Monday, May 18, 2009

The Gangs All Here


Jon and Kate (and "The Bodyguard") were spotted by paparazzi at a local Pennsylvania water park on Sunday. The gossip website JustJared is reporting the family was at the park filming a belated birthday party for the sextuplets fifth birthday.

Do you think there is more than meets the eye? Please share your thoughts.

116 comments:

sueshe said...

It is very hard to watch/see the Kon's as they film their scripted roles of a happy family. With all that has been said, who will believe anything going forward. I never liked Kate in the beginning, the middle or the end. The stardom has only made her and her attitude that much worst. She is a stuck up mess!!!
I can only wish that during the couch sessions, Jon would speak up and let Kate have it for at least 3 seasons....now that would bring in solid ratings.

mkb77 said...

I am not sure I would have the strength to show up and be in the same room with my spouse after all that has happened.

I have said it before, I'll say it again: as much as I love this family and have enjoyed watching their show, it is time to just take it off the air.

The upcoming episodes will be so contrived.

DurhamDora said...

Sueshe...why do you watch the show if you think she's a "stuck up mess" and never liked her? I don't understand that whole "I HATE the show and everything about it; but I must watch it!" I don't follow that logic in the least. I hate Christopher Walken, so when he's on SNL, guess what? I don't watch it. It's really that simple.

I also think calling them "Kon" is as ridiculous as calling Kate "Katie Irene." It's pointless and about as funny as toenail fungus.

I truly think it's the people who don't like Kate who are driving the high ratings. When there's controversy surrounding something, it's all the more interesting. I think the fine ladies at GWOP can take a bow for their part in this show's popularity and longevity.

Kikibee said...

This is interesting-
http://www.suntimes.com/entertainment/people/1578633,CST-FTR-zp18.article
if it's true.

Supposedly, J&K are having a book written about their rise to fame, then will have a tv movie made from it. If this is for real, someone is really good with the marketing. I don't know how good it is for the kids, though.

I would like to see a competent,
impartial journalist do an article, or book, about this whole
phenomenon, including all the blogs. I think it would be an interesting comment on society today.

Illinois Mom said...

Do I think there is "more than meets the eye" as it was a staged birthday event for the kids, not a real party at all, than yes!

Most kids partys don't include a film crew, paparrazi, security guard and 2 parents who live seperate lives, but for the sake of a TV show come together.

I have to agree with one part of what Dora said, and that is the ridiculous and childish names given to Jon and Kate, Kon, Greedlins and the like.

However, I do believe if some one does not want to watch the show, they can figure out how to turn the channel.

Anya said...

Illinois Mom said...I have to agree with one part of what Dora said, and that is the ridiculous and childish names given to Jon and Kate, Kon, Greedlins and the like. Thanks, Illinois Mom and Dora for bringing attention to this. Just a note of warning, I'll be doing some modding today and I don't intend to put through any comments that address J&K with any of these ridiculous and demeaning monikers.
____________________

However, I do believe if some one does not want to watch the show, they can figure out how to turn the channel.

"I HATE the show and everything about it; but I must watch it!" I don't follow that logic in the least. I hate Christopher Walken, so when he's on SNL, guess what? I don't watch it. It's really that simple.

Thank you, ladies. It really is simple and none of their explanations for why they have to watch make a whit of sense. That said, I do enjoy the more outrageous explanations about cats turning channels, etc. :-)

Trish said...

I agree that the show should end...specially with the paps following the kids.

However...I see this recent event as encouraging. No matter what Jodi and Kevin have said...we are not totally privy to what J&K are actually doing regarding their relationship...they really might be working on it. It is very apparent no matter what the mistakes they have both made, they love their kids.

IMO, the way these kids interact with each other is proof enough that there has been a lot of love in their home. Adults might be able to fake it...kids...not too likely.

sueshe said...

In this computer savy world, we have learned to use short cuts for words, terms, etc. I use KON just like I use LOL, brb, ttyl, etc. Read into as you may like, but the intention was a short cut...again in computer lingo!

Linda Hoyt said...

QuietButStrong:
Whose cat can turn channels? Now I would love to see a reality show on that :.)

AC said...

I think that it is absolutely disgusting that Kate's expression is so mocking and unkind when Cara appears to be upset in one of the pictures. I also think that is it pathetic that the children "get" to have a party with cameras and microphones stuck in their faces. It is beyond belief that these events take place as they would were filming needs not a priority. I cannot believe that the children are not aware of this and that it does not detract from their enjoyment and happiness. Come on, they are actors.

Anya said...

sueshe said...In this computer savy world, we have learned to use short cuts for words, terms, etc. I use KON just like I use LOL, brb, ttyl, etc. Read into as you may like, but the intention was a short cut...again in computer lingo!

Fair enough, but J&K is just as many keystrokes.

These type of nicknames really don't add much to the conversation. To that end, I think we would all do well to avoid them.

mkb77 said...

AC said...
"I think that it is absolutely disgusting that Kate's expression is so mocking and unkind when Cara appears to be upset in one of the pictures. I also think that is it pathetic that the children "get" to have a party with cameras and microphones stuck in their faces. It is beyond belief that these events take place as they would were filming needs not a priority. I cannot believe that the children are not aware of this and that it does not detract from their enjoyment and happiness. Come on, they are actors."

Seriously? They are pictures and they do not tell a story they just capture a moment.

Who are we to even begin to think what is going through any of their minds or what those children know or don't know.

I tell you what, the fact that Kate or Jon can put one foot in front of the other let alone do it in public is amazing after the firestorm they have been through.

I refuse to judge the expressions on those kids' or the adult's faces in any of those pictures.

Teresa said...

sueshe said...
In this computer savy world, we have learned to use short cuts for words, terms, etc. I use KON just like I use LOL, brb, ttyl, etc. Read into as you may like, but the intention was a short cut...again in computer lingo!

May 18, 2009 9:52 AM
________________________

LOL = Lauging out loud
brb = be right back
ttyl = talk to you later
What is Kon a shortcut for?

Carol Ann said...

mkb77,

I only have one thing to say. A picture is worth a thousand words.

erin said...

I agree MKB, the expression on a face in a picture is not enough to know the entire story. I'll reserve judgment.

I don't necessarily think this is so much contrived as what you do when you have little kids and you are having problems. You keep going, put up a united front, and try not to let the adult fights interfere with the kids. I think that's pretty admirable.

rain88 said...

Sueshe...why do you watch the show if you think she's a "stuck up mess" and never liked her? I don't understand that whole "I HATE the show and everything about it; but I must watch it!" I don't follow that logic in the least. I hate Christopher Walken, so when he's on SNL, guess what? I don't watch it. It's really that simple.Sueshe didn't say she hated the show. I don't like Kate, or Jon, I still watch the show. I love the interaction between the kids and I find Kate fascinating to watch; from an analytical point of view. Why is it only acceptable for people who love Kate to watch the show?

Jacelynn said...

With all that has been going on I don't think I will be watching season 5.

5monkeys said...

"What is Kon a shortcut for?"

I always thought it was Kate + Jon smooshed together. ?

Jacelynn said...

From my understanding KON is Jon and Kate put together but also a play on words, like CON artists....... kinda lame though IMO.

indianprincess said...

I saw the picure on Tmz with Jon and Steve talking to each other. For a man who's supposed to be having relations other than professional with your wife they looked pretty friendly together.

Anya said...

indianprincess said...
"I saw the picure on Tmz with Jon and Steve talking to each other. For a man who's supposed to be having relations other than professional with your wife they looked pretty friendly together."
................................

I saw that too, IndianPrincess.

I don't know how much we can tell from these pictures (others obviously feel differently), but there didn't appear animosity between Jon and Steve, the bodyguard.

Out of all the rumors flying out there, the bodyguard one is probably the least credible to me, which makes it all the more disturbing that Kevin & Jodi Kreider saw fit to give it any credence publically.

MrsRef said...

I don't think it is so odd that Jon is talking to Steve. He does need to provide the "material goods" for the kids and the show must go on. I do think those pictures are sad. How many kids have that many people surrounding them with mikes in their faces at their birthday party? This is not normal folks.

Cherier1 said...

I wish the best for these children.
I really hope that someday soon they can have a normal private life. They are in my prayers.

Illinois Mom said...

I tell you what, the fact that Kate or Jon can put one foot in front of the other let alone do it in public is amazing after the firestorm they have been through.



I respect your viewpoint, however the way I see it is pure selfishness. They caused the whole darn thing.

What would be amazing if they decided to get their kids out of the public eye.

Illinois Mom said...

Anya,

I haven't seen the pic but I have this "feeling" that the bodyguard is not a boyfriend. Just a hunch that a man with his credintials would sacrifice his career.

I don't like what Jodi and Kevin and Julie have done either. That being said I do believe much of what if not all was said.

I think there was a better way to get their message through other than Julie's blog or radaronline.

massmom said...

I am wondering if people are planning on watching the new season? IMO I just don't see how anyone could, in good conscience, continue to watch a show that is so obviously hurting innocent children. I don't care how TLC spins this whole mess, after Kate did that article in People Magazine, I have lost all respect for her and any last shred of hope that she is putting her children first.

Karen Boggs said...

For some reason I have kept on hoping that my opinion concerning Jon was true.

I kept thinking he would eventually put Kate in her place and the family would move on, away from television.

It looks like Jon is as intent to keep this show going as Kate is.

I don't see any end in sight as long as their are weak-kneed fans out there who are willing to pay $100.00 just for her autograph.

The exploitation goes on and on and on and ....

SadViewer said...

Since the photos are the paparazzi kind, one cannot read too much into the expressions of the people invovled. Nonetheless, I feel sorry for Cara who was seen crying as it was a birthday party which should be a joyous occassion.

Also, the sextuplets' birthdays were last weekend. It's just my personal opinion, but I never like to celebrate my birthdays late.

I fell in love with the show b/c of the children & no matter how you slice this situation. Divorce, no divorce. At the end of the day, the ones that will suffer for it are the ones too young to defend themselves. I hope J&K wake up and realize they are already truly blessed, all the fame & fortune are just a bonus, but not a necessity.

Beatrice said...

The thing I find strange is that Steve is still their bodyguard. I would think they would reassign him at least temporarily, at least until these rumors blow over.

I saw the Just jared photos of Kate and kids at Party City and Steve was with them. I thought that was a little odd she needed a bodyguard to go pinata shopping.

Momof2 said...

The tups do look cute though on the website...looks like they are having fun..and eating cake!

http://tlc.discovery.com/tv/jon-and-kate/slideshows/sextuplets-birthday-party.html

MrsRef said...

The difference between the PAP pictures and the TLC propoganda are like night and day. Sad that these kids are being used that way. And the show just goes on.....

A Mom-ynous said...

I read nothing in to the term "belated" birthday.

While Kate was out of town ...we don't really know what was done on the actual birthday for the kids.

I will trust that the Sextuplets shouldn't suffer any long term damage from this unless some well meaning folks remind them relentlessly for the next several decades that their parents were horrible for doing such a gastly thing.

Can't say Jon and Kate get special parenting privileges that the rest of us don't get, but my husband has been away from home on numerous occasions and I would hate for him to be judged a poor parent if he was not physically present for a special day.

It happens in the real world.

You don't need my special blessing to not like the show--but nitpicking details just as this is a judgement on millions of parents and not just Jon and Kate Gosselin.

And funny--parents often put aside differences and come together for events for their children. Often it is called behaving like an adult. Only on blogs would that be called living a lie for a tv show.

Teach Me to Be Still said...

Well, it is sad to see Cara so upset in that one photo. We won't know until the episode airs what happened exactly. I do wish Kate would handle these situations more privately though. I have a son that is the name age as Mady and Cara. He sometimes has meltdowns but they end much quicker if we can take him aside privately to see what the problem is. I've learned alot from Supernanny :-) Even if we can't get away, if we bend down and shield him from other folks, whisper in his ear, etc it ends the situation more quickly. Kate appears to handle these situations with much sarcasm and drama. I feel bad for Cara. Hard to watch....guess we'll have to wait and see what happened when the show comes out. If I chose to watch. Not sure I want to anymore :-(

lulubae said...

Carol Ann said
I only have one thing to say. A picture is worth a thousand words.
You're right it is. And those thousand words could include, Kate was mad, Kate stepped on something, Kate was making that gesture cause she was stressing a point, Kate was about to sneeze, Kate was having a seizure, etc. You can insert whatever you like. Cause a thousand words can also have varying degrees of meaning.

i need a shrink said...

I am so confused. I really enjoyed the show in the beginning. But now I don't know what to think. I will watch the May 25th episode. Maybe that show will make me feel better. Am I the only one with these mixed feelings?

Baby Mama said...

I was reading the post that said it was odd that Kate needed a bodyguard to go pinata shopping. However when your fan plus the crew are in a car being followed by 5 OTHER cars, I would feel the need for protection too.

I agree that I would NOT have had their party outside. If they didn't want the people in their house they could have rented a place that was private.

However, the even looked fun. And those up in arms over Kate's exasperating, doesn't have kids that age. That's my face all the time. Sure she may be hamming it up for the camera. But if you were Kate, your child was having a fit, and everyone's watching you? Yeah, I would try to make light of it and move on. I mean, what kiddie party have you been to with at least 1 meltdown?

Jon was wearing his wedding ring. I hope that means something. Also happy to see the issues with the bodyguard were ridiculous unlike all that Jodi said about it. With that and the "secret contract" I have no belief for anything she says.

Tired said...

mkb77 said I tell you what, the fact that Kate or Jon can put one foot in front of the other let alone do it in public is amazing after the firestorm they have been through.It's because their getting paid....Duh! Just like some posters in this forum have felt that J&K are doing nothing wrong with getting paid for doing the show and all that is associated with it (promos, book signings, speaking engagements). In that same token, they are doing what they are getting paid to do. To show you themselves and their children's lives on TV, regardless of what "firestorm" is surrounding them. They sound like great little worker bees to me!

Anya said...

Tired said...In that same token, they are doing what they are getting paid to do. To show you themselves and their children's lives on TV, regardless of what "firestorm" is surrounding them. They sound like great little worker bees to me!

Ok, you have explained their motivation in going forward. Understood.

Let's remember that they are human beings , however, and not "worker bees." To the extent that many of us have expressed concern for their situation, I think it derives from basic human empathy.

Laura said...

I saw the Just jared photos of Kate and kids at Party City and Steve was with them. I thought that was a little odd she needed a bodyguard to go pinata shopping.OF COURSE the body guard had to be there when Kate & the kids went to shopping at Party City! With all the tabloid interest in them, they need the security more than ever! Kate was there with all 8 of the kids..., if no bodyguard was present I'd actually look at that as very unsafe for the whole family. Until this media frenzy dies down, bodyguards are very important. There are some crazy sick people out there!

Guinevere said...

Let's remember that they are human beings , however, and not "worker bees." To the extent that many of us have expressed concern for their situation, I think it derives from basic human empathy.I wish I agreed. I think some of the concern for the family is empathetic and genuine, but I think a lot of it is very phony. Some people seem to derive pleasure from viewing the suffering of others. So even in instances where there is no obvious suffering, posters will come up with tortured scenarios about how "miserable" this child or that looks, so they can cluck their "those poor children" mantra.

Those of us who really are capable of empathy are of course concerned about the Gosselins' recent troubles and the effect it might have on the kids, but we don't overstate the case by creating suffering out of whole cloth or greatly exaggerating the effect that perfectly common occurences like divorce might have on them. (This is not to say that a divorce would not be a sad and traumatic event for the kids; just that it's not something that means that their lives are irrevocably destroyed. Just like all of the other scandals that the haters have manufactured in their minds so they could declare the Gosselin kids ruined.)

Theresa said...

...we are not totally privy to what J&K are actually doing regarding their relationship...they really might be working on it. It is very apparent no matter what the mistakes they have both made, they love their kids.

IMO, the way these kids interact with each other is proof enough that there has been a lot of love in their home. Adults might be able to fake it...kids...not too likely.

May 18, 2009 9:42 AM
Well said Trish. Well said. This is my whole belief on this family, all along, even before the latest rumours and media hunt.

People can't infer what's going on just from a picture or even what they see on the show.

IMO, I think Jon and Kate are working on their relationship. At least that is my hope.

Erin said...

Well said, Theresa, Guinevere and Anya. I see the Troika has returned. I have noted your absences last week or so and missed your enlightening comments. Glad to see you are all back together.

DoeZ said...

So Jodi and Kevin are attention-whoring again, claiming a secret marriage contract exists. Seriously, who in their right mind would believe such a thing exists? This isn't Passions or Melrose Place. People don't just draw up contracts with their lawyers about these kinds of things. Thanks, Jodi and Kevin, for multiplying the trash level of this situation by 100. But you're doing it for the kids, so it's ok! I truly think this ridiculous "marriage contract" thing draws attention to the level of ignorance and complete lack of common sense on the part of the haters. I'm not saying I even am a fan of the show, but c'mon, this goes beyond anything a normal person would even consider believing. I think the nutty hates are going to have a field day with this, which makes them look even nuttier and just, well, stupid in my opinion.

marie said...

I can't believe that some people on here think that is okay for the kids. The kids will not be 5 forever. They along with the twins will read one day everything that was said about their parents and their family. It does and will affect them in the future. It is not okay for a family to have pretend fun get togethers for the sake of TV cameras and money. TLC is wrong and kate and jon are wrong. What are the IQ's of these two?

Rachel107 said...

Those of us who really are capable of empathy are of course concerned about the Gosselins' recent troubles and the effect it might have on the kids, but we don't overstate the case by creating suffering out of whole cloth or greatly exaggerating the effect that perfectly common occurences like divorce might have on them.I find this a horribly insulting comment. Ask any child psychologist and they will tell you in most cases that divorce does do irreperable harm to children, at least in the sense that a child will never be the same after the divorce. As with everything else in the Gosselins' lives, the grief and trauma are going to be compounded because they are in the public eye. Maybe it's "perfectly common," but it's still traumatic. Traffic deaths are also "perfectly common," but no less tragic because of how often they occur.

Also, IMHO, to say that most people in the Gosselin blogosphere are not "capable of empathy" is mean-sprited. I tend to think some bloggers' empathy is misguided, but I think they are capable of it. To say someone is not is to question their humanity. That's a low blow.

I'm not really sure where some of this vitriol is coming from, usually arguments are not as nasty here?

Victoria said...

They along with the twins will read one day everything that was said about their parents and their family. It does and will affect them in the future.

*****************
That shows why hate blogs are the first thing that'll mess up these kids in the first place. Seeing what has been written about their mom. I used to post at gwop, but all the terrible things people say about Kate, I didn't want to be assoicated with such an inhuman blog.

I don't think the party is fake. Why would you? Because supposedly Jon and Kate are apart?

It amazes me how much the bloggers can draw conclusions about a family they don't even know. Maybe I'm wearing Baby Mama blinders, but I really have a gut feeling, all that has been said on the blogs about this family, only a tiny bit of it was true.

DoeZ the nutty haters will have a field day with the latest Jodi and Kevin video. The Krieders should spell their name Cry-ders. Enough already Jodi and Kevin. Nobody's going to believe you. Except, the nutty haters.

Erin, I caught the snideness of your remark. I know those three are not one and the same. People on other blogs think so, but I can tell by their writing they are not. I think people who don't understand another's point of view, automatically go the snark response. Sad, really.

Illinois Mom said...

A Mom-

TLC promo even said "Jon and Kate are meeting face to face for the first time"- so I don't think the blogs are perputuating any lies.

"Only on blogs would that be called living a lie for a tv show."

And yea, sometimes a parent does miss an important date with their kids...doing a People photo shoot might be a good reason to you, but not for me.

RACHEL107-I agree with you 100% and also found the insuination that I was not empathetic to the Gosselin's a slam, but took it with a grain of salt.

I agree the tone has changed.

jan said...

Marie said:They along with the twins will read one day everything that was said about their parents and their family. It does and will affect them in the future.

Then, goes on to say:
"It is not okay for a family to have pretend fun get togethers for the sake of TV cameras and money. TLC is wrong and kate and jon are wrong. What are the IQ's of these two?"It seems you expressed concern for what the kids will read in the future and the effect it will have on them but then go on to slam their parents.

Anya said...

Erin said...Well said, Theresa, Guinevere and Anya. I see the Troika has returned. I have noted your absences last week or so and missed your enlightening comments. Glad to see you are all back together.

Erin, first of all, we have another Erin who posts here using her Google ID, so just for clarity's sake, please pick a name that distinguishes you. The other Erin is a valued poster and I don't want her posts to be confused with yours.

Oh and I am sorry you missed me! I'll try and be around more to "enlighten" you.

Anya said...

Victoria said...I don't think the party is fake. Why would you? Because supposedly Jon and Kate are apart?

Yeah, I don't get the whole the party is a fake party line being espoused by the detractors. I understand it was filmed. I understand those who have concerns about that, but it doesn't mean the party was a 'fake.'

We don't have any evidence that the kids were made to do anything special for the party other than bounce in the bouncy house, eat cake and play a pinata game.



It amazes me how much the bloggers can draw conclusions about a family they don't even know. Maybe I'm wearing Baby Mama blinders, but I really have a gut feeling, all that has been said on the blogs about this family, only a tiny bit of it was true.

I tend to agree with you. I do have to say that more of the rumors have come true than I thought, but I think that is because Jodi and Julie have been providing GWoP with gossip. Of course, they aren't really in the Gosselin's lives anymore so some of the stories they peddled (like the move to North Carolina) turned out to be completely false.

Tired said...

Anya said...Let's remember that they are human beings , however, and not "worker bees." To the extent that many of us have expressed concern for their situation, I think it derives from basic human empathy.I defended myself last night to this post and I'm not sure why it wasn't posted. Anyway I will try again, maybe it was too late.

Not sure why using the term "worker bees" makes me not empathetic to humans. Just because I don't sit here and go poor Kate and Jon....I hope they fix their marriage....blah blah blah. I do feel empathy, but not for celebrities on TV. Why should I? They look like they are still filming, no problems, and are making way more money than I ever would in my lifetime. I would rather reserve my "empathy" for my family and friends that have always been there for me. Not waste it on people who have no clue who I am.

Anya said...

Tired, I have no problem with your position. I too reserve more of my emotions for people who are important in my day-to-day life.

That doesn't preclude me from feeling some compassion for what the Gosselin's are going through.

What I don't understand is people who pour hate on J&K when they don't know them in real life. Such a waste. Not pointing fingers at you or anyone in particular, but it permeates the Gosselin blogosphere.

Anya said...

On a more positive note, the picture on the home page is beautiful. Thanks Nina Bell.

Mamacita said...

I don't know. I think I am done with them. If any of this is true, more and more stuff will continue to come out and we'll know. Other people will surely step up as well. Does TLC have confidentiality agreements with the workers of the show? They would have seen a lot if they can speak. And if it's true.

I just feel sad for the kiddos.

Guinevere said...

I find this a horribly insulting comment. Ask any child psychologist and they will tell you in most cases that divorce does do irreperable harm to children, at least in the sense that a child will never be the same after the divorce.Why would you find it insulting? I don't see what is insulting about saying that divorce is a fairly common occurence in our society. Yes, children of divorce do go through trauma. But life is traumatic.

I feel like the "other side" here has such a black and white view on childhood (well, on lots of things, but specifically on childhood). Either it is an idyllic gambol through flower-strewn meadows, with perfect parents who never yell, never fight with each other and never make mistakes, and classmates who never find anything to criticize in a child because that child has learned not to stand out in any way. Or it's a horrific, tragic wasteland that ruins one for life, because your parents weren't perfect, made mistakes, lost their tempers with you and denied you cupcakes on your non-birthday, and your classmates teased you. Can't there be any middle ground? Can't there be some acknowledgement that even "happy childhoods" have traumatic events that may leave emotional scars?

I'm not even speaking specifically about the Gosselins here - I can see why some people would believe that the traumas the Gosselin children may be experiencing are out of the ordinary (I don't know that I necessarily agree, but I can see the argument). But the hyperbole, the exclamations of "those POOR kids" - it's just too much for me. I can't take it seriously. It simply reminds me of the fact that there are SO many kids in the world (even just in this country) who have it SO much worse than the Gosselin kids - those that are truly abused. Beaten, molested, neglected kids.

That doesn't mean that people shouldn't have concern for the Gosselin kids - their visibility makes that inevitable, I think. But again, overstating the case on their supposed abject misery - when the kids themselves usually seem pretty happy - that just makes one look silly, IMO.

As with everything else in the Gosselins' lives, the grief and trauma are going to be compounded because they are in the public eye. Maybe it's "perfectly common," but it's still traumatic. Traffic deaths are also "perfectly common," but no less tragic because of how often they occur.I acknowledged that in the part of my post that you chose not to quote. I would not say that death and divorce are comparable, in any case. Again, there is an issue of degree that some people seem not to understand or refuse to acknowledge.

Also, IMHO, to say that most people in the Gosselin blogosphere are not "capable of empathy" is mean-sprited. I tend to think some bloggers' empathy is misguided, but I think they are capable of it. To say someone is not is to question their humanity. That's a low blow. Well, to be precise, I said "a lot", not "most". But you're right, it was unkind of me to suggest that these women are incapable of empathy. What I should have said was that I think their empathy ("oh, those POOR kids!") is almost entirely false in this case. I suppose most of them are capable of it; they just choose not to exercise that capability. I find that with many moral issues one can make a choice between self-righteousness and empathy. And from what I've seen of these women, they pretty much always choose the former. I find it hard to believe that they are substantially different in other areas of their lives, but I suppose it's possible. But I don't think any of them are sociopathic (though many of them have lodged that accusation against Kate!). Not to put too fine a point on it, they are just bitches.

I'm not really sure where some of this vitriol is coming from, usually arguments are not as nasty here?I think there are a lot of people from another site posting (or possibly a few people posting under a lot of names; I don't know). I find that the level of vitriol is raised when we have such visitors. I don't feel angry or vitriolic towards anyone, but I'm going to call it as I see it. People don't feel the need to dance around their negative opinions of Kate Gosselin, yet some of them seem to get very offended when given similar treatment.

Anya said...

Erin, I have not published your latest post because of your attack on one of our regular posters. Please resubmit with the personal attacks taken out. If you have general observations/concerns about some of the postings, that is one thing, but we not going to publish posts that specifically denounce another poster.

Also, I never said "Erin" wasn't your real name. My point is we would appreciate you differeniating yourself from our other "Erin." There are lots of ways to do this - Erin in Someplace, ErinT, etc.

Saint said...

Another installment of the Kreider's video is up. In conclusion: there is nothing real about reality TV (thanks!) The marriage is bad but the kids don't know about it yet. Or they didn't. But maybe now they will. Happy Birthday tups,
Love, Aunt Jodi and Uncle Kevin.

Illinois Mom said...

What I don't understand is people who pour hate on J&K when they don't know them in real life. Such a waste. Not pointing fingers at you or anyone in particular, but it permeates the Gosselin blogosphere.

May 19, 2009 10:47 AM

Anya,
I agree with what you are saying. I know there are some who may call me a "hater" which I find as mature as the whole KON names. I think a lot of people get caught up in the nicknames and take insult to them. I for one don't like to be called a hater, simply because I do not hate anyone, I have sorrow in my heart for Jon and Kate and I still dislike them.
I think you can have empathy for them and still dislike them.

As for the "vitrol", I have not seen it here for days. Of course I don't see what is coming in on your end.

I can see where people can get annoyed with fellow bloggers who can be long winded and specious with there words, but you know what, we aren't gonna please everyone.

As long as someone, anyone isn't writing to just get a "rise" and are being true and honest in their words with respect, than I am good with that.

These are just my thoughts and not directed to anyone in particular.

SofiesHouse said...

I used to post at GWOP (I'm embarassed to admit that actually) and stopped recently because of the Jodi and Kevin stuff. It's almost as if the people who post there want awful things to happen to the family. They love all this drama. They don't give an iota about the kids. And really, the kids are cute and I hope they have nice lives. But I don't "care" about them. I don't mean that to come off as badly as it probably sounds. But to those who are "heartbroken" for the kids, I suggest taking your obsession level down a few notches. I am heartbroken when a plane crashes or a young person dies in a tragic accident. There's a difference.

The self righteousness on GWOP is amazing. I think someone posted this here before, but it's a situation of "You're either with us or you're against us." Guess what, GWOP, this isn't 9-11 and you're not George Bush making a speach to a bunch of fire fighters. There are other opinions in the world, and your version of the TRUTH (what the hell is that anyhow that they write that in caps all the time) does not match mine (which, if you want the TRUTH, makes it an opinion).

I hate coming on here preaching about GWOP. I'm just fed up with them. And when the show ends (as all shows do), they'll just find something else to harp on. It reflects their lives in general. And misery loves company.

NannyofTwins said...

"I find this a horribly insulting comment. Ask any child psychologist and they will tell you in most cases that divorce does do irreperable harm to children, at least in the sense that a child will never be the same after the divorce"

It is disturbing to me that so many people see divorce as doing irreperable harm to children. Of course the child(ren) won't be the same after the divorce, but did you ever think that maybe the child(ren) would be BETTER after the divorce not always worse?
I personally, think it would be much better for a child to have divorced parents who are happy compared to parents who are staying together "just for the kids" therefore being unhappy (don't think kids don't see this).

I'm not saying divorce is a good thing but I think that sometimes staying together is not always a good thing either.

SchmeckyGirl said...

I love how everyone puts a spin on the pics and the entire situation to fit their view of Kate and Jon, etc. What interesting reading. I love how some use the pics to prove what horrible parents they are while others use them to prove the opposite. I think the pics can be taken a million ways and as strong as our opinions are they are just that... opinions.

Hopefully the show will put some light on the matter.

I do however, think that Jon and Kate have been putting up an act for a while and I look forward to their supposedly addressing everything on Monday night.

I adore those kids and I for one will be watching...

I really hope this family does a 180 and starts to focus on being a family again and stop with all the speaking engagements and late nights out, etc. It is making them both look like terrible parents. Their priority should be their children. One or two days away does not make a bad parent, but 20 days away out of 30? Ridiculous.

They have the means to take time off from galavanting around and to start spending quality time together. Hopefully they can work it out... for the sake of their children. If it weren't for the kids I would think they were better off without each other. Kate is selfish and Jon is miserable. (It was obvious from the interview in the finale of season 4.) Those poor kids.

Beatrice said...

Some posters said Kate needed a bodyguard pinata shopping because of all the paparazzi following her around. I think the paparazzi are following her every move to get photos of her with Steve the bodyguard. If there were a different guard on the case I don't think there would be quite the interest.

Momof2 said...

Nothing to contribute today...LOL..I was just popping in to say I hope everyone is having a nice day!

Rachel107 said...

Nanny of Twins...I completely agree with you, they are most certainly cases where divorce is a better option. My husband's parents stayed together for 10 years too long, and he said they never said a kind word to each other for that entire time! They both purposely found work out-of-state and he had to live with his newly-married sister for most of his senior year in high school. Divorce can definitely be a better option.....SOMETIMES.

I guess my bigger point with my post was that as much as Guin can't understand the people that think the Gosslin kids' lives are so awful, I can't understand the people that think they have it so great. Yeah, they will never want for any material thing. But they still have a pretty rotten deal. Their parents, despite everything they say in their PR statements, put them somewhere between 10th and last on the priority list, after bar hopping, new cars, salon trips, People interviews, etc. I think that sucks for them. Just trying to be honest here. Yeah, they could have it worse, no denying, but they could have it a lot better.

themrs said...

for the record, kate must have been in NY giving the people interview on sat of mother's day weekend. on sunday is when she was photographed buying the cake and going tanning in their hometown. i don't care when they celebrate the tups birthday, but the delay was not due to work traveling. she was in town. that is the same day jon was photographed at the house outside picking flowers with the kids.

Rachel107 said...

Why would you find it insulting? I don't see what is insulting about saying that divorce is a fairly common occurence in our society. Yes, children of divorce do go through trauma. But life is traumatic.
Guin, you are much better at crafting your arguments than I am, and I respect that your opinion differs from mine, usually all of the time. But I simply felt that your earlier comment about divorce belittled the harm done to the children of divorce. As I said in an earlier post (don't know yet if it was approved), I know from experience that sometimes divorce is the better option, but it still sucks for the kids. And it is comparable to a death, because children do mourn the loss of one of their parents in their daily lives.

On another note, I've seen a lot of comments to the effect of, "if you hate them so much, stop watching the show!" I don't hate anyone, but I certainly am not a fan of Jon or Kate. I have not watched the show since the Phillies episode (World Bleepin' Champions!). I don't even know why I still follow on the blogs, but I do. But I certainly don't have to defend that decision to people commenting on the same blog. To be honest, I hope everyone stops watching. The family will see royalty checks from this cash cow for years to come. There is no valid reason to keep filming.

Guinevere said...

RACHEL107-I agree with you 100% and also found the insuination that I was not empathetic to the Gosselin's a slam, but took it with a grain of salt. Why in the world would you assume I was talking about you? I didn't name anyone. Maybe you have a guilty conscience. I have no idea why you would assume I was speaking about you otherwise.

Guinevere said...

Not sure why using the term "worker bees" makes me not empathetic to humans. Just because I don't sit here and go poor Kate and Jon....I hope they fix their marriage....blah blah blah. I do feel empathy, but not for celebrities on TV. Why should I?If you don't understand why you should have empathy, or see it as something that must be earned rather than freely given, then I don't know what to tell you.

For me, the question should never be "why?" should one show empathy and compassion, but "why not?"

Anya said...

Hi Momof2. Nice of you to stop by! Hope your day is going well as well. I think we all looking forward to a nice Memorial Day weekend.

TheMrs. I am still confused on the interview timeline. I thought it was decided the People interview must have occured on the Friday, 5/8? Wasn't Kate in AK at a Sam's Club on Saturday, 5/9? Even I thought the AK appearance was ill-timed with the kid's birthday and Mother's Day the next day, but it being the day before Mother's Day, maybe it was thought it was too good an opportunity to pass by as the book was clearly being marketed around Mother's Day.

In any case, I am still confused as to when the interview took place. Thursday? Friday? Saturday morning before she left for AK?

I don't know why I care either!
:-)

Rachel107 said...

Just want to thank everyone here for giving me a place to say what I feel without giving me too much grief about it!

Saint said...

Three possible reasons why the birthday party was delayed:

Maybe they celebrated Mother's Day on Mother's Day and the tups' birthday a week later to have two separate celebrations? Lots of moms do something special for themselves on Mother's Day...tanning would seem to fit that mold.

Maybe they celebrated the tups' birthday with a family cake at home privately on Sunday and a big party with cameras/school friends the following weekend?

Or maybe they delayed the party so that they could celebrate with their friends, too? I imagine their friends didn't want to go to a party on Mother's Day because they had their own mothers to celebrate with that day?

Nina Bell said...

I would just like to compliment Anya on doing a great job on moderating the last couple of days.

Also, I just noticed that I changed the background color behind the posts on the home page to a off yellow or gold. Does that work for everyone or should I change it back? Not sure how that happened when I changed the header.

Guinevere said...

I personally, think it would be much better for a child to have divorced parents who are happy compared to parents who are staying together "just for the kids" therefore being unhappy (don't think kids don't see this). I completely agree with this.

I guess my bigger point with my post was that as much as Guin can't understand the people that think the Gosslin kids' lives are so awful, I can't understand the people that think they have it so great.I do understand peoples' concerns, just not the level to which they take them. And I have never or almost never seen anyone here say that the Gosselin kids have it "so great". I think they have some challenges ahead, challenges brought on by fame. I don't think they have the best parents in the world. I just don't think they are the worst parents in the world. I think like most people they fall somewhere in the middle.

I don't know if their circumstances, on the whole, are much better or much worse than they would've been without the show. There are things that I think would probably be better and things that would probably be worse. I don't have a crystal ball and don't pretend to know what the future holds or where alternative paths may have led the family. I distrust people who speak in absolutes and insist that they can predict the future.

But I simply felt that your earlier comment about divorce belittled the harm done to the children of divorce...And it is comparable to a death, because children do mourn the loss of one of their parents in their daily lives.It wasn't intended to belittle it. But since I have been watching the show and reading the blogs I've heard almost daily about how the Gosselin childrens' lives are "ruined" and that they will never have any success or happiness. This started long before the divorce issue even came up. A hundred things that we've seen on the show, from "cupcakegate" on down, have been trumpeted as causing irreparable psychological harm to the kids. So it's hard for me not to view the pearl-clutching over a potential divorce without cynicism.

If I were the type to get insulted easily, I might be a bit insulted at the divorce=death comparison. I get what you're trying to say, but as someone who experienced parental divorce and the death of both parents, well, there's really no comparison (for me). Divorce is painful, but death is death. You can't speak to that person, can't tell them that you love them, can't be told that you are loved in return. Ever. Anything short of that, there is always hope; the loss is not permanent in the same way.

Anya said...

Thanks, Pam. :-)

I personally like the gold. It differentiates the post area from the side bar. Looks good.

Saint-perceptive thoughts, as usual from you.

SofiesHouse-rock on. Your post was spot on IMO.

Rachel107 - I have enjoyed your posts and think you have added a lot. Hope to see you continue to post.

MrsRef said...

Okay. Jon does inappropriate things. Kate says nasty stuff in public about him in People magazine. I can see their annoymosity on the last season of the show. Then they take the TLC publicity shot at the tups party like one big happy family. How confusing is that to these kids. They are indeed old enough to realize that something is not right in their household. If J&K truly believe the kids don't know, they are delusional. S

Saint, while I agree about the tups friends not wanting to share mother's day by going to a party, why can't they just have a party like normal kids without a camera filming their every move. This could have been moved to their massive acreage and not been the public spectecale it became. J&K are not doing right by those kids IMO.

texasmommy said...

Has anyone else seen the most recent video that Jodi and Kevin have posted on RadarOnline? The link was from Julie's post today(Truth Breeds Hatred website), "When a family becomes a business." IMO, Jodi and Kevin are even more damaging in this video than before.

I find all of this so very sad and so hard to watch. Being a "product of divorce" my heart goes out to those kids because no matter what happens in the end, it is something that affects children for a lifetime.

I know that this is probably an "over the top" suggestion, but since Jon and Kate are so "famous"...willingly or not...maybe they should go back to Dr. Phil privately and have him help them try to salvage what they can before it's too late.
I would like to think that there is hope for them, but long ago Dr. Phil said something along these lines..."You can predict with 100% accuracy whether a marriage is going to fail or survive by watching the way the couple fights. If they use disrespect and tear each other down, that is not a good sign at all."
I've heard "radio talk shows" joking about getting "Team Kate" or "Team Jon" t-shirts. If anything, the shirts should read "Team Eight!"

A Mom-ynous said...

""Only on blogs would that be called living a lie for a tv show."

And yea, sometimes a parent does miss an important date with their kids...doing a People photo shoot might be a good reason to you, but not for me.""

My husband is missing an important date for a cool job related opportunity.

Did he HAVE to go this time--no. But it was convenient for work-related purposes.

I know that folks like to pretend that Kate doesn't "work"--but promotional efforts are work.

Maybe she had a regular interview/photo shoot with people and due to the nature of events, it expanded into a cover article.

People is pretty good about keeping up with the news both regular and entertainment news and while they do plan cover articles as best they can, they will make editorial decisions for a story.

(to some this would be called "cashing in"--but I find People to actually be responsible in their journalism when it comes to the entertainment field and have always had such disdain for that term as well as "exploit". Both are overused to the point of really--meaning nothing.)


The "lie" that I was referring to--was the general taping of the Gosselins which you have been more than vocal isn't real.

It's like the folks who complain that Survivor isn't "reality". Well of course, it isn't like every day folks decide--hey, I'll go live on an island in my skivvies and see if I can win a million dollars.

I find the complaints to be nothing more than chatter mostly I presume because these are not true documentaries but rather, are a combination of documentary (for the true events that the show did not create) and scripted realism--creating scenarios for the real people to interact and react in.

You'll get no argument from me that the show is quite contrived on several levels as they have an abundance of organized moments that are clearly related to the show. But I don't consider it a lie.

And I don't consider Jon and Kate to be liars to their public who for some unknown reason must have missed a few episodes in the past 5 seasons and though them to be practically perfect in every way when clearly they are not and have never been.

A Mom-ynous said...

"TLC promo even said "Jon and Kate are meeting face to face for the first time"- so I don't think the blogs are perputuating any lies."

I'm not following...

Folks are up in arms b/c Jon and Kate are not a perfect happy couple but played one on tv...yet their past 4 years of episodes it is quite obvious that there was often discord and lack of harmony.

The last couple of episodes of last season had some split interviews, the last show revealed very clearly that something was up even if Jon and Kate were beating around the bush about it

(seriously--not an easy subject to address and I wouldn't expect anything more of them at that moment given the timing of the taping/showing of that episode).


Then the show--had a break. The season ended--we haven't had any new shows in several months.

Where's the part where they lied to their public?

There was talk that taping was going on--

Was there a press release that the perfect harmonious Gosselin couple were smooching when Emeril came over?

I'm still trying to find the evidence that for this series of recent events that they were being dishonest.

Despite everything--they are still the parents of sextuplets, aren't they. Or are we awaiting the Expose in The National Enquirer to be told that Kate's pregnancy was a hoax.

A Mom-ynous said...

"I would rather reserve my "empathy" for my family and friends that have always been there for me. Not waste it on people who have no clue who I am."

That's actually rather sad.

Maybe I am reading it wrong, but you really could not have empathy beyond those people you know?

I don't expect you to sob over Jon and Kate's break-up (Lord knows I am not)--

But empathy is about realizing what it is to be like in someone else's shoes and has little to do with whether or not they know you and can check you on their empathy list.


There's plenty of love and empathy to go around--it is when we close our hearts that we think there is not enough.

(again--I am simply interpreting your post and if I read it wrong I do apologize. Also--to reiterate, I don't expect you to fawn over Jon and Kate but fine your remarks rather harsh just b/c they do not know you.)

I felt empathy for the passengers that crashed into the Hudson. Not one of them will ever know.

But that isn't the point of empathy (or compassion).

MrsRef said...

Dr. Phil is a fake. A real marriage counselor or a pastor may be of some assistance but not good old Dr. Phil. I am actually surprised he has gotten involved in this somehow. I totally disagree that those kids don't know what is going on. I have VIVID memories of my parents fighting when I was 4 and 5 years old. Not every fight but a couple hum-dingers. As for the promo of facing each other for the first time, they are shown together on TLC's own website smiling away with their whitened teeth. Is that just a tad misleading?

A Mom-ynous said...

Sort of related from way out in left field...but on this comment:

"They have the means to take time off from galavanting around and to start spending quality time together."

I remember Loretta and Doolittle Lynn (now there was a love/hate relationship).

Now while Jon and Kate did not start of with such impoverished beginnings, I am wondering if the celebrity is being treated the same.

Loretta Lynn drove herself to exhaustion (and prescription drug use to deal with said exhaustion) b/c she was working so much. But the Lynns didn't think they could stop. They couldn't stop and smell the roses, b/c they always felt the threat of losing it all and going back to their extremely humble beginnings.

Today--she has financial issues (clearly overspent along the way, but still!)

Why Jon and KAte are not slowing down to smell the roses and be in peace with their now very well cared for and well housed family, God only knows.

But perhaps--there is a bit of fear of going back to having absolutley nothng and struggling.

Some may call it greed--but the term "workaholic" didn't just appear one day b/c someone was greedy and wanted everything.

There are people who have fear that they will no longer draw a paycheck and no longer have money.

Not all celebrities get all blinged out in their mega mansion and fleet of cars.

I know Jon and Kate have a nice home--Jon got a sports car--they are enjoying some things.

But it is PLAUSIBLE (love that mythbusters) that they could be afraid to lose it all and opt in one way or another to not slow down.

It doesn't make them horrible people if that is the case.

Just a thought to toss out there.

shawna said...

themrs said...
for the record, kate must have been in NY giving the people interview on sat of mother's day weekend. on sunday is when she was photographed buying the cake and going tanning in their hometown. i don't care when they celebrate the tups birthday, but the delay was not due to work traveling. she was in town. that is the same day jon was photographed at the house outside picking flowers with the kids.


.....................

Then the "most" reputable "gossip" magazine must have been lying.

A Mom-ynous said...

"Then they take the TLC publicity shot at the tups party like one big happy family. How confusing is that to these kids"

Why does it have to be confusing to the kids?

I think it would suck to expect the parents to have a pissy attitude around their chidren to accurately convey the state of their marriage.

It seems rather odd to expect them to behave petulant and not joyful as they celebrate their beloved children.

In fact I think it is honorable when parents put aside whatever differences, arguments, problems they have and celebrate that these little beans they created are growing up into little people.

(This is not to insinuate the kids are not human, but rather the joy that I have felt as my once 100% dependent babies grown in their indepence from me.)

I think it would be more confusing if a child had an unhappy parent there to honor the birthday.

5 yo's thought: "Mommy and daddy are here for my birthday, but they are sad. Are they sad for me? I must have done something wrong."

Kaitlin said...

MrsRef,

Right you are. Dr. Phil is a fake. I don't think he even has a license to practice anymore.

I also think that the Gosselin children are well aware of what's going on. If Jon is sleeping above the garage and not in the master suite with Kate, the kids know that I'm sure. Kids are not dumb. The tups are at the age now where they are well aware of what's happening around them. The kids also hear Kate putting Jon down.

I just hope and pray that Jon and Kate do the right thing for the childrens sake.

A Mom-ynous said...

Question: Why are folks obsessing so much over Kate's schedule?

Why does it really matter? It is not proof that she is a poor mother (or poor wife).

Every time I see postings of either scheduled events or a rehash of her recent events to figure out how she could be a mom...

It actually disgusts me. Not sure why as I am certainly not taking it personally.

But it is moments like this where I think "the public" crosses the line with public figures thinking they have the rights to their entire private lines. It is very stalker like. Very disturbing.

I'm not sure what its purpose is at all. It is neither empathetic or compasionate--and it serves no positive purpose.

rain88 said...

I think some of the concern for the family is empathetic and genuine, but I think a lot of it is very phony. Some people seem to derive pleasure from viewing the suffering of others. So even in instances where there is no obvious suffering, posters will come up with tortured scenarios about how "miserable" this child or that looks, so they can cluck their "those poor children" mantra.So the phony concern is only by those that disagree with your viewpoint? There is a possibility that this situation Jon and Kate is in is making the children miserable. You can't know and neither can I. But because I think they might be miserable with all that's happened doesn't make my opinion "phony concern".

I also don't see a lot of pleasure derived from any of this on any of the blogs/boards.

Saint said...

Saint, while I agree about the tups friends not wanting to share mother's day by going to a party, why can't they just have a party like normal kids without a camera filming their every move. MrsRef, my post addressed the timing of the party, not the location or the filming. I'm not all that supportive of filming these kids anyway, so your suggestion suits me just fine. Though, I also see NOTHING wrong with a party that isn't at home, since I am a good mother and have done that at least three times I can remember, and I have a nice big property, too.

I just wanted to give legitimate reasons why a party with school friends might be delayed if the actual birthday is another holiday. Also, I worked on my daughter's birthday this year, and she went to school, so this "not being home on the day before the birthday" is a little annoying to me.

I'm still annoyed about the "things us mothers do" (or whatever she said) that Jodi accused Kate of not doing, as if it's a violation of good motherhood to get outside help for household chores. My teens do most of the laundry at our house. I have family and friends who hire cleaning people (that's right, they're rich,) and I know two people who clean homes for a living and are happy to do honest work for honest pay.

***sarcasm alert***So Kate and Jon had a big party for their kids at a waterpark a week after the birthday!!! And Kate gave an INTERVIEW two days before!!! Can you believe how horrible that is???

rain88 said...

I forgot to add, Guin, I know you didn't mention me by name in your post but I am someone that believes "those poor kids" when I see what is happening right now with their parents.

Saint said...

Then the "most" reputable "gossip" magazine must have been lying.Shawna, what's the most reputable gossip magazine? Do you mean People? That article said she was sitting in Manhattan hotel suite this "Mother's Day weekend." Weekends start Friday and end Sunday, generally. Mother's Day is Sunday. That leaves Friday or Saturday for the interview, as Anya said. I think themrs is right. Photos put her home on Mother's Day. And People isn't lying.

Kaitlin said...

Rain88,

You dog is so cute. What kind of dog is he/she?

MrsRef said...

Saint: Sorry, I did get your point about not having a party on an actual birthday. That said, I believe that it is a parents responsibility to protect their children. Why on earth would these two subject those children to cameras and prying eyes. Do J&K need this much attention focused on their family during this time?

Linda said...

A-mom,

I'm in agreement with you . . . how can viewers criticize J&K for their poor relationship while they simultaneously say that their portrayal to the public that they are a happy family is a sham?

To me, it is the same nonsense that I observe about K portraying herself as "doing it all" while we watch episode after episode of her interviewing helpers, cleaning persons, etc.

Saint said...

Why on earth would these two subject those children to cameras and prying eyes. Do J&K need this much attention focused on their family during this time?We agree on this Mrs Ref. I would have lost my mind by now. I know why it all started; I don't understand why it continues. I understand the position they were in, at first, with all the little ones, no job (for whatever reason...it doesn't even matter) and no income. I think I might have traded in all the volunteers and extra help for the money and cameras, since neither is appealing and one pays. But I doubt I could have tolerated the intrusion beyond the first year.

I don't know how the money worked out, though. I'm also not so sure a lot of this is not media manipulation. The timing is SO suspect. I am cynical about reality TV.

I have seen the Gosselins criticized for filming private moments and showing them to thousands. I support that criticism. But I have also seen them criticized for so many other things that bother me. I think they have the right to work at public speaking, write and promote books, speak in Christian churches, and endorse commercial products. I do not think anyone should be trying to interfere with their livelihood that way. I think they should be able to celebrate their children's birthdays when and where they want, hire outside help for whatever task they want, and even occasionally eat pizza without being labelled liars. Their family members should not be discussing (and getting paid for it?) what he said or she said about their marital problems. They should be allowed to worship where and when they see fit, get a drink in a bar, post bible quotes on a bathroom mirror, and skip blessing their meals without having their Christianity questioned. The mother should be allowed to work without being accused of being a bad mother. And I cannot pretend that just because I see a child crying that she has a miserable life, nor will I ignore the hours of happy, smiling kids I see in that family and label their lives ruined. All JMO.

Tired said...

A-Mom said..."I would rather reserve my "empathy" for my family and friends that have always been there for me. Not waste it on people who have no clue who I am."

That's actually rather sad.

Maybe I am reading it wrong, but you really could not have empathy beyond those people you know?

I don't expect you to sob over Jon and Kate's break-up (Lord knows I am not)--
----------------------
You read way to much into it. I only meant that statement in relation to Jon and Kate, and I thought that went without saying, since all that has been discussed on this post is Jon & Kate, plus kids. And NO, I don't feel sorry for Jon and Kate and their marriage even if it was bad because frankly I'm not that invested in the show or their lives. I came on here out of curiosity because this is all hyped up in the media and I wanted to read differeing points of view. IMO, There are other things out there that are worse than a couple of celebrity parents with a problematic marriage. Like a plane crash that kills all the passengers.

Plane crash victims and J&K's marriage trouble are not even in the same galaxy.

A-Mom said....That's actually rather sad.It really isn't. I'm totally fine with it. Don't waste your empathy on me, as I'm sure there are others that need it more.

texasmommy said...

"Dr. Phil is a fake. A real marriage counselor or a pastor may be of some assistance but not good old Dr. Phil. I am actually surprised he has gotten involved in this somehow."

Mrs.Ref, I wrote the original post about Dr.Phil and I guess the point I was trying to make was that since they have sought his advice in the past and since this is a very PUBLIC scenario, it appears that THEY trust him. And if that is the case, perhaps his "no nonsense approach" could direct them privately to a counselor or clergy in their area to counsel them.
I, too, am surprised that he would involve himself with them, but we live in a crazy world.
Bottom line is that IMO, whatever can be salvaged, needs to be at least ATTEMPTED for the sake of those 8 babies.
I can only wish them the very best!

MrsRef said...

IF this is media manipulation and the Gosselins are allowing this and participating it is sick, sick sick. There is some speculation that this whole thing is part of a publicity blitz. This certainly would go against the christian values that they proport to have. The gigs up Gosselins.

Rachel107 said...

I believe Blue Falls Grove is a private park. I looked at it years ago as a wedding reception option. If I remember correctly, you have to go past a ticket counter, so the paparazzi would have either snuck in or paid to enter.

Also, on ET last night, the anchor mentioned that production was "furiously working on re-shoots" or some such gobbledeegook. How is this reality??? Real life doesn't get "re-shoots." Ugh--I guess it's stuff like this that makes me think we've all been duped for a while into thinking any of it is real. I don't know if I believe Jodi & Kevin, I certainly don't understand why they went to Radaronline to spill the beans, but I think Jon and Kate have been lying to us about much of their lives for awhile. Just don't get it.

Anya--thanks for your kind words! I don't get a lot of time online, so I usually don't comment because I spend so much time playing catch-up on the previous comments. But I'm glad if I can add something.

Guin--I hope you don't think I'm being contentious just for the sake of it. I can completely appreciate where you are coming from. And I totally get that divorce does not equal death. I guess I wanted to make the point that there is grief for something lost in each case. I was counseled to mourn a divorce in much the same way as a death, because if I didn't, the grief/pain could come back and bite me later. But you're right in that death is much more painful in its finality. Believe me, I know, unfortunately.

Illinois Mom said...

Texas Mommy,

They had something to "gain" from Dr. Phil.

I personally don't think Jon and Kate should go public with their marriage counseling.

Saint said...

IF this is media manipulation and the Gosselins are allowing this and participating it is sick, sick sick. Oh, Mrs. Ref we agree on that. I don't care if it were just adults, but with kids involved, it would be very ugly, IMO.

Casey said...

Kate had stated that she and Jon are dealing with their problems privately. Why is she then in a lot of magazines talking about the problems? How fans still defend her is amazing.

Quiltart said...

Casey said...

Kate had stated that she and Jon are dealing with their problems privately. Why is she then in a lot of magazines talking about the problems? How fans still defend her is amazing.
In light of the incredible amount of calculated negative publicity being thrown at the Gosselins, especially that of Jodi and Kevin, I think it's a no brainer that Kate had to say something. At least she did it through a reputable source, like People, instead of Radar online or some of the other dirty tabloids being fed tidbits by the Gosselin detractors.

ChinaMomof4 said...

texasmomy said:
I, too, am surprised that he [Dr. Phil] would involve himself with them, but we live in a crazy world.

Hey, Dr. Phil got involved with Britney Spears when she was in the hospital, remember! J&K seem to be right up his alley.

Casey said...

I believe Kate has been in other magazines besides People with her story. She and Jon need to put their kids well-being first and not their own selfish desires.

I am glad people close to the situation are speaking out, and I am not just talking about Jodi and Kevin.

bigsis88 said...

Quiltart and Casey,

I agree with both of you. While I think the negative publicity basically forced Kate to say something, I think it would have been more beneficial if she had made a statement after things were more defined/decided. OP mentioned that she has implied that she believes Jon didn't cheat in some interviews and admitted she's not sure in others, etc. I really don't think that's a piece of information that needs to be shared, but my point is that she started talking without really knowing what she wanted to say/what needed to be said. A statement made later, maybe after they'd decided whether to work on their marriage or not, would've left less room for speculation and for outsiders (like Kevin and Jodi) to throw in their 2 cents. When all of the media blitz first appeared I felt we were getting Twitter-like updates on the state of their marriage (3:05-We are working on it.; 3:45-It's over!; 4:30-Secret contract!; etc.) and that was really unnecessary and contradicted Kate's spoken desire to work on it privately IMO.

Techymum said...

Replying to AMOM-ynomous:
"I will trust that the Sextuplets shouldn't suffer any long term damage from this unless some well meaning folks remind them relentlessly for the next several decades that their parents were horrible for doing such a gastly thing

Would you be willing to say this in person to the surviving Dionne Quintuplets?

kelly_luvs_it said...

BabyMama said: "Jon was wearing his wedding ring. I hope that means something."
******************************
Yes - it means they were filming the show.

Victoria said...

kelly_luvs_it said...
BabyMama said: "Jon was wearing his wedding ring. I hope that means something."
******************************
Yes - it means they were filming the show.

May 23, 2009 7:14 AM
Kelly, I believe the Gosselins are working on their marriage. I love how those who don't believe in working on a marriage are quick to snark on this couple and make the snide comments against them.

I give them credit for taking their vows seriously enough to working on them. btw, who cares what detractors like you think? Surely Kate doesn't as evidenced in any of her People magazine interviews and appearances.

Also, it's nobody's business but theirs.

kelly_luvs_it said...

Victoria said: "I love how those who don't believe in working on a marriage are quick to snark on this couple and make the snide comments against them."
**********************
Please reference where I said I didn't believe in working on a marriage.

Victoria said...

Kelly what I wrote was in reference to your snideness of not knowing what the Gosselins are doing. He's wearing his wedding ring because he obviously believes in his marriage vows. Your snide commment was that "they're filming" is insinuating that that's the only reason he's wearing it. I'm going to borrow a term that was on this blog a bit ago and that is a "backhanded swipe". You didn't come right out and say what you thought about working on a marriage, but you took a backhanded swipe referencing that Jon was only wearing it because you think that they're filming and that he's only wearing it for the "show" because they get paid.

If this is not the case, then tell us why you said such a snide remark?

kelly_luvs_it said...

Victoria said "then tell us why you said such a snide remark?"

I never said I "said such a snide remark". In this case, snide is in the eye of the beholder.

Then again, I don't consider Jon putting ON his wedding ring is a sign that he's "working on his marriage" anymore than I consider Jon taking OFF his wedding ring means he has given up on his marriage.

Victoria said...

You proved my point Kelly!

Talking in circles does't cover up your ignorance.

Lilsgirls said...

That shows why hate blogs are the first thing that'll mess up these kids in the first place.
____
No, their parents did that! How do you reconcile, for their children, that just 9 mos. ago, their parents were promising their love and devotion to each other and to be together forever, and now, mere months later, it blows up in the kids' faces! You don't think they will have trust issues with their parents? Think about it!

Valerie said...

No, their parents did that! How do you reconcile, for their children, that just 9 mos. ago, their parents were promising their love and devotion to each other and to be together forever, and now, mere months later, it blows up in the kids' faces! You don't think they will have trust issues with their parents? Think about it!

May 24, 2009 8:35 PM

*****************

I call it TLC capitalizing on the media frenzy. They know what great ratings they're going to get. They provoke it, too, with their promos. Jon and Kate face to face the first time? c'mon, that's pure media manipulation.

If J&K may have any say in the way a show is made, they may not have anything in terms of how TLC is marketing this hype. It's easy for TLC to say, "we support the family" and at the same time show promo after promo of Jon talking about how hard it is to be "just Jon, not Jon & Kate plus 8" and Kate talking about not crumbling down and will not die.

I predict they've done counseling (privately) and will continue the show. All the rumours from the past two months have just been set in motion for the premiere tonight. And, whatever problems the Gosselins had, may just have been really exaggerated for the public, in light of how rumours are started by the tabloids and their pictures.

TLC is a big exploiter of this family.

Trish said...

I thought the interview Jon just did on US Weekly was very telling. Not once did he, or Kate, mention the impact this may or may not have on their kids. Only that he didn't feel "so hot right now". I am not sure what that means but I do wonder if they are in such denial that they do not realize this will definitely have a negative impact on the children, if not immediaately, then in the future. There is no way it cannot.

Loriville said...

Just curious if you watched the premier last night and if any of your thoughts have changed about the picture? They were clearly not "ok" at the party and the picture was taken right after Kate ordered Jon to sit on the end and take off his sunglasses. At the end she said she was fearful that picture could be their last family picture. What I don't get is that there is no doubt there are big problems. She's angry, he's aloof and distant. Why oh why is she continuing on with this show? If her kids and family are her main priority and why she does everything she does, why would she continue knowing her kids are getting followed by papparazzi and her husband no longer wants to do the show. If by doing everything she does for thekids she means the money she is getting from the show and the books I am truly dissapointed. Kids don't need a mansion and lots of things, they need love and full time parents.

Guinevere said...

No, their parents did that! How do you reconcile, for their children, that just 9 mos. ago, their parents were promising their love and devotion to each other and to be together forever, and now, mere months later, it blows up in the kids' faces! You don't think they will have trust issues with their parents? Think about it!I think it's weird, but I don't think the Gosselins are the first people in the history of marriage to have problems soon after renewing vows. I mean, I know of celebrities who split soon after they married for the first time. It always does seem strange, because you wonder what the people were thinking. But it happens.

Will the kids have trust issues if J&K divorce after Kate promised they would be together forever? Maybe. Most kids learn at one point or another that their parents are fallible.