scam" bloggers. The internet can/& has become just a "Bigger" and even more damaging method of spreading rumors and hurting people or their reputations. It is horrible.

scarfoot said...

I have noticed lately that GWoP isn't doing as well as it used to. They aren't getting as many comments now that they don't allow anonymous posts, they aren't posting much worth of anything, and they have been posting more comments lately that are speaking against the purpose of the blog, or that the blog needs more variety, etc (and I would guess they are posting these because they aren't getting much else).

It makes me glad to read this blog, because not only is it reasonable, it's nice to see everyone get along, and read fun posts about other things. We just have more fun over here, I think, and I'm glad!

Saint said...

TheMrs,
Thanks, I'd have been creeped out too. I don't blame you for getting out, and protecting your family.

The "secret blog" comes up again! There's enough on it here in the archives at GDNNOP for me to have changed my mind about Julie. I am sympathetic to a sister defending her sister, but after realizing that Julie was involved in that group, and how negative it all was, I realized her motivation was far more likely to be spite, not sisterly affection. I am not fooled by the "child advocacy" position, knowing she defended mocking kids.

And your post here, is yet another confirmation that she was involved.

Nina Bell said...

Scarfoot is the screen name of the person who reviewed Multiple Blessings for us. I now have a link to the post over on the right hand side of the blog. Just click on the photo of the book. Feel free to leave comments there if you just recently read the book and want to add something.

themrs said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
merryway said...

Re: the Crown Princess, they can never write enough for me. I always wish there was more to read. I have also wondered who is wrangling their names. I wear the mark of being somewhere on there as GWOPer lamenting the isolation of the children and I think something about Jon.

Saint, I found this on CNN and you popped in my head as someone who might also find this interesting and I think others here might as well. I haven't checked out her blogs yet more than to skim, there's a lot there. I'm intrigued and it's on my to do list when I have some time. It's a sahm in Canada who is supposed to be blatantly honest about being a mom. She seemed quite interesting as a person. They lost a young child and she has a son and daughter. Her blogs are called Redneck Momma and Missing My Bug which is retired. Check out the video to see a better summary than mine.

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/bestoftv/2008/06/23/ntm.redneck.mommy.cnn

Jazzed about new recipes!

Anya said...

Just sitting here at my computer getting caught up on our happy Utopian Gosselin Is Love Land. LOL.


Saint said..."And there's FXFanatic bubbling to the surface, criticizing the Gosselins for not having 2 parents at home 100% of the time. Um, maybe she should check what she shares on her own blog before offering the Gosselins advice?"

See that's what I nearly always think when I see these type of comments - what makes *you* the parenting expert who is justified to be looking down on others decisions regarding *their* children? Of course, at least most of these chicks are smart enough not to have a unique screen name which links back to a blog that reveals WAY TOO MUCH personal information.

Rufus said...As much as I had many "HUH?" moments with PM, my radar didn't truly go off until the whole "people are calling the hospital and the operators are mad" thing happened. That's when I just had to laugh out loud.

After having just been in the hospital for 4 months, I can assure you all that not only do hospital operators not give a crap about how many phone calls come in, but there is more than one operator manning the phone lines so they wouldn't know that "We have just received 12 phone calls in a row for Jason and this has to stop! You're overloading our phone system." It was just beyond absurd. Bwah hah hah hah!


You brought a smile to my face. That was comedy gold. I just have this mental image of some PBX Operator shutting down her system and coming upstairs to ICU to complain about receiving too many phone calls for one patient! Too too funny!!!

Anya said...

Add me to the list of those who are glad to see the Princess Boards more active!

And you gotta love the poor EM Tanner rep. who got stuck responding to the latest crazy:

"We appreciate your concern, and admire your rigidity.

:-)

CincyMom said...

"over there" they were also complaining about the number of appearances she has and that she's away from the kids. So I guess the Gosselins will never please them.

BTW: What is the princesses thing? I don't search around the internet much either.

Can't wait to look at the crockpot stuff.

And finally...........YES!!!!! I am in my own home on MY computer with internet. And get this...it has been done since 11 a.m. today but no one bothered to call me. When I call and ask if someone will call me, the IT geeks are always real brisk with me and quick to say "of course, we call you, that's our policy."
My husband took off work today to watch the kids so I could work, which I couldn't. That and a million other inconveniences over this I won't go into.
BUT...my dad's friend in Atlanta just lost his sister after a long week in Hospice and no food for 7 days. I just keep them in my prayers and remember a computer ain't no big thang.

It's fun talking with you guys. Maybe in 10 years, we can have a reunion next to Hershey medical center during their NICU anniversaries! Totally kidding.

Rufus said...

themrs said...
then i started getting emails from another person who was a supporter of her (from GWOP) along with several other posters including julie. i still don't know how that person got my email address because i don't post it anywhere.

and,
i still to this day have no idea how they got my info unless it was from PM. then a few months ago i recieved some emails from someone posing as jason haas. one of the mods here was included in that email. i emailed her personally and together we figured out it was three farmers playing a joke.



To me, this means that either GWOP was in on the hoax from the beginning or it was revealed to them by PM after it was outed here on GDNNOP.

So one of two things could have happened:
1: If they were in on it, then PM was sharing your e-mails and everyone else's with the GWOP elite.

2: If they were clued in after the exposure, then PM shared the names of her supporters with the GWOP elite as a rally cry.

It wouldn't surprise me if number 1 was right on. The GWOP elite were PM's biggest supporters. And it would make sense that they were supplying her with information about what to post. I think Bohemian Moon was just a casualty that got caught up in the mess without any knowledge of what was truly going on. As ferocious as the GWOPpers are about anything Gosselin, you'd think they would have immediately attacked someone who tried to pull one over on them. So again, if they didn't know all along, they joined in at the end to try to fix things before PM lost all hope.

Or at least, that's my theory.

Saint said...

Merryway,
Were you a Gwopper? There are so many Gwop/Penn converts over here!
I will check out the other blog BUT
I have been skipping through Utopian Gosselin IS Love Land far too much, and dread getting back to real life Monday.

TheMrs.,
What a New Year's! I am wishing a VERY PROSPEROUS 2009 on you especially. I'll be making your tortilla soup tomorrow...I have the ingredients :)

Anya,
The EM Tanner rep could be a Princess! She so snarky! "-if a person thinks their values ought not only to run their lives, but everyone else's lives-" Too funny! Can you imagine the complaint she got?

Kikibee said...

http://princessmc.proboards66.com/
CincyMom look under Literary Chitchat.

That response from the EmTanner person was hilarious. I always wonder about the poor people who have to read all the crazy emails from those people. I guess they give them a good laugh.

Nina Bell said...

Actually here is a direct link to the GWoP site.

http://princessmc.proboards66.com/index.cgi?board=Books&action=display&thread=2545&page=144

Go up to the left hand corner and change the page

Saint said...

Rufus,
I think we share a fascination with the Penn mystery.

I also suspect that the GWoP elite knew Penn was a fraud. Remember somebody commented here that Sharla emailed her and said PossumMom was her friend? Also, I remember Penn started a blog with 3F and Lonneyswife and some others about "Games Gosselins Play" then changed it to "Menopause blah, blah, blah" (like we need another Gosselin/menopause blog in America.) Now, if 3F felt duped, why would she write anything for anyone over there? Now we read here that 3F made jokes about Jason Haas? 3F knew all along. There is no other explanation for her staying and doing recaps over there. No one with any self-respect would be duped like that then keep submitting posts to the people who scammed her.

Moon's reaction was very different from GWoP's. I think she was scammed, too. She was very defensive and emotional (with Fiona and then with Nomoredrama.)

There must have been some GWoppers who felt scammed and angry. Themrs tells us she was scammed, and she was invited to "the secret message board." Remember the atheist blog debates? He kept saying he was emailed personal info. The mods here deny that. Nomoredrama especially denied it in her debate with Moon. So who had that info and was sending it to him? He didn't seem like he was lying because he mentioned screencaptures of the message board. That didn't come from GDNNOP.

merryway said...

Saint, I wasn't a true gwoper, but I posted there for a short time before moving on. I knew nothing about blog association, so I was surprised to see me on there when I found the princess board later on.

I also enjoyed the Em Tanner letter. I don't think I would even bother to reply to that kind of crazy.

Saint said...

Saint, I wasn't a true gwoper, but I posted there for a short time before moving on.

Yea, you didn't seem like a Gwopper. LOL. Like I said, a lot of us started in the blogosphere at GWoP/Julie's place/ or Penn Mommy Fantasy World. Me too. The Google made me do it.

SamanthaNC said...

Saint Said:

I also suspect that the GWoP elite knew Penn was a fraud. Remember somebody commented here that Sharla emailed her and said PossumMom was her friend? Also, I remember Penn started a blog with 3F and Lonneyswife and some others about "Games Gosselins Play" then changed it to "Menopause blah, blah, blah" (like we need another Gosselin/menopause blog in America.) Now, if 3F felt duped, why would she write anything for anyone over there? Now we read here that 3F made jokes about Jason Haas? 3F knew all along. There is no other explanation for her staying and doing recaps over there. No one with any self-respect would be duped like that then keep submitting posts to the people who scammed her.

I have always thought that gwop was in on the whole PM fiasco. There is no reason that they shouldn't have acknowledged it once the truth came out, not to mention that their site mysteriously went down almost immediatley. All evidence of PM erased...... and they have the nerve to accuse others of damage control? Anyway I'm not sure if they helped cook the whole thing up, but I definitley think they knew all about it from the getgo.

Nina Bell said...

I would like to clear something up. The "secret message board" is really a private message board between friends that met through the TWoP. Some of these friends started GWoP and are mods there. None of the mods here or myself are a member or have ever been a member of that.

So we are not confused, I think Saint and others are talking about a private blog that was started with "penn mommy" and a group of bloggers that frequented her blog and supported her.

I have no facts but I believe that the people that belonged to this private blog had nothing to do with the information that was emailed to the atheist blogs. I believe that it was members of the "secret message" board that emailed personal information about the person pretending to be "Penn Mommy." It appears that the person pretending to be "Penn Mommy" was a member of the "secret message board."

merryway said...

For those of you discussing PM, be sure to recheck the abchealthinsider messages. There are recent messages that you prob want to see.

merryway said...

Here's the link. Have to wonder what new drama may happen tomorrow.
Goodnight all.


http://blogs.abcnews.com/health_insider/2008/10/death-and-decep.html

Rufus said...

I had forgotten about the "private blog"... the menopause one. That should have been a huge tolling bell for all of us that PM was, at the least, a bit off. The idea of this grown woman who just wanted to get some things off her chest then goes and joins a group that attacks like a pack of wolves? Ahhh... we were so blind.

Linda said...

I think that GWOP is a hoax at several levels ...

1. It was never really about advocating for the kids or advocating towards changing the laws about protecting kids who participate in reality television ...

IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN ABOUT SNARK which is especially offensive when it is SNARKING about innocent kids.

2. I think that the anonymous posts that were previously allowed were what generated most of the comments.

(Some of my "rejected" comments would appear in the form of an anonymous comment refuting what I had written without posting my original comment.)

3. They don't allow anonymous posts and now the number of comments have lessened considerably.

What about the rest of you?

Mom said...

themrs -

I was included in emails from PennMommy/Corrine Marie, etc. along with several others and yes, there was a Julie Brown in that group, however, no one EVER contacted me (momofone07) about any hunches or accusations, etc. And, no other mod from here was in that group.

I still have all the emails and names, but prefer to keep that private as I'm sure those ladies wouldn't want their info out there.

When I first emailed penn mommy it was PRIOR to me being a mod here and it was to offer support. It was actually the email from "William" that made me think it was a hoax. Not necessarily a smoking gun, but definitely "interesting" to say the least.

Considering the person behind this entire scam, it wouldn't surprise me at all if some of the girls in the email group weren't real either, just more characters in her little (LARGE) theatrical productions.

Linda said...

And I've always thought that some of the GWOP elite (I like that name) were in on the PennMommy hoax.

It was always curious to me that they were self-appointed champions of The Truth (note the capitalizations) and yet when it was revealed that Penn Mommy was a fraud it seemed inconsistent that they wouldn't at least mention it.

But nary a peep or a word from the Gwoppers.

Nor did the other self-appointed Super Advocate Julie say anything.

It seemed unusual that these people who supposedly only did what they were doing "for the good of the kids" would say absolutely nothing about it.

Bottom line for me, I think that they were in on it.

Linda said...

I remember I actually got a lot of harsh criticisms saying that Julie might not be Jodi's sister. That it wouldn't take much to cut and paste a picture from anyone's photo sharing account and suggest that this was you and your sister from many years ago.

Heck, I could say this was my sister and I in the 80s.

http://www.revengeofthe80sradio.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/05/girls2smaller1.jpg

My point is that it is easy to fool people on the internet.

And what would really get to me is the absolute arrogance of Serena who would say things like,

"We're satisifed that Julie is who she says she is."

But then we weren't actually allowed to ask, "Who are you Serena?"

Anya said...

Merryway, thanks for posting the link to the ABC Board. So much to talk about. The show is interesting, but the drama surrounding the show is where the action is! :-)

Linda said...Some of my "rejected" comments would appear in the form of an anonymous comment refuting what I had written without posting my original comment.

Wow, Linda. I hadn't heard that before. Very telling indeed.

themrs said...

merryway- what's the web address for the abc health insider? i don't remember it!

BTW- saint, LOL that's my new favorite quote "the google made me do it"

Nina Bell said...

themrs,

Thanks for your comment. I will forward that info on to Mom. Can you email me at ninabell53@gmail.com. I am trying to keep personal info off of the comment section.

BEE said...

The internet is a tricky thing, that is for sure!! I read PM's blog, I posted there a few times, I might of even sent a "so sorry to hear about your son" post trying to be nice. However, I always held the position that unless I am witness to situations or hear conversations with my own ears, then I take what I read on the internet with a grain of salt.

PM didn't really say much that was in the way of "new" news. In my opinion, neither does Julie.

I have often wondered if we have all been played by Julie as well. How do we KNOW that she is who she says she is? Or at the very least that she has the "inside" information that she has taunted the blogworld with? What "new" news has she disclosed....ummm not much that I can recall!

And how do we KNOW that the Gosselins and Jodi/Kevin even had a falling out? For all we know they could of spent Christmas together! Yes, we don't see them on the show any longer but perhaps there were changes in the Gosselin's contract, perhaps TLC wanted to change the focus of the show, perhaps Jodi and Kevin didn't want to be on the show anymore? So many people thought that Carla and Beverly were kicked to the curb by the Gosselins because they had not been on the show lately either. But we find out that they are both still close with the Gosselin family. So the theory that the Gosselins threw everyone of of their lives or that everyone wanted out of their lives is false.

Maybe someone can answer this for me. But is anything that PM did illegal? I have no idea if laws even exist for things like that, but would the Gosselins or anyone that was "had" by PM have any legal recourse? PM seems to have scammed a lot people, not just in the Gosselin blogshpere, isn't there a way to stop this person?

Rufus said...

BEE said...
Maybe someone can answer this for me. But is anything that PM did illegal? I have no idea if laws even exist for things like that, but would the Gosselins or anyone that was "had" by PM have any legal recourse? PM seems to have scammed a lot people, not just in the Gosselin blogshpere, isn't there a way to stop this person?


I would guess (not being a cop, lawyer or judge) that there could be recourse for monetary scams that possum led if they could be proven.

A lot of people say that what Penn Mommy did was no big deal because she only scammed people out of prayers. In my opinion, it was only a matter of time before her scam turned into a monetary one. I don't knoe what the angle would have been, but I'm sure there would have been one.

Linda said...

I think that the scam was heading for PM bleeding people for money for funeral expenses.

Marly said...

Delurking to add my two cents. I have been following the PM drama from the beginning and was completely shocked to find out that I had been taken by a scam artist, but I don't believe money is the basis for her scams. I think it all boils down to attention. IMO, She thrives on being the victim and being in the middle of a drama. She continually has major issues in her life that allow her followers (in whatever group...atheism, J&K, stamping) to rally around her in support.

The whole thing is both sad and fascinating to me, which is why I continue to follow it. It's kind of like watching a movie of the week only to have your cable go out during the big climax. I just want to know the rest of the story.

indianprincess said...

wow, I went back to read the new comments on the ABC article. I didn't think it was still going on with all the drama. I think the people involved on that site from both sides need to move on because if this person(pm) is crazy for attention then they are fueling her crazy fire. That's just me!

Anya said...

Hi TheMrs.

merryway said...
Here's the link. Have to wonder what new drama may happen tomorrow.
Goodnight all.


http://blogs.abcnews.com/health_insider/2008/10/death-and-decep.html


Just in case you haven't found the link already....

Good points, Bee.

I think 'something' happened between Jodi/Kevin and Jon/Kate, but I don't pretend to know the details. I am not even sure Julie really knows everything either. In any case, she is not helping anything with her internet games. If Jodi/Kevin are great and you worry for the Gosselin children, why would you give Jon and Kate an excuse to keep Kevin and Jodi out of their lives?

IMO that is what Julie is doing...Why would they associate with Jodi knowing private information could be filtered back to the blabbermouth?

Theresa said...

I came aboard the Gosselin blog world a bit after the PennMommy thing, so I'm totally unaware of it but reading up on it here. What a nutcase she was, huh?

I had never posted at GWop, but that is where I first started reading about the Gosselins as I had googled "Gosselin" and they were high up on that google list. From Day 1, I realized what a stupid, informative, immature, one-sided it was. I honestly think it should be taken down as it does nothing but spew forth hatred and I believe is extremely damaging to the Gosselin kids. (geeze, I googled "Gosselin", can you imagine if one of their kids googled their own name and went onto that site? Seriously, they would be traumatized at reading all the lies and hate.) I might skim over there to see what's being said, but I can't get past a few posts before I move on because it's the same old, hashed over lies. It's really unfair and un-balanced over there. (off-balanced, too).

themrs--what jerks to do what they did to you. Honestly, that just shows their immaturity...at the expense of your piece of mind over the safety of your family.

Also immature on the mods part over there for not posting Linda's posts. I bet they were factual, great responses to the stupidity that was rolling over there, but because her posts were mature and made sense (and went against what they were saying), it didn't get posted.

I enjoy our Utopian Gosselin Love Land here, too. (And, I like reading Baby Mama's blog.) We have different opinions, but we are all mature and don't disrepect each other. Nor, do we disrespect the Gosselin family. Great discussions.

Duck...duck...

Guinevere said...

...goose!

Delurking to add my two cents. I have been following the PM drama from the beginning and was completely shocked to find out that I had been taken by a scam artist, but I don't believe money is the basis for her scams. I think it all boils down to attention. IMO, She thrives on being the victim and being in the middle of a drama.

I tend to agree with this. It's just a guess, but I think the money and/or stuff that she gets from people is, rather than being the goal in and of itself, representative of the love and attention she craves. I do pity her but her behavior also disgusts me. Hearing about Jett Travolta brings home the actual agony that the loss of a child can cause in a family, and to think that she fabricated that, out of a desire to hurt and manipulate people...well, such behavior is really beyond the pale, IMO.

Rufus said...

Guinevere said...
It's just a guess, but I think the money and/or stuff that she gets from people is, rather than being the goal in and of itself, representative of the love and attention she craves.


I agree, but I think that knowing that people will rally around her needs with the ultimate gift (in her mind), money, would be the ultimate high for her. C'mon, she got complete strangers to donate money for window film, of all things. A smart person would have collected the money and arranged for the services. Through her manipulation, I'm sure that wasn't even an option.


(P.S. I have been and think I always will be addicted to this topic. It's not only fascinating, but fun too. This hasn't ended yet. She'll never stop and I can't wait to find out what she does next.)

Saint said...

I agree about the attention being PM's ultimate goal, not money or other stuff. She wants to be loved. It's an illness, but she is still responsible. I am sure she knows she is wrong.

Rufus, I am fascinated, too. I am satisfied I know who she is, and can recognize her sockpuppets pretty well on the Internet. I'll never know how much other posters knew and when, I can only guess based on what I see.

The ABC site is fascinating, in part, because the comments aren't moderated as they are at the "involved" sites.

Indianprincess, you are probably right about the discussion fueling her to keep going with this. You'd think she would have stopped after the Penn fiasco, but it seems like she wants it to continue or even to be 'credited' with the ruse, even when it makes her look looney. I hope we're at the end of this drama. I'd say it's had a rather sad ending for one family...hers.

Rufus said...

The cool thing about the ABC site is that that's where so many "outsiders" first heard of this whole... ordeal?... fiasco? I don't know what to call it. In any case, these outsiders did their own sluething and came to the same conclussions that we've come to.

Saint,
Aww, c'mon. You know you don't really hope it's over, do you? ;)

Saint said...

Rufus,
You are too funny.
I really feel sad for her family though. :(

Linda said...

I think that the PM drama and GWOP and Julie are absolutely intertwined and absolutely fascinating.

I can't imagine taking my strong feelings against a family member to complete strangers on the internet.
It actually seems potentially dangerous to me.

themrs said...

here's the part that gets me... i share personal stories on my blog. sometimes they are financial issues, because that's just part of life. but if at any point a complete stranger offered to send me money, there is NO WAY i could accept it. it would just feel wrong! i could never take it. i also would have a hard time sending money to a total stranger. during the time of PM's son's "illness" one poster asked if we (her readers) should help with gas cards, gift cards, etc. someone (thankfully) commented that wasn't appropriate. i always wonder how much would have come in.

Linda said...

What we don't know is if the person who initiated the giving was yet another socket puppet of PM?

It really would be a perfect scam. Set the scene for emotional and financial want and then pose as another concerned poster desiring to offer assistance.

merryway said...

PM's life certainly seems wrought with drama. I certainly feel for victims, but there are others who make everything into something dramatic. I am so curious about curious. I don't believe anything I read by PM and her friends.

Can't believe that was 3F's idea of a joke. How twisted.

jace said...

I was on a forum a few years ago that had a similar situation to Penn Mommy. In this case, a person talked about her severe depression over about her broken engagement and got lots of support from the members of the forum. Eventually a friends and relatives came on to tell us that this person had attempted suicide. Well, it all turned out to be a fake in the end. She had set up an engagement website but the pictures of her intended were taken from a modeling website. It caused quite the uproar with people getting mad at the mods for their insensitivity to this poor women. Other people were upset that they had believed her story and prayed for her and supported her. Sounds familiar.

After that experience, I take everything I hear on the internet with a huge grain of salt. I think people are truthful about struggles in their lives and I have sympathy for them. But when it becomes so dramatic and people are taking sides, I smell a rat.

What I find more interesting than the people who do this for attention are the people who continue to support the liars after the evidence has come out. They have so much of a stake in being right that they don't want to see the truth. In PM's case, her lies about Kate were so tied into her lies about the death of her son that people had to believe the one so they could continue believing the other. They have such a stake in it that it's scary.

FIONA said...

The Mrs.,

First off I appreciate your having an open mind to my "having it out" with PM! Thanks!

What did Julie say to you? That seems so, so I don't even know, that Jodi's sister would email you!

What do you think she was hoping to accomplish? Sorry, but I a very curious.

And Three Farmers emailed you as well...what was that all about?

mariel said...

They said in the ABC comments that PM often posts as Karen. I just scanned through the gwop open discussion thread and there is a Karen saying "I remember watching the "Gosselin play games" episode where the entire family is playing 'duck, duck, goose'. Coincidence? ;-)

nc resident said...

My question is just that and by no means any acusation. How do we get that PennMom is this Possum person. For as confused as I was about the PM deal I was actually worried to think an IP was captured and traced to a certain area.

Saint said...

Merryway, don't be curious about curious. I was Curious at Berlzebub's Hypocrisy thread. If you followed, you'll see I started wanting to figure out who was lying, and about 1/2way through, I was convinced by what I found and all the work done by Intrigued and a few others. I would have used "Saint," but I was on an atheist blog and I was not sure if that screen name would have irritated him at the beginning. After the P1 comment (I never believed it was actually the daughter, but who knows?) I was pretty much done. It wasn't even close to a reasonable discussion at that point. So, I emailed some of the mods here about who I was. I felt a little bad that Berlze and some of his friends (and Possum's socks) kept thinking they were dealing with the GDNNOP mods when it was just me. I felt I owed the mods here an apology (and little explanation.) I knew they wanted it dropped, and my conversation there just helped keep it going. I tried to make that clear to Berlze, but I never think he understood who was who. I never had IP numbers or anything to give him. At the time, I didn't even have her atheist blog to look at.

I am Curious at the ABC blog, too, toward the end. I'm done over there now, though. I wanted to respond to a comment left at Berlze's about checking public records, and again, I didn't know if he'd let it through (he did.) I have been disappointed by the response of Calladus and Berlze, but they must have known about the divorce, so maybe that's why they have said nothing.

merryway said...

Linda said...
I think that the scam was heading for PM bleeding people for money for funeral expenses.


I kind of thought that also, but then saw it as too obvious for her. I think it would have come back later for donations for a tombstone or something to that affect. Oh, it's so morbid to write about.

I am under the impression that this is more about attention that $s. I think the $s might have served as some sort of validation but secondary in importance to the adoration and support she receives. She certainly didn't try to keep the attention off of herself and lost any defense in going on and on trying to find a way out that it wasn't really her.

merryway said...

Saint, while you are curious, I am clueless. Well, you kicked ass. I had no idea.

Rufus said...

merryway said...
I think it would have come back later for donations for a tombstone or something to that affect.


Maybe.

Or maybe the homeschool buddies would put together a memorial scholarship to some hiking camp.

Or a donation to the hospital so they could put in some more phone lines.

Maybe more wireless hot spots in the ICU for grieving families to blog?

A year's supply of yogourt for PM so she doesn't need to grab any out of someone else's fridge.

Legal fees so the family could get Jason's college tuition back - surely that's why the university is denying he was ever there... to keep the tuition money.

Or maybe just medical texts for PM herself so she understands that if your son is on a ventilator, he can't eat applesauce.

AAP said...

I'm just trying to catch up here, and there's one thing I think I read that I can't find any info on.

Merryway, did you say that 3F admitted PM was created as a joke?

PM's life certainly seems wrought with drama. I certainly feel for victims, but there are others who make everything into something dramatic. I am so curious about curious. I don't believe anything I read by PM and her friends.

Can't believe that was 3F's idea of a joke. How twisted.


I was reading from the most recent post and going backwards, but I can't find anything else about this.

I think that ABC article is so identical to PM story that I wonder if Evie is Possemmomma - lol.

After the mods here can back with the information on PM I have waited for GWOP to take a stance on the situation, and when they never did I pretty much stopped reading over there.

When PM had her last blog entry about situation (I think it was the tribute site), she made herself sound so depressed and gave indications that she was thinking of killing herself. While I didn't believe her story was true, I did contact Sharla on the slight chance it could be real, copying what PM said in the email and asking her to get in touch, just to be on the safe side. A couple days later I got an email from Sharla that just said thank you - nothing about PM being a fake and no explaination about what was going on.

My opinion on Julie is starting to slide as well. It's time for her to get over her veiled comments about Jon and Kate. If she has an opinion about the show, fine, but the whole "I know secrets you don't" posts makes me think she really knows nothing.

themrs said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
themrs said...

Rufus said: " Maybe.

Or maybe the homeschool buddies would put together a memorial scholarship to some hiking camp.

Or a donation to the hospital so they could put in some more phone lines.

Maybe more wireless hot spots in the ICU for grieving families to blog?

A year's supply of yogourt for PM so she doesn't need to grab any out of someone else's fridge.

Legal fees so the family could get Jason's college tuition back - surely that's why the university is denying he was ever there... to keep the tuition money.

Or maybe just medical texts for PM herself so she understands that if your son is on a ventilator, he can't eat applesauce"

OMG you just made me blow coffee out of my nose with that one! this is why i love this site. i take a nap, wake up, check my email and laugh so hard liquids are coming out of my nose!

themrs said...

saint- i can't believe you're "curious"! i was wondering who that was. you gave alot of well said arguments. see my above quote to fiona, i think it fits this scenerio too:)

Saint said...

Saint, while you are curious, I am clueless.

I am looking for Intrigued, myself. I wonder if she is reading? Also, None So Blind. These two had a lot of really good points to make. Very bright posters, IMO.

NC Res,
How do we know? You don't need any inside info. I never had any IP address information, or message board screen shots, or personal info (until I looked for it and found it on the atheist sites in earlier posts.) I never could find the "personal info posted everywhere" that PM's friends kept whining about. I could never find the daughter's blog, except the one her mother links to, and it hasn't been updated in a year.

There are good efforts at examining the style similarities between the sockpuppets and the accused. To me, they're solid. But I was really convinced by the preposterous story of one particular sockpuppet: bananabethanna. She is a former Gosselin volunteer who posted at GWoP (in the summer) and a life-long friend of the native Californian Possum, who posted at Berlze's blog as Possum's character witness in another "fundraising" effort on her behalf. There are even more conflicting details to this sock's story, but the geographical gymnastics are enough to convince me she's a fake.

I know there is a lot more evidence out there against Possum. Once her blog went public again (after a one month, self-imposed hiatus that was supposed to have lasted forever) all you had to do was click on any month in the archives, and there was a new, preposterous drama to behold.

I have seen this discussed at other boards where I have lurked and I have to agree with the poster at ABC who is writng a book. Except for the "gullible skeptics" (as I call them fondly) everyone has concluded Penn Mommy was a fraud.

So is there a point? There are so many stories floating around the Gosselin blogosphere because of Possum's invented stories. People are never sure "where they heard it" but often the anti-Kate stories are originally from the mind of an excellent writer with a serious ethical deficiency. What I have seen happen (and this has been discussed,) is that the stories were accepted and then repeated, sometimes changed a la "Whisper Down the Alley." I understand that the Gosselin show is controversial to "non-blogging" viewers, too, but there has definitely been a deeper negative impact on the perception of those who read the stories. There have been comments elsewhere that start, "I was standing in the supermarket line and overheard two people talking about Kate, and I said, 'Did you know...'" They always follow that with some "inside" info that they "read/heard somewhere" but couldn't verify if they had to.

Saint said...

Rufus,
You made my day. A year's supply of yogourt for PM so she doesn't need to grab any out of someone else's fridge. Too, too funny.

themrs said...

saint you took the words right out of my mouth... or my keyboard so to speak! i also would love to know who none so blind and curious are. i was interestparty. the writing style analysis was fascinating. i don't know why i'm so intrigued with all of this but i am. do you think it's a sad reflection on my life? LOL

Saint said...

TheMrs!
Type that more clearly, please...
Who were you at ABC?
Intrigued?
Interested Party?

themrs said...

interested party

SamanthaNC said...

the mrs.-

You rocked it- not pathetic at all, I love the super slething, I'm so impressed with all of you!

Saint said...

Themrs,
You are writing a book! You want to Interview griffin?

MonicaW42 said...

I wonder how long before PM's husbands attorney starts sending out court sopena's in regards to all the blogs and information on his in dire of mental help wife?

I hope she gets court mandated mental help as it appears she has been doing this for a number of years.

I do feel sorry for her kids. And just like I hope the Gosselin children don't read hateful things on the internet about themselves or their parents, I hope the same for her children as well.

PM, I am sure you read all these blogs, you attacked the Gosselins and a bunch of other people, parents out there...... Do you feel bad at all that your children can now read this stuff about you as well? Get help......

themrs said...

i was the first interested party, all one word. farther down someone else used the same name. i feel like i could write a book!

MonicaW42 said...

Saint,

I had a strong feeling you were Curious :)

TheMrs,

I would never have guessed.

Good job ladies.

Saint said...

You are right Monica42, I agree.

And those kids also deserve the same sort of care that the Gosselins do. She may not have been careful on behalf of the Gosselins, but knowing what I do now, I wish I could take back my criticism of her. I apologize. And good luck to that family. I hope that it ends as well as possible for them all.

Marly said...

Saint and themrs, I just wanted to let you both know that I have enjoyed reading your comments as Curious and interested party!

I still find it hard to believe that PM's supporters don't think it is suspicious that she has been accused of sockpuppeting three different times,by three different people/groups of people. I'm farely new to the blogging world, but to me that would be enough to make me start questioning things.

Anya said...

"Or a donation to the hospital so they could put in some more phone lines."

I loved all the suggestions, but this my favorite. I rarely laugh out loud, but I did with this one!

Add me to the list of those who are impressed with Curious and Interested Party. I appreciate the questions you guys asked. I am sure you helped to shed light on this for more than a few folks....

Nina Bell said...

Responding to NC Resident.

Yes her IP address was "captured". Why would that worry you? If you are not doing anything wrong, you have nothing to worry about. Only people that troll and harass should be concerned. And Penn Mommy was definitely a troll on this site.

IP addresses are public knowledge. They show up every time you visit a website or blog. The blog owner has the ability to monitor who visits the site. This info allows you to see what area or city the IP address is coming from. It is legal and the websites that provide this for the most part provide it for free.

It by no means gives you specific names or street addresses. You would need a court order to find out who is attached to the IP address.

The Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals ruled in United States vs. Forester that IP addresses and the To/From fields in emails are the legal equivalent of dialed phone numbers and the government can get a court order to obtain them without showing probable cause as would be needed in a search one's house.

I am not going to try to explain the whole Penn Mommy debacle here but go back to October 6th on this blog and read the two posts about this situation.

There are many other blogs and sites out there that have looked into this also and they all have come up with the same conclusion using their own investigative resources.

themrs said...

i feel the need to clarify, as i am recieving kudos for something i cannot take credit for. early in the abc posts, i posted as "interestedparty" (all one word) the later posts by "interested party" are a different person. i can't take credit for research i did not make. just wanted to make sure everyone got that :) BtW, i'm thinking none so blind has to be a GDDNOP reader. must be why she makes such good arguments:)

themrs said...

nina bell, i have an IP question. if a person was on a laptop, say on vacation, would a different IP address come up then when they are at home? would it be the IP of the wireless provider they are using? i've always wondered how that works. so at my home, my laptop and my home PC would have the same IP? it's all a little confusing to me. i'm not too tech savvy!

indianprincess said...

themrs: I got the impression Interested Party wasn't part of the Gosselin blogworld but I could be wrong.

At the time it was interesting to go and read and yesterday with all of PM's drama with the divorce and now I feel so bad for her children getting caught up with PM's crazy online world. Researching myself on this women back in October, she sure got around the internet. I had to write a list of who was who just to keep her idenities correct. I never posted anywhere of my findings. I read most people found the evidence themselves. Her online trail with a few google searchs wasn't hard. Not someone who kept things hidden.

Theresa said...

Wow! I went back through the October 6th thread and tried to get caught up on the PM thing and my eyes hurt! :)

Nina Bell said...

mrsref,

I am not tech savy either. From what I understand, if you went on vacation with your laptop you would have a different IP number. It is the Internet Service Provider that assigns the IP address.

Each computer has a MAC number or machine number that never changes.

Also I believe if you were using your laptop and home computer at the same time the IP address would vary slightly but it would be the last number or two that would be different.


You can have a static IP address and that would be one that never changed. Or a dynamic one that can change each time you turn on your computer. You would have to ask your provider to find out.

Penn Mommy's IP address never changed.

Please, if someone has more information, feel free to chime in.

indianprincess said...

IP addresses are basically virtual house addresses from host internet service providers so the answer is no. If you took your laptop computer on vacation you get a new IP address. If you even took your laptop to a friends house your IP address would change and is different to the IP address as your friends even though you are at there house. I'm trying to write as quick as possible while my hubby is explaining this to me. He's a computer nerd and does it as a career. If you have anymore computer questions he said he would answer them.

themrs said...

so that would explain how you (the mods) came up with the discrepency with PM. her IP was always coming from Bakersfield, before she ever had the sick son. which means she was never in PA. i also thought it was odd (afterwards) that she would be staying two hours from the hospital where her son was in the ICU. even if that were true, her random updates that were supposedly from the hospital would have had an LA IP. it's all slowly coming together! sitemeter is our friend :)

merryway said...

AAP said...
I'm just trying to catch up here, and there's one thing I think I read that I can't find any info on.

Merryway, did you say that 3F admitted PM was created as a joke?

PM's life certainly seems wrought with drama. I certainly feel for victims, but there are others who make everything into something dramatic. I am so curious about curious. I don't believe anything I read by PM and her friends.

Can't believe that was 3F's idea of a joke. How twisted


Aap,
I see how that could be read that way. I need to be more careful. No, I was referring to themrs upthread i still to this day have no idea how they got my info unless it was from PM. then a few months ago i recieved some emails from someone posing as jason haas. one of the mods here was included in that email. i emailed her personally and together we figured out it was three farmers playing a joke, which i did not find particularly funny.

rufus, your are so funny with the list, I giggled hard at the applesauce.

Nina Bell said...

Indian Princess,

Maybe if you can repost with a brief summary but we no longer are posting things that are copied and pasted from other sites. Posting the link is fine. Also I doubt very seriously if that is Jodi and would not want to spread rumors one way or the other.

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